Interview: Thorous (Deteriorate)

Deteriorate (Pennsylvania, USA) got their start as a band solidly and unmistakenly death metal of the violent American variety. Their debut Rotting in Hell, one of the premier domestic outputs of the infamous JL America label, broke little ground, but nonetheless manages to get spins from old-timers who have long appreciated its compact composition and caustic delivery. Not long after this sleeper semi-classic the band abandoned their death metal pursuits in favor of a faster, more melodic and hybridized style in line with the rising popularity of the European black metal of the day.

Interview from Heidenlarm e-zine #1.

Deteriorate Rotting in Hell came out near the end of the death metal boom, right before black metal became predominant in the eyes of many listeners. What was it like at that time to contemplate the styles in which you could compose?

Personally I was seriously into black metal since the begining…in fact if you noticed the change in styles between “Rotting in Hell” and “Gather the nebbish/The Senectuous Entrance” you can see my influences shining through out the whole cd; I wrote nearly half of the music on “Gather/Senectuous” around 1994…I was so saturated with old black/death metal like Venom, Bathory, Eestruction, Voivod, Slayer, Sodom, Kreator that it just flowed naturally in any riffs I would be writing…I mean I saw Kreator’s first US tour[I believe] at City Gardens in Trenton NJ with Voivod I think it was “Pleasure to Kill/Killing Technology” tour – this fucking show was so fucking brutal, I was blown the fuck away, it still to this day had to have been the most influential moment in my life, as I watched them play flawlessly I said to myself that’s what I want to do and I’m going to do whatever it takes to get there…so I played everyday for years until I was 17 formed my first band it was called “randomdraw” a hardcore/metal band we sounded like cromags vs rage against the machine…anyway after a few years of other bands and stuff I joined Deteriorate which is a long story in itself!…so my goal with them was to take it to the next level get so into the music and just fucking go apeshit and I think it all worked out perfectly…..

It seems to me that death metal has always had two opposing sides, one of which emphasizes fast tremolo picking and relatively few emphatic pauses, while the other side uses muffled strumming and a morse code of pausing and pounding to spell out its riffs. What made you gravitate toward the faster metal side?

When I started playing guitar in ’82 I thought that metal had a missing element that hardcore bands seemed to emphasize on “speed”. So I started playing as fast as I could thinking that it would make me more talented as a player…so I would write these riffs and put them together with my younger brother Justin and we would play these blazing fast songs full of ‘squeals’ and violent solos like Slayer or Cryptic Slaughter…but after some time speed wasn’t good enough so I added into my style harmony&melody…I wanted something different say warmer tones, so I got into Malmsteen alot and Voivod, Black Sabbath, Ozzy, Motley Crue, Iron Maiden, Celtic Frost ‘morbid tales'[my favorite guitar sound ever], Exodus, Violence, Metallica, Megadeth, Bathory, Anvil Bitch, Dominance, Faith or Fear, Flotsam and Jetsam, Death & tons more…I started going to 2 to 3 shows a week it was so intense there were lines down the street; as I saw these bands perform in the early mid 80’s I was blown away it was so intense my world had become near perfect! At the same time I was extremely jealous, I thought to myself why can’t I do that? There was one reason why —drummers—there is such a shortage of quality drummers that could do blaast beats or grind or doublebass let alone afford a decent kit…I was so into technical metal that it made it even harder to find someone.

There were fewer people involved with death and black metal in that time, unlike the current scenario. What do you think are the differences in a musician’s experience between the two?

Nowadays its more open to all; the styles combined, there are a thousand times more muscicians that are dying to play…equipment is far more affordable and more directed towards metal hard rock players…the nu-metal styles are bringing more people to wards heavier music especially women! I always thought that if you could get women into your band then men would follow hence bringing your numbers at the door up at the club you’re playing…

What to you makes a series of chords and rhythms a “riff”?

I’m always looking for something different or catchy or “hook” riffs…riffs that make you say “hell yeah that rips” and your hair stands up on your whole body…or like in the 80s the introduction of the word “mosh”or “not” where anthrax introduced to me the true pit styles I actually went nuts at every show we all our own style of moshing or dancing,or the dive kings, we tried every kind of dive you could think of it was a contest to us to see how long you could stay on stage or how long you could wave ride…it was the best years of my life it was so fresh new different and the normal people didn’t even notice any of these bands we were such a minority back then, I was always saying in school that Metallica will be the biggest band ever and 10 years later I was damn near right…I was the only kid in my juniore high with an earring and a denim jacket with death metal patches all over it…

Fo you compose by riff assembly, or is there a pattern into which riffs fit first?

Actually I have an odd style of writing I usually number the riffs along with names for each part and write it all down,so if I forget I have notes…in Deteriorate I played bass but I wrote the riffs on my 7string and brought my guitar to practice where I showed them the riffs…my newer bands I play guitar and sing on almost everything…I write all the music and vocals and let my drummer mike trush write the drum parts…I usually write all the music in my head at work and then go home and play my ass off…

Many of your songs on Rotting in Hell preserved a casual but intense atmosphere of using little introduction and tearing into the material on hand immediately. Was this a reaction to the riff-salad-heavy metal songs of the time, which often took half of the song just to get cooking?

Actually I didn’t play anything on “Rotting,” although I was in the band months before the recording sessions, I was asked to play on “Rotting” but it didn’t feel right playing songs on a disc that I had no part in writing so I declined…if you asked me about “Gather/Senectuous” I would have to say they were flowing and melodic…
lyrically, the band also played at least two sides, having some “gore” topics and a fair number that could have been interpreted as more gothic, romantic or moribund.

What inspired the lyric writing on this album?

As far as “Gather the Nebbish,” I sang 3 songs and wrote a major part of the music, my lyrics were directed towards my hatred towards a society that hates people like me…I would first get into a raging pissed off mood then write the music then the lyrics would just kind of “bleed” to me,you know what I mean?..I went in the studio and basically freaked out in the vocal booth screaming my heart out jumping around like a fucking lunatic,..in fact 2 of the songs I sang on “Gather” came about on the spot, I did the vocals on one take not even rehearsing them once: Evaporated Battleground/Ode to a Mortal” my good friend Trevor Schaible donated those 2 sets of lyrics and I took them in the studio and ad libbed the songs it just so happened they came out pretty good in my opinion total chaos!!

After Rotting in Hell, Deteriorate took a break. What happened during this time?

We went through some member changes and more of my writing came into effect, we really spent a lot of time rehearsing doing shows and getting more professional about ourselves and we said to ourselves what can we do to make this band better and more brutal and so we did just that…

After this break you released, The Senectuous Entrance, which in my view is two albums put together — one that could be described as Emperor-style gothic black metal, and another that was more heavy metal/punkish. What brought about this dichotomy?

I basically came into the band with alot of the ideas already to go, I brought to the band my musical background and it took over I guess…I never really heard any of the newer black/death metal bands, which bothered me when people said we are a rip of of Norweigan bands, its totally not the truth, I was doing this type of music inthe early 80s I was playing the 3rds minor this dissonant that you name it ..if you notice “Rotting” has none of the harmonies and minor chords, I brought that to the band and we took off with it, I was in bands prior to that which had similiar traits…

Your songs convey as much energy as any other band out there. How do you do it?

I tend to think to myself if I was in the crowd or a listener what would I want to hear and I do it…energy is the first priority nowadays in my band “Treading on Divine” I do simpler arrangements but it works for me, there is more flowing riffs and catchy hooks…

The band has been around since 1991. How do you think metal, or death metal, has changed over the course of that time?

All the genres have improved with the times…certain bands keep their styles others evolve into something different I think both scenarios work,it gives fans an oppurtunity to hear something new therefore creating another rip in the timeline for a new genre..

How has Deteriorate as a band integrated those changes into its music?

Currently Deteriorate is rehearsing for a new release in the future but Mike Trush and myself are quite busy so it takes some time to get it together…other members are in Krypton or not doing music at all…

Your songs are convoluted in the logic that produces continuity between their riffs, enough that they must be heard through once fully before being interpreted. How do you think the awareness of this process in the listener affects how you compose?

It gives me a flowing feel to it, I can sit and bob my head continuosly from start to finish, I can only assume that our fans or listeners do the same thing…it has that warm feeling about it…the 5 unreleased songs have a brutal chaotic war type sound to it, but we still incorporated the Deteriorate flow and sound to it…

When you are composing a song and have two directions in which it can go, how do you select which one should prevail?

It was always a band vote or else we would just open jam and if it went in some new direction that sounded cool we would work with it…it’s truly important to find muscicians that you can openly do unplanned jams ,its usually where you find a truly nwew and original riff,where as when you are at home there is no drums or band influence there to strengthen the song or give you a nod or an added riff between another riff….

You seem to be a non-political band, as far as lyrics are concerned. Do you have any political or social change views that you keep to yourself, or are you detached from the entire process of politics and ideology?

Personally I try to incorporate politics or truth in my lyrics, these topics enrage me making my songs come out even more chaotic, I try to let the lyrics influence my choice of riffs after the song is written of course, the lyrics might change a part into something different or brutal…

The USA may be about to wage holy war on Iraq and the Middle East. Is this a metal topic to discuss?

Yes and no…I feel it’s all a front to keep americans intrested in the politics of this country…the president has to do something to keep his people supporting him…with all the things like snipers, Iraq, WTC and racism, he can shift the peoples attention away from starting a war with Iraq, he made everybody shift their attention from Iraq to the snyper atacks, getting everyone pissed off, so now the people are hungry for some desruction somewhere other than here, and to make it work even better the one snipers last name was Muhammad…it worked, he’s got the ok to wage a war on Iraq, I’m not surprised and I do support this war…these people need a leader that has enough brains not fuck with the most powerful country in the world, us!!!

Do you think that music conveys values based upon what positive beliefs are affirmed in the music, even in simply its sound which resembles facets of the outside world?

It does…music has been the center of attention since the beginning of its creation…it can take you out of reality or define reality and it seems that both work very well…I mean people take a cd put it in then something happens, almost chemically in their brain and it feels good,others feel bad or angry or something, its amazing how this works…I always thought that you could totally control or program people of all ages through certain notes played in precise actions in the brain, when I hear certain notes a feel it all over my body its really quite remarkable [I hope this made some sense to you, I think I understand what I just said hahaha]

Is it possible to be a musician without sharing some of your views through music?

Definitely… I’m really into Burzum, Varg does an excellent job at creating a soundscape, it’s total headphone music, which is one of my favorite ways of listening, Varg uses his feelings and beliefs through beautiful music, but yet you can still understand his anger and pains…Mortiis does similar work but his feelings tend to be fantasy like or dungeons and dragons theme music, both are excellent…

You’re now working on new material with a band called Treading on Divine. This title seems to have more metaphysical implications than the gore-metal-ish idea of Deteriorate. What is different about the music and outlook of Treading on Divine as compared to Deterioriate?

“Treading on Divine” is a project that I started around 98 right around the breakup of Deteriorate myself and joe gorski were fed up with the scene in Philly so we moved to south florida and started playing…he was on drums and I played and sang..eventually we grabbed my brother [who is the best guitarist I’ve ever seen] and Conrad Eddings on bass…we had 3 songs and so it was born…down the road we fell into the party scene down there 3 of us worked in nightclubs so if we weren’t working we were partying thus the band suffered…I had also another band with the samme members except Chris Dino plyed drums that was called ‘twitch’ it was really good stuff….so eventually we after 2 years parted ways I moved back north and started the band with other people, Thorous-lead guitar, Mike Trush-drums, Chris Berwind-bass and Alex Davis-guitar….we rehearsed about a year and 2 of the members didn’t progress so I let them go, now it’s myself, Trush and filling in on bass Jason Hildebrandt from Funeral Mask, Cemetary Earth, Hazarax…we’re ready to record a EP..full length soon the title is “thy only god”..the difference between Deteriorate and treading is I write all the music and arrangements, they’re more flowing and basic riffs…it has black, grind,melody,harmonies,thrash,death styles…in Deteriorate the riffs were all voted on whether I liked it or not so alot of good riffs got trashed, since I saved these riffs and used them now,so some of these songs are quite old…we do one song called “Viral Gore” which is from 1988; some are from 89, these are more thrashy,…the “Treading” songs have “hooks” that make you say hell yeah! As far as the lyrics “Treading on Divine” is based upon my hatred towards authority, I don’t like being told what to do, ever! Not by anyone including my girlfriends….this is the topic I have been griping about forever…i get political on some sogs others are about my nonreligon attitude…being my own god and all that…

What bands are you listening to now?

Voivod-Deathrow-DBC-Burzum-Devil Doll-Elend-Marilyn Manson-Ozzy/Sabbath-Golden Dawn-Entombed-Dismember-Fantomas-Mr. Bungle-Thorns-Abruptum-Mayhem-Behemoth-Venom-Destruction-Kreator-Sodom -Vond-Ulver-old W.A.S.P.-Metallica-Megadeth-Slayer-Darkthrone-Mercyful Fate-Celtic Frost-Belphegor-Tartaros-Tomahawk-Jimmy Rodgers-Sabbat-Immolation-Exodus-Emperor-Autopsy-Laibach-Bloodstorm-Se rvants of Hate-Funeral Mask-LiveSufferDie-Ministry-Christian Death-Violence-Anthrax-Forbidden-Abigor… I could go on forever!

It appears the downturn in the US and world economies has affected metal. Are you able to find a label at this point in time? Are you going to self-release this upcoming album?

Actually Philadelphia has so many labels here…I am talking with a few labels none that I want to name just yet but I have made mistakes with labels in the past and I don’t want to lose money and touring again. When I first joined Deteriorate we had tons of touring offers, some with morbidangel for 40 dates but our drummer had a custody battle going on so he couldn’t do the tours, eventually that was why we replaced him with Darkwoods, Rich was a great drummer though…

How do you think the internet has changed music, from your first album in 1993 to your second in 1996, and now to the current time?

The internet is excellent for underground bands like us to get exposure…it’s amazing how much stuff is out there…I can always find something interesting on the web….

Do you think most metallers have a common general direction of their ideology, or is there no unity in thought in the scene?

I honestly think everybody is different anymore, I always hear different opinions about every topic…,sure theres unity but not really where i’m at…i live in a city that has everybody thinking differently I don’t know why…theres always bands that are jealous of others or pissed offf that they’re opening for a band that they think sucks,i’ve been dealing with this shit since 89…we used to get every tour package that came through philly no matter who was headlining the tour we always got the top slot on the bill…this made all the local bands hate us instead of supporting us which would come back to them in the end…i think nowadays its different theres more unity in the scene…back in the 90s we could’ve all stuck together and the philly scene would’ve been the next tampa bay thing,instead when the cell block closed the bands dissapated,noone astuck to gether and bands broke up, its a shame because we really had some good bands in our scene,to tell you the truth most of those bands are like invisible because I haven’t seen many of those muscians again….

After the rise of nu-metal and bands like Slipknot, does metal any longer have the “coming in from the outfield” strangeness and dramatic impact that it once had?

I feel that this is the metal years all over again, history is repeating itself but in a grander way…a majority of people today appreciate metal and hard rock, its not that uncommon anymore,you hear metal on the radio everyday…we have such a wide variety of bands to chose from along with a generation of people that grew up om metal ranging from 10 to 40 years old….most like something heavy if not ozzy/sabath then metallica or godsmack or something…to me this is positive for the scene…
why metal? it’s not an easy artform, there’s no money and most people seem to hate it or disparage it. why do you keep going? (this is not a criticism, hopefully obviously, since i’m still in this after as many years too!)

I can’t stop! I love it the heavier it is the better….then again everybody will probably hate me for this but I like Marilyn Manson alot…his music is super creative, its full of hate, evil, and other postive shit that just makes him an icon for heavy mainstream music he’s actually helping the world get into heavy music which opens the doors for bands like mine,he has the flow we were talking about earlier, I am open minded to some degree….I like stuff from almost every genre doesn’t mean its good for everybody else, but it’s good to me and I don’t care what anybody thinks….who cares what I listen to anyway you know? To each his own….theres a litttle bit of everyting in bands today it means that awider range of audiences will buy into heavier music…[i hope]…

If you could tour with two or three bands from anywhere and anytime in metal, who would it be?

Voivod!!!!!!!Slayer!!!Morbid Angel!!!

Where do you think metal will go next?

Its going to get even bigger, I know I want more of it and I’m not going anywhere but more angrier then before…I have more anger in me than ever before and I need bands to fuel my fire!!!

Jazz, ambient, industrial, and punk: all of them exist as separate genres, niches if you will, from the mainstream as does metal. But somehow jazz and ambient get more respect and never quite fully are able to integrate with the mainstream of radio music. Do you think this is due to increased technicality, radically unpopular song structures, ability of audience to appreciate complexity, or other factors? Do you think this same distancing from mainstream radio music could help metal?

Maybe the jazz thing is of the other half of society that doesn’t listen to rock or metal or mainstream music…it could be an older generation or possibly the trained muscicians of the world are more appreciated…I know I’ve never had a lesson in my life but it still kept me busy and somewhat talented…

It used to be there were tons of zines, and people mailing stickers and dubbed cassettes all over the world. Metalheads today trade web links and mp3s, and there are now thousands of websites each offering small fragments of information. Where is this weak(er), and what’s next after this? Do you think metal will consolidate its information?

it can only get better,the more publicity for my style of music the better…

Do you believe humanity is about to blow itself into vapor?

Not really its pretty much the way its always been to me, bullshit, politicians, religon it’s all always there its just a matter of what you buy into…

What has changed about the songwriting process for Treading on Divine that is separate from how Deteriorate worked in both incarnations?

Actually not much maybe different tempos or not so much blast and grind beats…I have been working on more catchier riffs that have a more grooving sound to them its still in the black/death metal vein…

Who’s in the band now?

Thorous[guitar/vox] Mike Trush[drums/vox/bass]

Are you going to repress Rotting in Hell and The Senectuous Entrance?

Actually we have the original recording of “Rotting in Hell” which was recorded at an entirely different rcording studio…the vox are even more brutal..we are going to release it soon with the original cover that was deemed to satanic for our onr guitar player….

Where do you hope to be in ten years?

hopefully touring the world and playing brutal music forever!!!!!!!

What do you do outside of metal, as individuals, and who is in the band?

I have my historic renovations business…I do old world/european style stonework and replications. I’m planning to do a house in Spain this spring, its my other passion in life!!

Any final additions?

Its cool to know that there’s people out there still into Deteriorate and the old school metal bands…I appreciate any people who would like a copy of unreleased material and videos…send me tapes and postage to: thorous—-170 smithtown rd. pipersville,PA 18947 Keep the metal world alive! Don’t give up playing your instruments,follow your dreams, I had dreams when I started playingt and so many came true, if I can do it anyone can do it! Keep trying your best,sing your heart out! Play all day and night! Make a difference, speak your mind! Don’t take any shit from anyone! Don’t let anyone push you around, you’re only as powerful as you believe you are! Keep metal alive! Kick some ass! – And support the local bands in your area, without people like you local bands will fade away, go to as many shows as you can, and buy as much merchandise as you can, it will come back to you in some way! Thanks for giving me the chance to vent SRP! – thorous…treading on divine….

The natural inequality of the two powers of population and of production in the earth and that great law of our nature which must constantly keep their effects equal form the great difficulty that to me appears insurmountable in the way to the perfectibility of society. All other arguments are of slight and subordinate consideration in comparison to this. No fancied equality, no agrarian regulations in their utmost extent, could remove the pressure of it even for a single century. And it appears, therefore, to be decisive against the possible existence of a society, all the members of which should live in ease, happiness, and comparative leisure; and feel no anxiety about providing the means of subsistence for themselves and families.

Consequently, if the premises are just, the argument is conclusive against the perfectibility of the mass of mankind.

– Thomas Malthus, Population: The First Essay (1798)

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Interview: King Fowley (Deceased)

Deceased are an incredibly longstanding band from Virginia, US. They’ve run full-circle in their career, from over-the-top metal and hardcore of the mid 1980s (Discharge, Voivod, Slayer, Sodom) later merged with the energy of emerging death metal in the late eighties/early nineties and back again to rediscover themselves in the context of their heavy metal forebears. King Fowley, whose enthusiasm for the music he plays and what it represents seethes through everything he does, has lead the band’s charge since their inception.

Originally for Heidenlarm e-zine #5.

Cursed productions recently issued The Radiation Years, a collection of early demos. Is this the complete deceased pre-label discography?

Actually it’s not! ‘The evil side of religion’ our first demo still needs to surface complete. And will very soon! Probably on Cursed Productions as well. Actually in all honesty there was a home studio demo before ‘luck of the corpse’ l.p was recorded. With ‘Fading Survival’, ‘Terrifying Spectres’, ‘Industrial Tumor’, and ‘Psychedelic Warriors’ that is ‘lost’ to me and the band. The master was lost in my pile of cassette tape hell, that is my collection. I only know one guy who may have it and it’s a guy named Yoshio Cain who plays for the Japanese band Shadow now! He was a die-hard Deceased freak and i sent it only out to him back in 1989! I hope it is ‘found’ one day! It’s got some wild stuff on it :)

Other then that, only rehearsals and stuff like that is floating in ‘the vaults’ :)

When you started out as a band, it seemed you were one of the first to bring technical and speed metal elements, like Voivod and Razor (?) influences, to the music. was this a planned decision, or a natural culmination in the ways metal was being made at the time?

We were so fucking high on any drug we could get our hands on we were off in ‘freakout’ zone. We were honestly just trying to be the most ‘over the top’ band ever. We were taking speed from Sodom, Slayer, DRI, punk, thrash, etc. And mixing it with distorted styled lyrics of dread and death ala ‘War and Pain’ era Voivod, and Venom, Blessed Death, etc. Then ‘attempting’ to put in some Voivod weirdness guitar chords, and some Mercyful Fate ‘evil’, just all of it on hand! We had no idea where it would take us! It was very straight forward and insane! It was basically just a bunch of long- haired teenagers in Slayer and Venom shirts going nuts for metal and aggresson in 1985!

The first Deceased I ever heard, Luck of the Corpse, had tight and fast rhythmic arrangements and workout drumming; what atmosphere were you intending on that album? How did it turn out relative to your expectations?

Well ‘Luck..’ was an experience! I got good and bad memories of that ‘era’ of Deceased. Original guitarist Doug Souther and me were completely on different levels as to where the band needed to go both musically and personality wise at that junction in the bands life. So it ‘clashed’! Neither of us was right or wrong. Just ‘different’ in our beliefs! I think the other guys (Mark and Les) wanted to go with my ‘angle’ more so, and Doug took offense. He was really ready to move on and away from the band. So recording that record had it’s ‘negativity’ to it. Musically it’s just too fast for it’s own good! Trying to still live up to our ‘faster then you’ attitdues and trying to release something ‘good’ for death metal fanatics the world over to bite into. Everythnig was ‘rushed’ and in the end it sits a bit ‘dissapointing’. I loved the songs and I loved the chance to release a record with Relapse and be thought of as ‘competent’ enough to record and be on a record label. That was great! It was ‘neat’ to see your face and music on a cd and vinyl, cassette. It felt ‘good’! We were ‘growing up’ a bit and we had to start somewhere ‘fresh’ as a band.

When you think of the people who enjoy your music, is there anything they have in common (besides enjoying Deceased)?

I’m sure there is! I personally like to call Deceased music supporters, ‘friends’! I don’t like the word ‘fans’. Makes you think you are ‘better’ then them! We are all ‘even steven’ in my eyes. We all get up out of bed, eat, drink, sleep, love music, got our hobbies, families, etc. That’s all it is to me. ‘Seperation’ between bands and their music supporters is pretty ‘high ego’ to me. No need! Let’s all just have fun and keep on laughing through as many good times as we can!!! Look out for each other and keep on keeping on!

People sometimes ask me if I feel I’m being disrespectful to the dead by celebrating morbidity through music. What do you think about this question?

Hmmm — good question! Morbidity through music. I don’t personally see any disresect in it. Death is imminent to all and we all have to challenge it daily, every day on earth. No one knows the exact moment they will leave this place and move on to life beyond. Is there life beyond? Is it peace? Is it despair that awaits? No one truly knows. It’s life’s biggest mystery!

As soon as you’re born you’re dying. I talk about it and ‘subject’ it cuz it too intrigues me as a human being. That’s why ‘deceased’ was such th eperfect name for our band. Being the lyricist of the band i know in my heart how i feel and what my words are being meant when i write them. I am a very ‘up’ guy in my living personality. But death is always looming in the back of my brain for sure. It’s just something that truly intrigues me! Death to some is sadness. To others it’s joy, a time of celebration. To me it’s just ‘death’ and it’s unknown what will be ‘next’!

Metal has gone through huge changes since the middle 1990s. With the internet and the personal computer, it now seems everyone has a label or a zine or a band, and there’s tons and tons of metal “information” with perhaps very little data. What do you think the next stage will be?

Well it is always ‘evolving’ with the times and technology. Some for the better some for worse. But that’s ‘life’! I appreciate anyone who sincerely sits down to write an article or passes on msic to a friend to possibly enjoy. It’s ‘word of mouth’ to me that still runs the metal ‘underground’. I dont like label created ‘hype’ and ‘buzz’, never did! Let the music do the talking is my motto. Too many people sadly fall into the ‘live for the press’ mentality. Bad reviews send off interest to some people. While a ‘shining’ review makes them instantly ‘love’ it. Too weird to me!

I got my own mind, and I think and choose for myself what works for me musically as a music supporter! Sure, take all ‘aspects’ into consideration. Cuz a review can ‘help’ in your selection, but in the end let it be no one but you who decides what ‘you’ like! As for ‘next stages’, hmmm?! It’s hard to say! The internet/computer is definitely running the show now. It’s quick, updated at any given time, right there for anyone to take in! I say that will run the gament for some time still!

I was talking with Ray Miller of Adversary, a band from Indiana, and I said that in many ways I respect most the styles from when the styles we have today were newly forming. He suggested I listen to early Deceased, and I did and heard many influences in the music. What do you think each style of metal (heavy metal, melodic heavy metal, speed metal, death metal, and crossovers like hardcore, etc) represented to the generation that produced it, in terms of both music and attitude? When you brought together these styles, could you recognize each distinct impulse in your work, or did they gel into a new language?

Well i’ve always loved music. I mean anything and everythnig that got me ‘going’ i loved! It is my life’s greatest ecstasy. Early on I fell in love with the Beatles,. I was literaly 3-4 year sold. The choruses… the ‘greatness’ was quite easy to understand to me. Then I got into the ‘hoopla’ of Kiss. The blood of Simmons on the covers, the ‘image’ and visuals. It’s perfect for an 8 year old to sink his/her teeth into! It got me into wanting and craving more outlandish and more ‘over the top’ music. Trying to conquer the ‘extreme’! What is now tediously ‘mellow’ in music standards of today (Van Halen, Ted Nugent, Heart, Benatar, etc.) was once ‘over the top’ and pretty darn ‘heavy’ stuff! I just kept poking my head around in mags, record stores, all of it to ‘find’ something to fix my craving. This got me to the ‘gory’ Eddie and Maiden, razor blade through fingers artwork of Priest, the ‘devils and witches’ of Sabbath! All of it! Which in turn got me to Motorhead, Ramones, Plasmatics, Venom, etc.
It’s all a big ‘turn of the screw’! It just continues to move on and no one can slow it down. So when i got into deceased and we formed the band we knew deep down all of us had a common bond for ‘muis’c first and formost. Sure, we were ‘caught up’ in th eheavy metal mania of the times. We died for sodom, exciter, venom, fate, manaowar, all of it! But we still had our ‘elders’ of musical uprise (The Cars, Kiss, Journey, Blondie, Foreigner, etc) in our hearts as well.

We were living the life style of ‘full blown heavy metal’ but we had our hearts set in music!

So when we started writing we just blew it out as fast and furious as we could. Beyond “caught up” in the times of aggression and drug- fed energy. The ‘attitude’ you speak of was just 100% ‘us’! It was ‘Deceased’! We just got in and ‘did it’! We took all of the aspects of music we loved, speed of hardcore and thrash, melody of traditional heavy metal, choruses and ‘structures’ of traditional kiss styled rock n roll, and the ‘zaniness’ and off kilter of punk and the ilk.

It ‘worked’ for us! Sure some ‘genres’ worked better for us. But it was still all just a big band blender and we kept feeding it with more musical vegetables :)

It seems to me much of the metal from 1978 onward would have lost impetus and extremity if it weren’t for the influence of hardcore music. How do you think on this issue?

Yeah, I can see that indeed! ‘Extreme’ standards have gone ‘haywire’ n the last 20 odd years. It is the ‘way of the world’ on all accounts. Everything is faster paced in the world. More ‘raw’ and much less ‘polished’. No one has time to ‘stop’ anymore. Alot less ‘love’ in the world, sadly so much hate and destruction. A total ‘kill or be killed’ mentality!

No one has time to ‘relax’. It’s just ‘go go go’! So obviously the people creating the music are gonna ‘release’ it in the same way. It’s all humans jsut ‘being human’! That’s just how it is!

Do you read any zines or websites today?

All the time! I’m always taking in the words and wisdom of others. Knowledge is man’s greatest gift, and at times our worse enemy.
But it to me is food for thought and impossible to not ingest.

As I said anyone who sincerely takes time to put up a musical related site or a fanzine, magazine and you read it and instantly fall in love with their ‘personality’ or the ‘charm’ of the crafted entity, that’s just a great feeling! More power to ya’! I know i’ll be reading and searching it all out.

Do you think the political climate in the USA will be more or less tolerant of death metal in five years?

I say it’ll be the same as of today. It seems to ‘stay’ under the radar al lthe time. It seems no one’s minding the ‘smaller’ people of the earth and globe right now, music or non music related. But i see a slow but steady ‘rising’ of this around the world and in time it will outnumber or truly challenge the ‘theories’ and practices and beliefs of alot of the world. Geesh remember when Dee Snider was ‘sooooooooooooo bad’ in the governments eyes?! Wow! How far we’ve come in 20 years!

Around Fearless Undead Machines, it seemed to me that your style as a band shifted from aspiring to a death metallish sound to more of what you were doing with Doomstone’s first album, namely making heavy metal using some of the techniques from death metal. Rhis to me was a brilliant move, as it put you closer in touch with your roots, aspirations and musical loves. How is it that you as a band can pull something like that off, and Immortal could, but virtually every other musician appears mediocre when they attempt something like that?

Well, that’s some nice words coming from you, and we truly appreciate it! All I can say about that ‘time’ is that we as a band had decided we needed to complelty build on our ‘musical strengths’! To sincerely cut the ‘fat’ and ‘extras’ of our sound up to then (‘Blueprints..’ l.p was very bizzare and ‘all over the place’ musically) and do what 100% worked for us! We were still ‘searching’ for our ‘perfect identity’ in music and we at that time, I beleive, found it! Guitarist Mike Smith came forth and said ‘i write guitar riffs this way and this is what i want to write in this band’. I took it into consideration as the band’s ‘arranger’ of songs. Mark and Les (guitar and bass) also put their ideas and words into persepctive and it really felt ‘right’. It was a sincere ‘bonding’ of the band both musically and spiritualy! We ‘got on wth it’ and delivered our finest record up to that point in our eyes. It was very well recieved by the industry and that felt good to us. Doing it completely ‘our way’ and being accepted for it! From there it’s all just ‘fell into place’ since.

I’m told that King Fowley is still a very active tape trader. How do you find the time? And what do you trade?

Well tapes are now cd’rs in our ‘technologically advanced’ world! Haha

I love to ‘pass on’ the music to others who care to listen!. I trade with anyone that wants to spend the time to burn and learn as much as I do. I got so much music I can not afford to buy at this time sadly. And I got tons of music I have collected through my many, many years in the music field in return.

There’s no greater feeling then passing over a Demon Flight cd burn to a friend and watching them get the same smile I got when i first heard it! Or the ‘cheer’ from the guy who says ‘man that fucking Griffin you sent me is bad ass’! It just feels ‘right’ and makes me smile every damn time. I find the time cuz there’ s always time for things you love to do. That’s one of my personal ‘life’ ways of the world!

Were there any other Deceased side-projects besides Doomstone?

Well, Deceased-related, no not really! Unless you count a few ‘one off’ sessions with silly named ‘projects’ me and Mark have done like ‘Masbah’, our tribute to Japan’s Casbah and early Master from Chicago. It was a jam session and we just went ‘silly’ haha. I got that on tape somewhere, and i believe that was 1991. Also there’s ‘talk ‘of me and Mark doing ‘rock brigade’ an all 80’s rock thing where we cover Aldo Nova, Gary Moore, Fist, and Triumph songs, etc.! Les Snyder was/is in Doomstone along with me and that was fun. Doomstone has gone all over the place using ‘session ‘guys and just ‘mixing it up’ to confuse us as well as others. Now I do have a side band called October 31. It’s not Deceased-related outside of me being part of it, but i really enjoy the times and music that band has created! ‘Traditional’ heavy metal is what we file that under!

Does metal exist in the mainstream any longer?

It doesn’t matter to me. The music is the same to my ears! The identity of the ‘captivating’ audience has long gone back to the ‘die hards’. And that’s how I personally see it fit. It’s not for everyone and it’s really by it’s own ‘musical law’ not to be concieved as very ‘commercially viable’. It has it’s ‘surges’ and it’s a rollercoaster love affair to some. But to me it’s just music and it’s always gonna be there for those who want it! I know i always will!!!!!!

What do you make of this hip-hop influence in nu-metal – artistic advancement, or tool of the labels to make music more like that which they have trained the sheep to buy?

Wow man! I really am the wrong guy to ‘invite’ this into metal music. That ‘style’ of art never did a damn thing for me. Outside or inside the genre of metal music. Just does’t ‘click’ for me in the least! Some took to it instantly, others it ‘grew on’. To me it just does not work!!! It tries to break down the ‘barriers’ that as I mentioned metal music kinda set its self in firmly many, many years ago! The ‘funkiness’ of it isn’t needed for metal. The ‘ghetto’ vibe is just so ‘out of place’ in the metal genre. Let it be its own ‘entity’ and stop trying to ‘heap’ it in with the trappings and undying spirit of heavy metal music and it wont be a problem with me!

Old metal records seemed to me to be a brilliant project, because each generation of metalheads ages and then the music they found meaningful, especially the rarities, is forgotten and all we know of that time are the bands with excellent advertising budgets. Is there a way to combat this generational loss in metal?

Well, I tried! Sadly human nature came into play again. And what was once a great dream and ambition of mine became tarnished with false promises and greedy people pretty quick. I tried in vain to keep the label going forward from day one. But too many ‘ex band members’ forgot what it was to play and record music and let it be heard by any and all they could. They wanted all of ‘this’ and all of ‘that’. Like I was to reimburse them for being shit on by their record labels of years ago. I’m just a dude into heavy metal music and I was doing all I could to ‘better’ the cult past by re-reelasing and upgrading formats of their music from a time ago. I’d get old band members of bands I loved names out of phone books and call them up and talk about putting their stuff out again. Some instantly ‘clicked’ with me and my ideas and some past and we went our own ways without a problem. But it was the empty promises and sudden changes of thought half wa through projects that got me ‘down’ on it all. I’d press a bands c.d and then they’d ‘change’ their mind. Or something or someone would surface with a not as enthusiastic feeling for the event!

You know if I was to please every person in every band I was in touch with I’d never have released jack shit! Every band has ‘differences’ and years later some could ‘give a shit’ and some don’t wanna know at all. It got old and I just tried to put it to rest. The label’s still around in small spurts but it’s never to be the same. Some bands appreciated my sincerity, and we still remain great friends, while others now knock me in their ‘revival’ interviews from nostalgic metal, retro- mags etc.

It hurts to see that sometimes, but I know what I did and how I approached it. And i can 100% always live with myself for that!

Is it true that most metalheads quit at 30?

Probably! Some call it ‘the music of youngsters’! And 30 seems to stop the youngster ball rolling for some. Not me! Gonna be 35 in a few months. And I find it healthy, life giving, and still 100% a part of every day I exist on! To me, it’s all in the way you look at things.

Do you think paranoia in this time of history is warranted on the part of the citizen?

Yes! Too many croonies and back stabbers, fakes, cheats, liars, out there. Who sleeps with their windows open anymore at night!? Sad isn’t it! Laziness, greed, the need to ‘stay up’ with another persons fortunes plays evil tricks on the mind of many. The ‘whoever dies with th emost toys wins’ mentality is fucking pathetic! I say take what you got and build on it. Some obviously have it easier in their means/ways to ‘survive’. Some deserve it, some don’t!

But the cards are drawn, make your own dreams! Paranoia is indeed ‘needed’ at this point in life. From this horribly, crummy war, to the indecencies and anger that most of the free world puts on each other daily. It’s fucking sad! Human beings, a dying breed! One day…extinction!

While your early material was urgent, it seems your newer work is more medium paced. What caused this change, in your view?

Urgent was the drugs and the ‘need’ to stay up with the speed factor. Our mentality was speed is ‘extreme’ and we were wanting to be part of the ‘extreme’! We don’t feel that ‘urgency’ in that way anymore! We love fast! Trust me im’ a hyper spazz ‘fast’ guy! Haha

But it’s now ‘called for’ when needed! I do say ‘its alive’ off our lastest e.p is still pretty frantic and indeed ‘fast’!

It’s all in the song and emotion of the day!

How did creating the Doomstone album For Those Whom Satan Hath Joined influence your outlook on songwriting in deceased?

In no real way really! It was just a project that took off in a real bigggg way for awhile. People really liked the ‘Sabbath edge’! The darker substance. The slower ‘brooding’ of the pace of the songs for the most part!

It’s got a great place in metal music. Cuz so many who listen to this genre have that ‘twisted’ underframe.

But as far as Deceased goes, it didn’t really influence me or the band in the least!

Do you listen to any black metal besides Venom?

Well what’s ‘black metal’ anymore? The gurggling, non heavy, non catchy crud of something like Darkthrone? I despise that horrible shit! To me it has to ‘brood’ it has to ‘lurk’ it has to create the ‘dark’ side of things in both atmosphere and personality. That fast insane blast, garage punk/electric shaver styled guitar, and unimpressive or convincing vocals stuff don’t so it for me! I just prefer the ‘trappings’ of a Venom ‘Sacrifice’ or a Mercyful Fate’s ‘Into the Coven’ anyday! I listen to tons of the newer stuff out there and often ‘hyped’ up. And I hope to hear something i can grab onto. But sadly it get sput to the side and discarded over time. Cuz it don’t have depth or stayin gpower for my tastes in music. I think the last great ‘black metal’ record I heard and sincerely appreciated was ‘Ritual’ by Master’s Hammer! And that’s at least 10 years old now! I’m still waiting and hoping for more ‘darkness’ to surface.

What were the handful of most influential bands during the 1980s? 1990s?

Do you mean for me??? Voivod, Venom, Fate, Slayer, Maiden, Queensryche, Motorhead, were big ones for my Deceased musical ‘ideas’ in the 80’s!

The 90’s brought me fewer bands cuz my seeds were set!

I wasn’t as ‘keen’ on ‘influential’ bands like Fear Factory or Deicide or that type!

I am set in the 80s for sure! Though I love tons of music made in the 90’s as well! Just not as ‘influenced’ by it as a player! One band I truly admire from the “90’s” is The Gathering. Beautiful people and gifted as hell musicians and song-writers!

Did these bands differ markedly from the bands of the 1970s?

For me it sure did! Cuz the 70s belonged to the radio for me as a kid! By the time I was into less known ‘album tracks’ by radio artists of my ‘childhood’ it was almost 1980! I was the ‘hit song’ guy! But I quickly learned there’s tons of songs the radio doesn’t play that really got my goose :)

What do you think bands in the 2010 decade will be like? Will there be a resolution to mainstream versus underground, black versus death, funk beats versus metal beats, etc?

Who really knows? I just keep watching this ‘segregation’ unfold from the sidelines and some of it is justified while some is just plain silliness. I really don’t care where it goes really. As i said earlier music is… Music!!! You like something, like it to death! Who’s up who’s down, who’s got the upper hand!

My advice is to just play from the heart with all that you’ve got inside cuz that’s all you have at the end of the day!

Referencing the previous question, it seems to me that metal uses percussion differently than most mainstream music: where mainstream music creates a bounce and an expectation of its fulfillment, metal creates a driving structure which encloses change in harmonic/melodic patterns (by other instruments). What ideas differ between these two groups?

Metal music is known as a driving force so you will find it staying on tap and ‘in the pocket’ most of the time! Metal has a great love for dynamics in the traditional sense ala Maiden or say early Queensryche! But i’d like to see more ’emotion’ in metal music myself! I love to feel and live the song. The ups and downs of the music. Th topics and choice of ideas could be so widely expanded on in music and tempos and all! Mercyful Fate in the early days were masters of this. The percussion of metal also leaves alot ot be desired at times for me as a listener. That’s why me as a drummer go to a Phil Erhart of kansas or a Carl Palmer of elp for my ‘identity’. Cuz that’s more ‘me’ as a player and where I ‘inspire’ from. Sure you got the influences of dave lombardo or a kim ruzz as well. But it’s sadly less common to see really ‘brilliant’ creators in percussion in more ‘extreme’ metal music!

Hope to see that change in the future!

What non-metal makes your playlists these days?

Well 10 things ‘non metal’ I’ve played alot lately include the new Guano Apes record, any and all No Doubt, Benatar, Berlin’s latest record, early The Fixx, Oingo Boingo, Planet P, Laibach, Einsturzende Nuebauten, and some Switchblade Symphony!

Tons of bands I been cranking lately! I’m all over the place for ‘listening’ pleasures! Haha just me being zany I guess!

If you could wish positive things for metal in these areas, what would they be:

A. Bands: to drop the egos alot of them have and be musicians first and formost! Erase the egos pleaseeeeee! To really cherish and hold in heart the honor of playing music!
B. Labels: to be more respectful to your artists. Treat them as hmans and not business cattle. We are all in this together so even up the angle already!
C. Journalism: to write from the heart and always call it the way you see it!
D. Philosophy: to learn by your mistakes, grow everyday, and challenge ‘challenge’ on every occasion!

It seems to me there are now several live Deceased releases, including a few that didn’t make massive distribution. which is your favorite?

There are? I only know of one! ‘Up the tombstones’ live from Thrash Corner! Unless you count the old cassettes we made in the later 80’s! :) I’m confused here. Or drawing a blank! You decide! Haha We are gonna have some live tracks surfacing soon though! As bonus songs for cd releases! :) As for ‘up the tombstones’, I love the live c.d! It’s ‘us’! It’s the energy, live attitude, and songs we played of that time! Thanks to ray at thrash corner for releasing it and ‘phantasmagoria’ club for having us!

Will Deceased ever do a massive tour?

It’s unknown to me truly! Jobs and home security come first with us. Family, rent, etc.

Yeah all bands on some level deal with it. But we are us and we gotta look out for us first off! If we can ‘arrange’ it then ‘yes’ we will indeed be there! Time off from work aint easy to some of the guys. And I sincerely respect that and understand tenfold. I know if we can we willlllllllllllll!

Mr Fowley, I have heard you are recovering from lung troubles that mean you cannot assume your customary position behind the kit. Will this ever change?

It’s doubtful! We have a new drummer in Dave ‘Scarface’ Castillo and to tell you the truth, he’s just perfect for the band and we will carry on with him as brother, family, and friend! It’s the ‘end of an era’ and the beginning of another! Chapter 1 complete! Now onto chapter 2! Wish us luck! We rise from the grave come midnight!
since you gentlemen have survived this long, where most metalheads are in their teens, do you have any advice about “growing up” and “life and how to live it”?
Do your best to keep your head about you! Have your spirit in hand at all time, wear your heart on your sleeve, and keep your elders’ good ways within you. Never look back and never give in! I wish everyone well in their journey!

How would you have me killed for asking so many questions? Or, more apropos to the interview: is there anything else I forgot that should be answered?

Great interview! It came from the heart and so did my answers! Thnaks for caring long enough to type this and i wish you only the best! Check out the website…

(official) Up the Tombstones

And email me at kingsley22@starpower.net for any info, etc. you may need!

Long live the loud!

Thanks a million and one
King Fowley 3/20/03

The normal question, the first question is, are these cannibals? No, they are not. Cannibalism in the true sense of the word implies an interspecies activity. These creatures cannot be considered human. They prey on humans. They do not prey on each other, that’s the difference. They attack and they feed only on warm flesh. Intelligence? Seemingly no reasoning ability, but basic skills remain from a remembered everyday life. There have been reports of these creatures using tools. But even these are the most basic, the use of tools as bludgeons and so forth. I might point out that even animals have been known to adopt the use of tools in this manner. These creatures are nothing but pure, motorized instinct. We must not be lulled by the concept that they are our family members or our friends. They are not. They will not respond to such emotions. They must be destroyed on sight!

– Dr. Millard, Dawn of the Dead (1978)

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Interview: D.L. (Cruciamentum)

Old-school authenticity is typically a contradiction in terms in the realm of modern death metal. Cruciamentum, hailing from the UK, seeks to strike back at this notion with their own stated purpose of delivering a “spiked fist in the face of trendy ‘death metal'” with a encapsulating, occult delivery and conviction in its creation.

You’ve gone for an old-school approach, updated with elements from the “mature” and final albums of the old school. What did you pick from each, and why did you take this approach?

There was no conscious decision to adopt the sound we have, it just came naturally. I prefer to just call our music “death metal” rather than applying any other tags to it. To me the phrase “old school” tends to imply just another Nihilist clone rather than a band with any character of their own. However, a lot of the old bands are personal favourites amongst the band’s members, so doubtlessly they are an influence on our writing.

What appeals to you about the old school sound?

Darkness, evil, power and song writing. All the things that modern death metal lacks!

If you could identify your primary influences, what would those be?

Incantation, Absu (Barathrum, and Temples of Offal era), Demigod, Shub Niggurath, Morbid Angel, and Immolation, though a lot of the time it depends on my mood.

Then suddenly the clouds thinned and the stars shone spectrally above. All below was still black, but those pallid beacons in the sky seemed alive with a meaning and directiveness they had never possessed elsewhere. It was not that the figures of the constellations were different, but that the same familiar shapes now revealed a significance they had formerly failed to make plain. Everything focussed toward the north; every curve and asterism of the glittering sky became part of a vast design whose function was to hurry first the eye and then the whole observer onward to some secret and terrible goal of convergence beyond the frozen waste that stretched endlessly ahead.

– H.P. Lovecraft, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath (1927)

When you write songs, do you start with a visual concept, or a riff, or something else?

A mixture of things; I’m a slow writer and different things inspire different parts. Usually it starts with a riff and then progresses naturally from there. Sometimes it can be just a mental image and I try to write riffs to convey that feeling. The riffs are always composed before we practice and then we structure the song in the rehearsal room together as a band.

It seems obvious to me, when all factors are added up, that our society is in decline. However, this opinion is not widely shared. Why do you think this is?

This is an interesting subject, but I don’t think that it is something that can be easily summed up in a couple of paragraphs. I do agree with you that there has been a strong moral decline in the last decade; people have become lazier, apathetic and more selfish. Many I have heard attribute this to the economic decline of the last few years, and although I don’t doubt that the inevitable depression caused in worse affected areas by poverty and unemployment is to blame, but I think that these problems are older than the economic problems. Bear in mind I am only 26, but I have noticed since my childhood a huge rise of an entitlement attitude in people in England. People seem to believe now that they are entitled to more, and many will grab at whatever they can lay their hands on, people have started to have children younger so that they can receive benefits and lead a more comfortable and lazy life. No doubt the obvious neglect on these “unwanted” children is having a serious effect on the younger generation’s behaviour as well. Perhaps with people’s needs being catered to more easily we have just simply eradicated the need for friendlier, close-knit communities? To be honest, I have no answers to these questions, just speculation of my own. I’d be more than happy to discuss this at further length in person with anyone interested though.

What would define “success” for you with your music?

In terms of Cruciamentum, I think that we have already reached it by writing and recording music that we are immensely proud of. We have no interest in making money, extensive touring, furthering our social lives, or anything else. As long as we have made something that we ourselves are happy with, that is all that matters.

Do you believe underground metal is still a viable form of music?

Of course, the current underground has produced some of my favourite bands! Bands like Necros Christos, Dead Congregation, Ignivomous, etc., I believe can stand by the classic bands such as Morbid Angel, Incantation, Deicide etc. The musical climate is just different these days, if the bands I mentioned previous came out in the early 90s they would have been much bigger, these days mainstream metal is more about image than musical content which is why the “true” bands of today remain in virtual obscurity.

What distinguishes great music from bad? Can it be distilled into technique, or is it something less easily defined?

Great music is music that connects with its listener. I don’t think technique has anything to do it, just the ability to do your own thing and do it with enough conviction that it can be conveyed in the music.

What releases have you produced so far, and where are you taking the band at this time? What’s next for Cruciamentum?

So far we released a one-track demo in 2008, and the 2009 demo Convocation of Crawling Chaos. We’re currently writing material for a MLP which we hope to start recording in a few months time, which will be released through Nuclear Winter Records. Expect around 25 minutes of new music. We also have started playing our first foreign gigs in Italy, Belgium, Germany, and Finland.

Did you ever study music theory or take lessons? Did this help you or slow you down in achieving your musical goals?

I’m not sure about the other members, but I took a few lessons when I started playing guitar and then gave up and taught myself. I’ve also studied Music and Music Production. The theory helps in understanding each other when writing new material, but we’re not a complex band, and we don’t compose based on music theory.

Some have said that rock music is about individualism, or escaping the rules of society and nature to do whatever the individual wants to do. However, some have also said that heavy metal breaks with that tradition with its “epic” and impersonal view of life. Where do you fit on the scale?

I believe that to be a dated concept now. I’m sure that was very much true in the early days of rock-n-roll while our parents and grandparents were young, but since then I believe rock music and metal has become just another genre that has found its niche in popular culture where it can be watered down and devalued for popular consumption. I genuinely couldn’t say for sure where we fit into this, I think that is partly to be decided by how the listeners interpret us.

One of the most striking signs of the decay of art is the intermixing of different genres.

– Johann Wolfgang van Goethe, Propylaea (1798)

When Hellhammer said, “Only Death is Real,” it launched legions of death metal and grindcore bands who showed us through sickness, misery and sudden doom (in their lyrics) that life is short, manipulations are false, and we need to get back to reality. Where should the genre go from there?

I think that that phrase sums it all up perfectly! Death is a key element to life, and that is something that everyone should pay some thought to. I wouldn’t say that metal is there specifically to remind people of this fact though; there are plenty of different directions to take the lyrical and philosophical approach of the music in.

Is there a relationship between how an artist sees the world, and the type of music he or she will then make? Do people who see the world in similar ways make similar music?

Yes, I think there is some truth in that. Although the personalities in Cruciamentum are different, all members have a similar attitude. Personally speaking, I have quite a negative outlook on life, I don’t think someone who is part of a popular social group would feel the same emotions that I do that are required to channel into making the music we do.

Do you think your music will have a “real world” effect, other than people buying and listening to CDs? Will they take your ideas and do something of them?

I doubt it. Due to the nature of the music, we will already be preaching to the converted, to reach a wider audience we would have to severely compromise our style, or even play a different style of music, and Cruciamentum exists to create dark music, not to preach.

When did Cruciamentum form, and what was the goal? How long did it take to produce your first recordings, and how have you changed since then?

The band dates back to 2005, though it took me until late 2008 to finally find all the right musicians for the band. Before the Convocation… demo, there was probably around an hour of music written, but the demo was such a huge leap forwards from that material that it has all been abandoned. The Convocation… demo took roughly around a year, as I fired the entire line-up at one point, and re-wrote the songs with the current line-up. Then there were numerous set backs in the recording process, and further set backs in having the demos printed. Hopefully that is the end of the troubles now though!

As for changes, since our inception we have improved more than I could have imagined back in 2005. The band finally has all the right people, the attitude is right, and we’re moving forwards.

Do you think the “underground” still exists?

Yes, it has simply changed from what it used to. With the internet making it easier to access some music, it has obviously become more widespread, and to a degree perhaps watered down, but there are plenty of die-hards with the right spirit.

Can you tell us what equipment you use, and what production techniques you use for recordings?

There’s nothing special equipment wise. We use BC Rich and Jackson guitars, various FX pedals, Warwick basses, Pearl drums and whatever amplifiers we can get our hands on. For the demo we recorded the drums at The Priory Studios with Greg from Esoteric, and I recorded, mixed and mastered the rest. I think we will do the same for the next recording; I’ve bought a lot of new equipment since the demo, so we should get a better sound this time round.

Yet I am not more sure that my soul lives, than I am that perverseness is one of the primitive impulses of the human heart as one of the indivisible primary faculties, or sentiments, which give direction to the character of man. Who has not, a hundred times, found himself committing a vile or a stupid action, for no other reason than because he knows he should not? Have we not a perpetual inclination, in the teeth of our best judgement, to violate that which is Law, merely because we understand it to be such?

– Edgar Allan Poe, The Black Cat (1843)

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Interview: Mike Perun (Cianide)

Cianide are massive stalwarts of American death metal for whom little has changed in twenty years. Their impact is a bludgeoning and brute force one derived almost wholly from the genre’s progenitors; Slaughter (Canada), Hellhammer/Celtic Frost, Slayer are touched with the plodding heavy metal of the previous generation to shore up their unwavering sound.

Interview originally from Heidenlarm e-zine #5.

When you formed Cianide, how did you describe the music you wanted to create?

Always was, is and will be: DEATH METAL. Granted we’re probably not the exact textbook definition of the genre, but that is what we’ve always set out to be. Could explain why we’ve managed to outlast a lot of more “popular” or “successful” of the bands that started around the same time we did. Our vision has always stayed the course and to play any other kind of music would just be stupid.

Of the artists who influenced you, which most directly affected your conception of the style of music you create with Cianide?

Of all of our influences the bands that immediately come to mind are FROST/HELLHAMMER (of course!), SLAUGHTER and MASTER/DEATHSTRIKE. Bands that incorporated various speeds/tempos as opposed to just speed for speed’s sake 100% of the time. Another band is POST MORTEM. “Coroner’s Office” is a fuckin’ classic!

The first Cianide album seemed to me to be more grinding than death metal, straying into the ambiguous and underexplored territory where Bolt Thrower, Blood and later Napalm Death wander. a) Do you think this perception is (semi-)accurate and b) what do you see as the differences emerging on later albums?

a. I guess you could say it’s accurate, though at the time we were just doing what we were able to do and not giving a fuck. Looking at the big picture, not a lot of bands call themselves Death Metal and play the sick, slow, dirgy stuff. I guess they call it gay “stoner” now. Remember when it used to be called DOOM METAL??

b. Well obviously we’ve picked up the pace a bit!! Theres only so many times you can hit an open E chord over a slow drum beat. Now were doing open E over faster beats!! Har Har! Seriously, slow heavy shit was just the order for that time for us. Mainly we got Andy on drums and he was more capable to handle faster stuff after Jeff left, so things just got faster from there. We haven’t completely abandoned our death-dirge roots though.

Over the course of development, Cianide has landed – for lack of a better phrase – into the category of “old school death metal,” joining luminaries such as Asphyx and Morpheus Descends. How do you think this music is different in its aim from other forms of death metal?

For us, we’re just playing the music that WE want to hear. If people call it “old school” well fuck, we are old school! I can’t speak for any other bands, but for us, this is the only way we know how to do it. It’s hard to pin down because nowadays bands like Cannibal and Morbid Angel are labeled “old school” but I think you must be referring to an actual “old school” sound. If that’s what you mean, you could say a band like CIANIDE is sort of a preservation of very early death metal. We’re not looking to break any new ground with this, nor do we have any aspirations for commercial success (though that would be nice if it came along!!), just trying to emulate the sound and style of the ancient GODS OF DEATH.

Someone once drew the distinction between hum-along metal like Motörhead or Venom, and “subversive metal,” meaning stuff that tries to be avantgarde, progressive or regressive. It seems to me that no band since Venom has captured the sense of popular and hum-along (really, is there a better term for this? songs that stay in your head and are relevant to aspects of everyday normal life) metal in the same way Cianide has, with bouncy, heavy, catchy songs hammering home simple ideas in smoothly integrated structures. How did you achieve this, and what are your thoughts on the accuracy of these statements? (I am no big fan of the hacked together terms like hum-along and subversive, but for now am not sure what I’d use in their place except extensive tedious descriptions)

I agree with the statement and take it as a compliment! Again we just write what we like and want to hear. Every riff we write has to fucking kill, no filler songs or parts with CIANIDE as far as I’m concerned. Bands with catchy choruses is the style of metal that we grew up with so it only makes sense that we would emulate that. Even stuff like early Death, Terrorizer, Repulsion, Massacre and even Morbid Angel had choruses that you could consider “catchy”. I can appreciate bands that play overly technical, but most of the time I prefer something that sticks in my head and kicks my ass.

Cianide seems to have stayed with no single label for more than an album. Is this true? Are there reasons the band had for doing this, or was this a product of what I call the “usual label chaos,” e.g. labels falling apart, dropping bands at random and going bankrupt?

Our first label, Grindcore merely changed their name to Red Light so our first two releases were basically on the same label. They went chapter 13, so we did DDD with Lost Horizon. That label was basically two friends of ours wanting to do a label. They were flipping the bill and nobody was asking us to dance at the time so we said, “what the fuck”. They went belly up also. Merciless re- released DDD on vinyl and did our latest, Divide and Conquer and are all set to our our forthcoming “The Age of Hell’s Rebirth”. So far so good.

Someone once told me I was not “open-minded” for automatically hating some band that attempted to merge alternative rock and metal; what do you think?

Liking different styles of music is actually just a matter of taste and really has nothing to do with having a so-called “open mind”, which has been such an over-used term ever since the 80’s that it is now pointless and irrelevant to label anybody as such (closed minded). What this egotistical person actually means is, ‘my opinion in music is much better than yours because I have no real convictions and simply like what is deemed “cool” by the mainstream, even though I think I’m hip and into new and crazy things just to impress ditzy college girls’.

Tell that person to stick his alternative/metal/rock/bastard hybrid up his open-minded ass.

Metal has changed in demographic since the so-called “glory (hole) days” of 1988-1994, with a broader and bigger audience now tuning in to even the most antisocial black metal. What changes do you think this demographic has caused to occur in the music itself?

From what I can see, when a band achieves some sort of success be it either underground or commercial, the band will try to write what it thinks is popular in an attempt to “keep up with the times” (ie. Entombed, Morgoth, Mayhem). On the other side of the coin, if a band is successful and stays true to their original ideals, they still will get dismissed by all the death-metal weenies and black metal trendies who are only into listening to shitty bands that YOU never heard of. So in essence, nothing has really changed.

Will you ever work to re-release the old Cianide albums?

There has been talk about re-releasing the first two on vinyl but nothing serious as of yet. We are planning on putting all our demos out on a double cd, with all kinds of extras and shit. Should rule.

A Descent Into Hell seems to me, sonically, to be one of the “heaviest” albums ever created, and not just through production – how did you achieve this, and what was your aim in creating that album? (see disclaimer above about hacked together terms again)

Again, we just do what we do. I think at that time we were tuned to like Z or something. We did all of those songs live, most only in one or two takes. The kicks and snare were sampled though. I remember after we got done doing the first song, the engineers came in and they were like, “everything sounds good guys but we do need more bass” we thought they were serious. Then they started laughing at us and they were like, “jeezzzzus, you guys are FUCKING HEAVY!!” “Decent…” is also a personal favorite of mine. I think it’s impossible to get that sound back again but who knows…………..

Has Cianide toured, or is it more of a band that you do when not leading a normal life?

Tour?? Shit, we’re lucky we play out once a year!! The time for touring is past. We’re smart enough to realize early on that playing underground metal, be it Black, Death or otherwise, wasn’t going to be a very lucrative career choice. Insecure “we’re truer than thou” hard-on’s would probably classify us as hobbyists, and they may be right. A hobby is defined as any activity that one enjoys in their spare time. Though I guarantee you this, we’ll still be doing what we do long after today’s hip-name-to-drops have changed their style/names/haircuts and end up in the washed up file cut-out bins.

To put it bluntly, what are you guys like in real life? Are you closer to maniacs who live out the lyrics to cianide songs, or artists who metaphorically describe what they perceive?

We’re just your above average beer swilling metalheads. What you see is what you get. No tattoos, no gay piercings. Dirty, Ugly, loud and proud!

One other thing about Cianide that is gratifying: a sense of humor. What do you see as the role of humor in “serious” metal? Do you consider Cianide a serious band? If not, what motivates you to have the standards you do in the creation of the music?

I’m not really into “joke” or “message” bands. Injecting humor into Metal can be tricky. It’s hard to do it correct without sounding lame. Obviously we’re not a joke band, but we like to inject some humor, like our thank you lists are always filled with jags. POST MORTEM were the originators of that. At least that’s who we stole it from!! I love who I am and love being a Metalhead. But there are some people out there who take this music and themselves way too seriously who are just rubbers. It’s just music after all. Who know’s though, I’m sure to some people it looks like I take it too seriously. The grass is always greener……………

If you could tour with any two death metal bands in history, which would they be?

Slaughter – original line-up
Master – original line-up

What do you think of the following:

1. Asphyx – I have “The Rack” on cassette…..good heavy death metal
2. Master – The early stuff is immortal…the new stuff ain’t so bad
either
3. Suffer (SWE) – never heard them
4. Kittie – never heard them
5. Carnage (SWE) – Entombed clones

Do you have any views on religion? How religion effects politics? How this affects us now?

Religion and politics are needed to keep the general population in line. I think they’re both brilliant. You can’t have people just running wild, doing what they want. It sounds good on paper and makes for a lot of cool lyrical ideas, be it Metal, Punk or otherwise, but when you return back to the real world the majority of people out there simply cannot handle the responsibility of being an individual, and I don’t want to deal with them. It’s not my job.

Religion, of course, does make some men better, and perhaps even many men. There can be no doubt of it. But making them better by filling their poor heads with grotesque nonsense is an irrational and wasteful process, and the harm it does greatly outweighs the good. If men could be made better — or even only happier — by teaching them that two and two make five there would be plenty of fools to advocate that method, but it would remain anti-social none the less. If the theologians could only agree on their doctrines their unanimity might have some evidential value, just as the agreement of all politicians that the first duty of the citizen is to obey them and admire them has some evidential value. It may not be true, but it is at least undisputed by all save a small fraction of heretics, which is certainly something. Fortunately for common sense, the theologians are never able to agree. Even within the sects, and under the more rigid discipline, there is constant wrangling, as, for example, between the Jesuits and the Dominicans. Thus the cocksureness of one outfit is cancelled out by the ribald denial of all the rest, and rational men are able to consign the whole gang to statistics and the Devil.

– Henry Louis Mencken

What are your views on wealth, and its ideal relationship to individual humans?

People who go around saying, “money isn’t everything” are usually already rich and never had to work hard to achieve their wealth/success. Give me enough money so I don’t ever have to work again in my life and I’ll show you one happy, fat little man!!!

Do you support or reject anti-bestiality laws?

Hey, whatever blows yer skirt up!

What in your view are the a) strengths and b) weaknesses that metal took on by going “underground” instead of attempting to be a mainstream genre?

For one thing, since all true metal is underground it is not scrutinized and kept in check by the politically correct mainstream. Bands can say and write whatever they feel without any pressure of pissing this one off or offending others. Imagine how lame your favorite metal bands would become if they had to kow-tow to the whole music industry just to create music. I have one word for people who may disagree with this: METALLICA!! I love the fact that metal is underground. The people who want it know where to get it. It sucks for the bands who I’m sure need to play to eat, but that’s not my problem.

What do you think of nu-metal? Can metal ever be in the mainstream, like it was with Black Sabbath?

Any band can get big if marketed properly and shoved down the masses throats. For instance, if MTV tells their audience that Christraping Black Metal is “cool” and says that the bandmembers are “cute”, all Black Metal bands would get huge and you would not like them anymore. Sabbath were/are huge, but in their day, they never got any radio airplay (except for “Paranoid” late at night), let alone videos. They just did it through word of mouth and constant touring. As for nu-metal, it’s just like the 80’s. Instead of big- hair you have buzz-cuts. Instead of eyeliner you have piercings. Instead of glamed out clothes you have tribal tattoos. The music is just a watered down, bastardized, marketed and hyped version of the real deal.

Does metal keep evolving, or is it cyclic?

Everything is the same, just different haircuts!!

What’s the next Cianide album going to be like?

Just like the last one, except HEAVIER!!

Will you ever do a live album?

Hopefully someday. Guess you need to play live to do that!!!

What is your stance on mp3 trading of rare materials?

It doesn’t affect me either way, if I hear something I’ll just go out and buy it.

I’m the same way, if I like something, I’ll go and buy it. I have other things to do on my computer than sitting there waiting for a song to download, like looking for porn!! I do think it’s good for people to hear what a band sounds like from their website etc before they go out and buy it. It’s just another medium.

Did Cianide have any demos? If so, what were they?

We did three official demo’s: “Funeral” in 1990, “Second Life” in 91′ and “Cianide Kills” in I think 1993. We also had 2 different three-song promos for DDD and Divide……, but those weren’t really for sale. Everything will probably be on a single release for CURSED PRODUCTIONS if we can get off our lazy asses and get started on it.

Are reactions to Cianide different in Europe and Asia versus the USA?

Reactions seem to be pretty much the same everywhere. We’re regarded as throwbacks from all over!!

Are there any metal zines or websites you read, and, if so, what makes them useful to you?

The only zines I’ll plug that come to mind are Metal Curse and Midwest Metal cuz they are cool!

Will metal survive the wave of hip-hop music in America?

It already is as far as I can tell. Rap is already regarded as a joke whose core audience is rich, white, suburban kids. Hip-hop and rap do provide a very important service to us Metal fans however for which I’m truly thankful: BY KEEPING A GREAT MAJORITY OF ALL MORONS, MEATHEADS AND FUCKUP’S OUT OF OUR SCENE!!!! Every time I happen to turn on some MTV special or video, I get a big smile and feel great inside. That’s right dummies, keep being spoon-fed your entertainment you mindless fools! Yo Dawg!!! Bling Bling!! Comedy!!

Does metal’s being different from jazz, blues, hip-hop make it a cultural or political statement?

The fact that underground metal is the only form of rock and roll that has yet to be turned into a marketable mainstream commodity surely says something. It almost happened to death metal in the early 90’s. Then Nirvana killed that, thankfully!! STAY UNDERGROUND!!!

Anything I forgot you’d care to add?

I think you covered it all my man!!

Thanks for the interview. Visit the official CIANIDE WEBSITE at www.cianide-metal.com

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Interview: Anders Odden (Cadaver)

Anders Odden is here with us from the band Cadaver, inc. He was an original member of Cadaver by its release schedule, and was with them on their two most popularly-known works on Earache records. He has now launched with others Cadaver, inc., which is an entirely different type of music within the same genre.

When did Cadaver form and what bands inspired the members at the time?

The first Cadaver was formed when a Black metal band called Baphomet split in 1988. We then got the bassplayer from Decay Lust and recorded the first album in 1989/90. The bands who inspired us at the time were Voivod, Slayer, Carcass, Celtic Frost and Morbid Angel.

Do any of you have strong political, religious, or philosophical beliefs, and what are they?

I’m a public enemy. I doubt that anything created by man ever will bring us to a higher level. I deny the church and all its powersymbols. Why is it that all the main religions come out of the middle east?! Religon and politics are there to oppress people. I feel the life we have today is basically without any goals and I’d like to own a little stuff as possible. I tend to get lots of shit piled up anyway, but I’m a fan of throwing stuff away. I dont know, maybe I’m full of BS…

If a drunken man falls down the stairs, he does not feel what would be painful for me. Some say the same applies to youthful indifference to death. How do you feel this influenced, if at all, your music?

I don’t think it had anything to do with what our music was. We just wanted to be able to play as good as our favorite bands, nothing more.

Did you have any favorites in the Swedish death metal genre? What did you think of God Macabre, Demigod, Dismember and Therion?

Not really. Of the bands you mention I’ve only heard Dismember and Therion. I like Black metal more than death metal.

Now that you’ve come back with Cadaver, inc., are people responding to the older material as well as the newer? Are you going to repress the first two albums?

We have played Innominate and Corrosive Delirium from Hallucinating and Mr. Tumour’s Misery from In pains… live. Those songs go down really well, but Earache has no plans for reissuing yet. It will be done some day with lots of extrastuff on it I guess. I have tons of live, demos and unreleased shit around my house, so it will be done.

It seems to me that …In Pains is from the same era as the first Darkthrone album, where metal experimented with mood and mellower textures in the death metal style. What inspired this album’s genesis?

This is easy to say now looking back. It’s never in your thought when you make stuff what the historic aspect of things will be. In Pains was released around the same time as Blaze in the Northern sky, so I felt we were very different band then. In 1992 I turned into industrial music for some time and didn’t follow black metal until 95 again. I saw the death metal era end in 92/93 when black metal revitalized everything, but felt it was my past and didnt care that much. You got to remember that the difference between death/black wasnt that obvious before 91/92. Mobid Angel is the best example of a band in between the genres. I always wanted to gain that sort of independent ground for my stuff and this is where I feel Cadaver Inc. belong. Along towards the genres and trends.

The first album had a tuba player as a member of the band. While some called this a gimmick, it seemed a natural experiment at thetime, since the tuba provides a gnarly low-end sound that could complement higher guitars.

What do you think of this when looking back upon it, and for what reason was this choice made?

It was trombone. You have to remember that Celtic Frost inspired us very much in the experimenting with things such as this. Into the Pandemonium and To Megatherion have lots of “brass” sections and weird things in it. It is still our intro when we play live, so it’s a trademark I guess.

Who are your personal musical idols?

In metal it’s forever Slayer, Celtic Frost, Voivod and Morbid Angel. These bands offer their own personal twist that you can hear on all their records. Apart from this I’m a big fan of classical composers such as Grieg and Mozart. They are true genius.

If you recorded another album in the worldview of the original Cadaver, what do you think it would be?

It will never happen.

What’s next for Cadaver, inc? Are you planning to evolve further in the direction that seems to be current, or taking a different step?

We have started working on the next album and I can reveal that it’s going to be much darker than this one. If Discipline is a agressive record the next will be more insane. I have left some of the writing to our drummer Czral this time, and his ideas are very sick. It’s very inspiring to have a band with such a high level of musicalityflowing. We are sure the next record will bring us a long step forward and that’s our focus all the time.

You mention that you like throwing things away. This touches a part of all of us I think that wishes to be unencumbered by material things. I’ve noticed many of the more intelligent people I know choose to live light given the unstable nature of the times and the tedious requirements of having stuff. It also resembles the destruction of memories and irrelevant or enslaving alliances, metaphorically and in dreams (from the relation of others). Do you think that removal or consolidation of stuffs, let’s call it garbage removal, is philosophically significant at this time in history?

You are probably right that this is something lots of people now are turning to. I think it’s a reaction towards the main-religion now, which is consumerism. Some people feel very attached to their stuff, and I think it’s a disturbing thing to be this way. We think what we have is important to us, but it’s all tools or necessities for living. The last time I moved me and my wife gave away 5 (!) big plastic bags of clothing. It’s ridiculous to have so much to wear, and we said farewell to a time in our life by throwing it away. It made me think, how the hell did I get so much stuff. I could not remember buying it all or anything. It’s more important to gain selfrespect by doing something rather than buying yourself status. Money alone makes no-one happy, and that’s the bottom line in anyones life. Happiness.

What do you think are the similarities between black metal and industrial music?

I don’t know how anyone see the similarities. It all depends on your perspective about what you think is black metal or industrial. Industrial to me is Skinny Puppy and Front 242. They are not very close to BM.

It seems to me that both have a similar approach to rhythm, relative to death or heavy or speed metal, and that both also focus on atmosphere and originate in a classically-influenced genre. Do you like the music of Kraftwerk, Tangerine Dream and Einsturzende Neubauten?

I enjoy Kraftwerk yes. I just have one Einstrutzene album which is great, but I’ve never sat down to listen to Tangerine Dream.

I’m going to rip off a line from Wrath of Averse Sefira (who could name songs from Hallucinating Anxiety in detail when queried at random, not having heard the album in seven years) who said that Celtic Crost in many ways were the first to unify visual aspect, and presentation, of their band with the content of their music and its raw, gnarly aesthetic. in many ways, they birthed grandeur in metal also. Is this something you feel?

Well, they had it all for themself for a long time and came up with very original concepts for album covers, lyrix and musical experimentation. They took metal places it had not been before with their avant garde style of composing. I admire their original style very much and they are the only band I really want to see on a reunion tour.

I agree that Grieg and Mozart are genius. How much of the effect of classical music do you feel is a result of its form, or the abstraction of artistic form in general (in view of jazz, Hendrix and progressive derivations of classical in modern popular music), where form is defined as the method of artistic presentation itself relative to the content, or unique expression within, each work?

Classical music from the 18th century (Grieg, Wagner etc. ) was a result of anti-darwinism and used to show that humans were special and not animals. I think the extreme metal has many of the same thoughts behind it as it’s normally very strict and concrete when it’s performed. The kind of metal we play has no room for improvisation in the way of music with blues/jazz roots. Form and content belong together to produce the music we make. I dont know what you are compearing jazz and hendrix to this for, but maybe I didnt understand your question..(?)

Do you compose with emphasis on rhythmic expectancy, or write riffs for conclusive melodic phrasing?

It’s too abstract to say it this way. I just play what sounds good and experiment alot with strange chords and melodic lines. I’m a riffmaker who needs a great drummer to complete my ideas. I view the overall sound first and foremost.

I asked earlier: if you recorded another album in the worldview of the original Cadaver, what do you think it would be? and you said: “It will never happen.” If we created a temporary reality somewhere where someone like you and the original members of the band somehow came together now, independent of this reality entirely, what would the next Cadaver album sound like? Imagine outside influences of tedium like job, mortality, items, etc.

What was will never be again. I have so different views on music to the rest of the original members that it’s nothing I would even like to do for fun. We have no plans for this and I’m pretty sure it’s never gonna happen…

You mentioned that Czral was writing more of the material on this round. Are you still influenced by black metal and industrial, or reaching toward a different sound?

We have written 3 new songs now. Czral has one song which is entirely with his riffs, and the other 2 have 1 riff from him and 1 riff from LJ in it. It sounds very exiting to us right now, but we dont know where it’s taking us yet. It’s more midpaced tempos now, but the blastbeats are still there too. I dont know what kind of industrial you’re taking about, but it’s got some more black metal to it than “discipline” so far.

How do you write songs as a band? Have you taken advantage of virtual songwriting (sending MP3s, tapes, WAVs, CDRs, to each other)?

We have 1 rehearsal a week were we try to complete 1 song each time. It’s a very ambitious project, but it’s forcing us to work on ideas all the rest of the week. We just meet now and then to check out riff and ideas with each other at home. We all live pretty close so that’s why it works.

I saw a little of your Milwaukee Metalfest performance last year (I think – I was wasted, and never visited the bar – it may have been a couple years ago) and it seemed like the music acquired a very linear quality with the tunneling dynamics of the hall. What would it be like to write music if you practiced in a huge thunderous concert hall?

That would have been useless. We play with volume down to hear all details and work towards recording in a studio, so the less noisy the better. I’m not 15 years old anymore…

I like the idea of practicing softly for better discernment. Do you play any acoustic instruments? By the same principle, they must also strengthen musicianship.

I play the piano and acoustic guitar too yes.

Do any of the members of Cadaver, inc endorse any lifestyles including drugs, cannibalism, sodomy, genocide, war, polygamy, polyamory or Judeo-Christian homegrown goodness?

We are so different people privately that I really don’t know that much about the rest of the guys in those terms. I don’t like bands that assure people they are normal all of the time. What is normal? I’m a creative person that seeks oppertunities for myself, and I work in the music-business fulltime. It’s lifestyle bound together by the music, all of the above is for people that needs a hobby. . .
very interesting. as a professional musician, you are here for musical reasons only. this explains the musical contributions of your works. what do you think are your largest contributions, as a musician, to the musical lexicon of death and black metal?

I dont know really. I find that the people who really remember what Cadaver did are mostly musicians themselves. It’s not easy for me to see what my contribution might be. Maybe it’s almost nothing so far, and that my real contribution will be in the future.

Anything else you’d like to talk about?

Another thing, I feel very much more in relation to the Black metal scene than the death metal scene of today. If you file Cadaver Inc. under anything, it should be black metal.

Thank you. Keep on buying CD’s so we can release as many as we can write!

This eternal accusation against Christianity I shall write upon all walls, wherever walls are to be found—I have letters that even the blind will be able to see. . . . I call Christianity the one great curse, the one great intrinsic depravity, the one great instinct of revenge, for which no means are venomous enough, or secret, subterranean and small enough,—I call it the one immortal blemish upon the human race. . . . And mankind reckons time from the dies nefastus when this fatality befell—from the first day of Christianity!—Why not rather from its last?—From today?—The transvaluation of all values! . . .

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Antichrist

Monotheistic religions alone furnish the spectacle of religious wars, religious persecutions, heretical tribunals, that breaking of idols and destruction of images of the gods, that razing of Indian temples and Egyptian colossi, which had looked on the sun 3,000 years: just because a jealous god had said, “Thou shalt make no graven image.”

– Arthur Schopenhauer, Religion: a Dialogue (1851)

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Interview: Lori Bravo (Nuclear Death, Raped)

the anus.com metal development team was lucky to catch lori bravo during a break from work with her new band, Raped. she was kind enough to consent to an off-the-cuff interview which had some remarkable results.

as those who are fans of early death metal know, lori and her band nuclear death were instrumental in developing the genre in its early days. still carrying touches of thrash from the previous generation, she and her bandmates forged forward with a unique and devastating style of music. read on to learn what inflames her passion and willpower toward the making of metal.

Nuclear Death sounded to me like it descended halfway from the progressive extremist speed metal (“thrash”) of the previous decade, mixing that with its fundamentally deathy influence. If you could name something that you’d heard in the time leading up to the creation of the nuclear death works, what influenced you the most?

I would say…Discharge,Venom,Mercyful Fate,Black Flag and Russian Classical.

What art do you enjoy outside of metal?

Actually…I do not listen to alot of ‘metal’…..I am into punk and hardcore, jazz and fusion, classical, indie-rock…..and of course the works of Goya, Picasso, Bosch, Giger, Mapelthorpe, Giger, Rimbaud, Smith, Morrison, Plath, Baudelaire, Whitman, Kerouac, Manson, Wilde, Cobain, Saffo……..etc.

Do you consider art to have relative grades of complexity?

Of course…but I also….believe the most simplest of lines can be most complex in nature.

Is your current band metal, or a metal fusion? i ask because many metal artists choose after an underground success to turn to the mainstream somewhat, mostly looking for new worlds to conquer.

I do not believe that I have even achieved what you dubbed as ‘successful’…..My new band is called RAPED…and it is a fusion of my anger,jealousy,hatred,hopefulness and liberation from boyfriends,bullshit and sexism!!!I call it arte-sexed-dark-edged-fuckyourface-off music….or GRRRLCORE!!

What do you think about drugs, group sex and fascism?

Drugs are how we as a society seem to cope…I mean EVERYBODY’S on SOMETHING!!!Group sex is great…do it SAFELY….I am in the sex business..I strip….SAFTEY..PEOPLE….I CAN’T STRESS THAT POINT ENOUGH!!!Fascism in shit…but it is a big part of life…..I don’t think it is going to go away…so we,as artists,need to address the issue and alert the public on how much it ruins us internally and externally as many times as we can write a song ,paint a canvas, make a film or make a statement!

If you saw a black spot on a purely white wall, would you consider the wall to have an entrance, or the spot to have a boundary?

Entrance…I don’t beleive in boundaries…that is limited to me…I don’t like limits!!!!

What in your mind are the usefulness of these states: caprice and serendipity?

I Love impulsiveness in all things!!!! Spur of the moment……A whim of change….some of the best things are built from this lovely little spurt!Beautiful ‘accidents’…..serendipity is how I have managed to write every fucking thing that is good and paint a canvas that is worth viewing!!!!! I am a creative FUCKUP!!!

If you were suspended in a reality where another Nuclear Death album might be made, what in your mind might it sound like?

If Steve and I did another…I think it would be an in your face muse….RAPED is the result of what ND spawned.

If you had four minutes to give advice to a young metal band, it might be…?

Don’t sign anything without a lawyer, never compromise your principles, be yourselves, listen to your inner voices and take NO shit!!!!

What do you think about commerce, morality and the holiday of Easter?

Trade and buy/sell rules the world…enjoy it…Sexually-speaking…let’s fuck!Even I have morals…..Have CLASS people! You can be Hardcore without losing your integrity….Easter…..I like the iconography aspects and rituals…..rising from death…aint it sweet…..Bunnies for everyone!!!!!

I like the shorter song format with some bands, offhandedly naming Carcass and DRI, as it allows a fragment of a consciousness to momentarily express itself and vanish, where a full song might have to artificially include other subject matter to flesh out the shit. Then again, if you write your lyrics when wasted or careless, what flows might be pure subconscious dialogue and therefore might be effective. It seemed to me some study went into the Nuclear Death lyrics, no matter how hasty their creation. What sorts of ideas and systems of thought were influencing you at the time?

Alcohol,drugs,reading,sex,fear and dreams.

What do you think of capitalism, Christianity and Zionism?

Good and bad….I hate corporate-owned anything…but what are you going to do….do it yourself and put it on the net……christianity has been so fucking twisted and raped of its origins and beliefs,honestly,I think Christ would want to kill those fuckers,I believe every people should be able to ‘go home’…we all deserve our place.

Are you a large fan of any mainstream media?

I am pop cultured,you know? I like anything that I find interesting!

Often relationships in bands are as stressed as two cops dating. Do you have any advice in the most general sense in this area?

Fuck….it’s a marriage,respect eachother.

Do you own guns or dogs, and what kind of vehicle do you drive? Do you see these questions as destructive to the persona of a metal artist and therefore not worth answering? I hope so, but if not let me know. I want one of the new glock .357s to take out that pesky streetlight.

I own a 45 and a single-shot….I am slave to 5 cats…I cycle..I never have driven.

The aura combined of artistic form and content that is metaphorically relevant in a wrenching evocation of the sickness and desires of the current time, if present intelligently, can form the basis for powerful metal. Do these ideas “strike a chord” with any of your own?

I think we are a highly intelligent form of music…..we present to the listener what one may or may not want to face.Look…if you have shit lyrics…I don’t care how great the music is…..I won’t give you a second thought.

Do you have plans to write a book?

Yes……I have poetry,as well as a tell-all in the worx

If i were a gangbanger, anytime I shot someone, I’d say “you’d better hope for reincarnation!” Do you think reincarnation is likely, or is it another for the “wishful thinking” file?

I think it is bullshit…..This is MY fucking unique soul..when I die that is it!

Have you heard Burzum, Dead Brain Cells or Absurd?

No….turn me on……

What do you think are the faults of www.anus.com/metal, and why do you think many people hate us?

Because you are too intelligent for most dumbfuck metal-heads…..fuck ’em…you RULE!!!!

Do you visit any bulletin boards, chat rooms or use an instant messenger?

Oh yes….My s/n is insectbride…..I am a member of Hole’s message board,Distillers,TSOL’s…oh yessssssssss!!!!

Is Saddam Hussein a CIA plant?

Could be…..dunno….I think he is an android.

If you had no limitations and could make any music you would choose, how would your music differ?

Listen to RAPED….I have no limitations!!!!I know what I like.

What makes Arizona for you an attractive place of residence? After I drove through I considered moving, as it had a laid backness to the city.

I hate it…..That is why I am moving to LA,permanently in May!!!!I love the filth,corruption,trashedout ways of big cities…I am from Chicago…for fuxsake!!!!

Many thanks for any answers you can do. Some of these questions will be unanswerable, but I have designed them based on your other interview so that you will have fun with them, I hope. I will send you finished copy and we’ll cut any that don’t succeed. Hails and vomits…

..Thanx…I had a great time with your interview…….one of the best I have gotten in a while…..actually, I found ALL answerable!!!! I can rap for hours,Love…….New Nuclear Death/RAPED contact is my Email!!!!

IN DEATH AND CRUELTY….VO/Lori

The Christian concept of a god—the god as the patron of the sick, the god as a spinner of cobwebs, the god as a spirit—is one of the most corrupt concepts that has ever been set up in the world: it probably touches low-water mark in the ebbing evolution of the god-type. God degenerated into the contradiction of life. Instead of being its transfiguration and eternal Yea! In him war is declared on life, on nature, on the will to live! God becomes the formula for every slander upon the “here and now,” and for every lie about the “beyond”! In him nothingness is deified, and the will to nothingness is made holy! . . .

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Antichrist

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Interview: David Renteria, Reggio Galang and Necrolover (Bane)

We’re all used to “black metal bands from North America” meaning something more hilarious than any hollywood sitcom, but a few bands have stood out over the years in their ability to keep with a task and develop their music according to a personal musical vision. From the sprawling concrete hell of the inland empire, bane shared a few moments with us to talk about their philosophy, music and methods of postmodern survival.

Bane founded right after the first rush of black metal, and you’ve waited out the last five years of stupid shit going on in the genre. What have you learned and how are you approaching your task differently?

Well we never really planned on waiting any time. We released the album when we were ready. I’m not really aware of many stupid things or many things having to do with the genre right now, other than the fact that during the last few years very few of the new or follow up releases from bands that I knew nothing of or admired greatly, have paled in comparison to work prior. It always seems that when we have moot that thought, about what’s going on, we always come to the conclusion that we all are very different people with different taste, for music, philosophy, ideology and instinct, and we are so out of the musical genre, subgenre, sub-subgenre loop. We all seem to live mentally recluse only to come together in a very interestingly creative symposium. DR

I personally didn’t care for the whole blackmetal/deathmetal battles we make brutal music for brutal people with hope to enlighten a few the whole pissing contest is stupid just fucking play brutal music. We didn’t wait on our release really it was all circumstantial, we released it when we were done and happy with the outcome of our album hell we would of released it in the middle of the whole black metal rush we didn’t care.-Necro

What inspires you when looking at a conceptual place to a start the formation of a song, during the songwriting process?

We all seem to draw inspiration through different means. Lyrically we have drawn inspiration through a lot of reading, philosophy, true crime, news, retrospective thought about experiences, social and mental anxiety and relief. Musically we have had moments of pure creative flow as a symposium, and at other times we have gathered the spark of creativity through deep introspection. It’s a really wide variable we all seem to have our own unique way of bringing ideas to the table. Reggie and I at times have shared ideas digitally only to realize that organically the ideas do not work and vice versa. DR

When it comes to creating music we don’t really have a set formula. Everytime we start its from a different angle. On the upside it makes the creating each song exceptional from the rest of the songs. Because we don’t dwell on making status queue music and repeat other formulas it leaves us with more room to play with different ideas. It’s not even a process its more of an explosion [that] we try to piece back together and we find that there is a different solution to the puzzle. As far as writing lyrics, it consumes every topic we can conjure. As far as music goes, that is even more complicated. BANE keeps changing and metamorphosing the ideas all the time. Shit, just when I think its set here comes another change but it always sounds better and keeps me on my toes. I feel that because everyone in BANE is a powerful contributor of ideas from different sides of the spectrum that it leads our music to be more different everytime and it is a growth not a decline. Necro-

Friedrich Nietzsche may/may not have been a racist. How do you feel about this? (I ask as you cited him in an earlier interview, and I always find this question intriguing)

I am of the explorer type, I don’t tend to lend my values to other peoples words, I search for interesting points of views, inspiring points of views I tend not to judge people by their color of creed so much as by their actions and thoughts. I’m not a racist nor do I really care whether Nietzche or Gobineau were. Racism is such a petty thing for people to base hatred upon. Leave the hate for religion…lol… DR

I think when it came to Nietzche’s writings people took the interpretation with what they already had in mind. You get a skinhead to read Nietzche he’ll tell you the superman was the Arian race, you take a dreamer to read the same thing he’ll tell you the superman was comic book hero. People are gonna take what’s already contaminating their heads and interpret Disney flicks metaphorical speaking of the SS Reich 2003. I agree with David that racism is a petty thing to base hate on [as] there are way more justifiable reasons to hate for instance stupidity. Necro-

Friedrich Nietzsche stated that liberalism, Christianity and Judaism were the greatest enemies of humankind. Do you agree?

I think that ignoramus thought(that’s one hell of an oxymoron), is our greatest social enemy, whether it stem from liberalism, christianity or judaism. DR
Ignorance is definitely a killer, but far worse when the truth is in front of you and you fail to see it or you see it, acknowledge it and then deny it. The one thing that’s more threatening to humanity than stupidity is stupidity with out the desire to learn. I don’t know I think bell bottoms are pretty threatening too, along with Mc Donalds food, it’s threatening, and lets not forget the evil and vile vegans; they threaten humanity don’t you think David? Necro-

What angers you the most about the church?

To be completely honest, religion really doesn’t really bother me so much anymore, it’s one of those things that we are just to small to do anything about. Religion to me has become that pesky little mold that clings to your shower tile crevices that you become accustomed to ignore. And when you do decide to muster up some will to scrub your little fanny off in attempt to wipe it all out one square at a time, you realize that it’s just going to come back it better to worry about the mold in your cheese, the little we consume. DR

I can make a list and I don’t want to bother doing it right now cause I may run out of material for lyrics lol. Buy the CD and read it, my answer will be there. I think those of us who seek a higher purpose and make our own paths rather than to serve a master and have the path chosen for you, already know what is disgusting about it and even the servants of the fictional icon know that it’s disgusting they are just afraid. Hell we all know. Necro-

When all emotional responses are done with, what is your logical response to Christianity/Judaism/liberalism/et al?

Like I said……..whatever…… DR

These topics are always gonna be never ending battles with everyone. With BANE, we all seek a higher purpose than the labels you have mentioned which comes to my answer to that which is fuck it those who seek to be awakened will realize that the -ism is just another idea and must seek your own. Necro-

What do you think are the primary differences between Nietzsche and Schopenhauer, and how do you see this affecting the use of these philosophies in the modern time?

Simple…Will to live, vs. will to power, will to create. I definitely take Nietzsche’s point of view in what his perception society should be. Nietzsche’s is more the artists’ philosophy here. In a sense there would be no art if people would not empower themselves to achieve(in full disregard that their achievement will have no real affect on the outcome of what is to become of the universe and/or modern time) rather than survive. I would rather write songs than sit around and make fire or hunt all day. Schopenhauer and Spinoza=platitude. DR

I would definitely be an artist rather than just a regular John Doe. Creators are gods in their own rite. BANE is a gathering of destroyers for a better creation. To always seek for a stronger evolution. Necro-

What kind of person, intellectually or in any other vector, do you see as being drawn to Bane’s music?

Hopefully other explorer types, someone who is looking deeper, or looking to look deeper other musical artists…..but probably just a bunch of aggressive types. DR

I’ve noticed that those who see BANE for the first time or just at face value will be the aggressive type. In our hopes it would be that they seek for more than just face value. The people who are more consistent with BANE are always looking for more depth; these people are few and far between we truly hope to see more of these people. But BANE is a brutal/deathmetal band so its expected to see those engulfed with chaos but it doesn’t mean they can’t be intellectuals. In the end it doesn’t matter we all attend shows, buy CD’s, buy shirts to support the scene, we take everything with it like I’ve said before may we hail a great victory. Necro-

It has been a long road for you guys to get to the first CD release party. What were some of the obstacles, and what are you going to do once the CD is cut, to celebrate?

We haven’t had a release party for our CD’s yet, but we are in the process of arranging one pretty soon. The obstacles we had to encounter were mainly how to finance and mass produce our CD’s for the first pressing. Other personal obstacles within the band(line up changes) we’re dealt with before we began pressing the CD’s. We celebrated as a band the same weekend we’ve received our CD’s. It wasn’t anything big, mainly with acquaintances and close friends. The CD release party show is in the works and we’re contacting bands to play for this occasion. Otherwise, we’ll let ya know how the celebration went afterwards! RG
It has been a long hard road we’ve encountered more bullshit than we expected. The obstacles were many, but I think we learned a lot from it (in a very brutal fashion) but were very happy with the outcome of the CD, the direction of the band, the growth and creativity we have with each other. As far as celebrating I think we’re not done yet lol we still go nuts over it, but think as major celebration we’ll work on the next album.-Necro

Do you think that black metal bands should sing in their native language and have ethnic/cultural associations? e.g. Norwegians singing in Norwegians, Chinese in Chinese, and bands like Melechesh attacking the roots of their own culture?

They can sing whatever they want. It’s none of our business to tell what they can and can’t sing. If they’re more comfortable singing in their own language, so be it. If they’re more comfortable singing certain topics/issue in their own language, then let them do it. Let them express themselves. On the other hand, it’s rather stupid, inexpressive and even hypocritical to label one’s music like “Swedish black metal from Oregon” or “Melodic Norwegian death from Orange County.” It doesn’t work that way but, whatever tickles their pickle…RG

This topic doesn’t interest me what-so-ever. I’m bored. I’ll go to the next question.-Necro

Do you think Zionism and liberalism are inseparable, as Nietzsche does?

I don’t know that’s a tough one, I guess they both involve a lot of expectations from the ruling powers involved. Who knows. DR

Ultimately, there is an order of rank among states of the soul, and the order of rank of problems accords with this. The highest problems repulse everyone mercilessly who dares approach them without being predestined for their solution by the heigh and power of his spirituality. What does it avail when nimble smarties or clumsy solid mechanics and empiricsts push near them, as is common today, trying with their plebeian ambition to enter the “court of courts.” Upon such carpets coarse feet may never step: the primeval law of things takes care of that; the doors remain closed to such obtrusiveness, even if they crash and crush their heads against them.

For every high world one must be born; or to speak more clearly, one must be cultivated for it: a right to philosophy – taking that word in its great sense – one has only by virtue of one’s origins; one’s ancestors, one’s “blood” (Geblüt) decide here, too. Many generations must have labored to prepare the origin of the philosopher; every one of his virtues must have been acquired, nurtured, inherited, and digested singly, and not only the bold, light, delicate gift and course of his thoughts but above all the readiness for great responsibilities, the loftiness of glances that dominate and look down, feeling separated from the crowd and its duties and virtues, the affable protection and defense of whatever is misunderstood, whether it be god or devil, the pleasure and exercise of the great justice, the art of command, the width of the will, the slow eye that rarely admires, rarely looks up, rarely loves

– F.W. Nietzsche, Beyond Good and Evil

Pornography was also something you mentioned in another interview. Do you feel that iconography is dangerous, as Nietzsche did? If so, how do you feel about pornography — which pulls the sex process outside of the lives which normally would generate it — is affecting your own processing of events?

I see nothing wrong with pornography. I think in a sense pornography can be helpful. Pornography gives the facility of a third person perspective, one that may help you realize a spectrum of lovemaking that you had failed to see while in the act, just like how a sports team studies its opponent before a confrontation…well maybe not exactly like that but you know what I mean …right? right? DR

LOL! I think that pornography is great. I would not put anyone down for watching it or being open about it. I believe that people feel threatened by it because they are trained to believe that sex is dirty (if it’s not dirty it’s not done right), but even in a marital point of view why do you think people cheat on each other. Maybe if people were more open about there desires there would be less infidelity, and maybe that’s what’s affecting people’s processing of events. Take it for what its worth.-Necro

Please give brief commentary on the following: Buddhism, fuzzy logic and sine curves; for extra points, unite all three concepts in the analytical method of your choice.

Well…Buddhism a very interesting philosophy, in which aspirations are to be at one with nature, with the universe, based upon “virtuous”(that’s a whole other topic) living, fuzzy logic expresses the need for a sense of between when speaking of the binary world, when speaking of strict two sidedness, and well sine curves are a way of graphing the relativity of the size of an angle to its sine…And with all that said, in a sort of grope like way, I think they all lead access to a more holistic perception of what is truth, a wider spectrum, a wider scope of what reality is or can be, that is, for someone that chooses to or realizes that a wider spectrum of perception is what they want. DR

If you had absolute knowledge, how do you think you would view sex? Pornography? Christianity? The right wing in America?

From a high place. DR

Number one how would I view sex? I’d be having more sex than viewing!

Number two how would I view pornography? Go back to answer number one.

Number three how would I view Christianity? In a fucked up way!

And number four how would I view the right wing in America? Go back to number three.lol!

I know these answers were not what you wanted but I was amused for 2 seconds.-Necro

Do you believe in reincarnation? If you are a materialist like Nietzsche, do you see there being any possible connection between nothingness or infinity, or is the only transcendence possible purely in the ideal, and of a non-“real” nature?

My Idea of what is real and achievable is and infinite goal, a long reach towards potentiality, ascension through what may be nothing really but a quest toward self realization. A goal unattainable maybe but a goal worth aspiring towards. Musically as ideally. DR

Reincarnation is funny to me like recycling souls! What does a person whom believes in reincarnation hope for? A better life the next time around? What counts is what you do here without any speculations of what might be “the after life” I would rather keep my goals in the mind and body for it’s when you can indulge in them. I agree with David that is to aspire constantly and when the goal is met set another one. To always hunger never be satisfied. Nothing wrong with enjoying vanity and the material, I wouldn’t want to be consumed by it but rather keep looking further and deeper even if its antiquated and ugly. To put my ism in a stupid fashion I want to bliss without being ignorant.-Necro

When you hear that a lot of people think something is a good idea, you
a) suspect their motives
b) trust the something
c) scream “FUCKING SHEEP!” and leave the room
d) become wary of larger forces than the individual?

E. Violently moot everything that comes out of their mouths. DR

F. First off trust nothing. Inspect and dissect the something. Watch these sheep revel in this something, as I revel in that sheep aren’t individuals and come back and realize once again that the larger forces are only the status queue mutating with the new generation of the heard and walk against the heard in hopes of figuring out how to kill the something! Necro-

Do you like any of these bands? The Crystal Method, Orbital, Biosphere, Autechre, Kraftwerk, Das Ich?

I apologize for being ignorant and out of sync with the music world outside but who, who and who?!? RG

I know of das ich im ok with this band. Necro-

What black metal bands most influenced your music?

I don’t really see our music being heavily influenced by much black metal, subconsciously, all of our strong racist hate towards the Spanish races stem from the love of Graveland though, j/k I think. Heeheehee DR

I like some black metal but I really cant define them as being any of our influences and lately I feel more influenced by my chaotic life than any other music. Necro-

It seems to me that most of metal is philosophically ignorant, excepting a few leaders. Any comment?

Music seems to be a reflection of what is going on in our environment as well as what’s going on within the ego of the being at bay. Looking to add a few notches to the philosophical spectrum of metal. DR

I hope to influence more people into philosophy, just as I hope to see more metal bands do the same for me. I always keep my search for new wisdom and knowledge hopefully people will see the same in BANE someday. All in all I thank your for challenging us with this interview. May we hail a great victory!

Thank you S R P (the GOAT!)

BANE is:

David Renteria (DR): Guitar
Reggie Galang (RG): Guita
Arturo Cotero: Drums
Necrolover (Necro): Vocals

Bane Homepage

From the start, Christianity was, essentially and fundamentally, the embodiment of disgust and antipathy for life, merely disguised, concealed, got up as the belief in an ‘other’ or a ‘better’ life. Hatred of the ‘world’, the condemnation of the emotions, the fear of beauty and sensuality, a transcendental world invented the better to slander this one, basically a yearning for non-existence, for repose until the ‘sabbath of sabbaths’ – all of this, along with Christianity’s unconditional resolve to acknowledge only moral values, struck me as the most dangerous and sinister of all possible manifestations of a ‘will to decline,’ at the very least a sign of the most profound affliction, fatigue, sullennes, exhaustion, impoverishment of life. For in the face of morality (particularly Christian, unconditional morality), life must constantly and inevitably be in the wrong, because life is something essentially amoral – in the end, crushed beneath the weight of contempt and eternal denial, life must be felt to be undesirable, valueless in itself. Morality itself – might morality not be a ‘will to the denial of life’, a secret instinct of annihilation, a principle of decay, trivialization, slander, the beginning of the end? And hence, the danger to end all dangers?…So then, with this questionable book, my instinct, an affirmation instinct for life, turned against morality and invented a fundamentally opposite doctrine and valuation of life, purely artistic and anti-Christian. What should I call it? As a philologist and man of letters, I baptized it, not without a degree of license – for who konws the true name of the Antichrist?- with the name of a Greek god: I called it the Dionysiac

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Birth of Tragedy

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Interview: MkM (Antaeus)

Editor’s note: this originally appeared in issue #3 of the zine “voices wake us…” (“Voices Wake Us…” Zine. $1ppd. voiceswakeuszine@hotmail.com) but it can be disseminated freely so long as this notice remains intact.

Questions by “Voices Wake Us…” Zine.
Answers by MkM (vokillz).

First off, what is your name and what part do you play in the band (instrument or vocals, etc.)?

vokalist, disease holder of AntaeuS. Satanik stigmata & preacher of the Void. 27 years old up to this day, non dead to most humans. Frontman & main voice for AntaeuS, I do speak for Him.

Now to the real questions. Black Metal’s legendary “first wave” included so many legendary bands like Mayhem, Darkthrone, and Immortal. Many conclude that the evolution of BM ceased after this period, so what do you think Antaeus’ relation is to the progression of the art? Is it justifiable to be merely more extreme? Can anything be added to the music at this point that has not been done already?

Black Metal does mix both ideology & musick, on this level, I would have to point out that most of nowadays bands have no linkz with the real meaning of this Art.Immortal never really took part of the bm kult, though their sound is very similar, their concept would be more based on northern landscapes, while bands like dark throne & mayhem had a more nihilitic death feels to the lyrikz & the aura was a bit more depressive in most cases.

We are payin hommage to those bands of the second wave, for their dedication in the early days & the message they did spread. We do evolve in the same vein, we hold the same message & our speech is based on hatred, denial of life & anything that would be related to “holyness” any religions wise, anything “human” related would be a target.

Black metal = SataN in its most strikt vision, we here speak of death, total death & the praise of the vortex that would swallow all. Though the utopia of such an ending is known of us, we do work in this way, spreading our disease & disgust of life and the concept related to it.

Sound wise, we are more extreme than the suscited bands, we couldn’t perform the same of art, for multiple reasons : we do breed violence more than depression (as individuals) & we do perform what we are & breath. The band is composed of 5 individuals more or less evolving on the Hate path. Me & Set being at the forefront of this, & since we are the main composer (him for the music & I being the sole responsible for any lyrikz & propaganda), we are the trademark of AntaeuS.

Also our approach is more destruktive than the “90s” gloomy approach of darkness, while they were opening gates of despair, we are opening gates of torment & pain.

Both are as effective, I truely find my inspiration in both, but violence is our key, our vektor.

Feel his pulse through us.

We are one stone of the edifice.

Black Metal is like a kathedral of Hate, it is not a question of evolution, the “evil”ution within takes place within the rankz of devotee evolving & praising the kult.

You have expressed dissatisfaction with the Cut Your Flesh and Worship Satan album as being too rushed in the studio. To me, I can say I do not think it harms the record and adds to the urgency of the album. However, you have a new album coming out and will this be different and in what way a “representation” of the band that we have not already seen?

Somehow you are right, now that the album is older to my ears (two years or so) I get to listen to it in different perspectives, not rekalling all the shitty detailz about its conception & its spreading.CYFAWS was a gathering of mostly old trackz, like demos & reh tracks, all gathered on the same full lenght. Only one track never appeared anywhere before the cd release (though I am not even too sure about that now, I should check the live tape on chanteloup creations…) also the cd had three different rekording on it, which was a bit messy & made it sound more like a recollection than anything else.

Now, I think that baphomet did allow the band to put all together the most efficient earlier track of the band (inner war, devotee, nihil khaos…) but a rerecording of the whole album would have been best, now that would be the main complain about this lp.

Also this album did cost us a lot of money, but I do not fool myself, it is the same way for many bands around here, still having labels to cash on your work without being fair to the band is something I will never tolerate. That made me freak out, the band never got a fuckin cent out of the sale of the band, considering it did reach around 3000 copies (which is amazing to us, we never expected this much) one could easily guess that we got massively fucked on this one.

DE PRINCIPII EVANGELIKUM the newest release presents a more compact release, being composed on a two years basis, the whole has a more “united” strukture & lyrikz wise, that did allow me to have something fully solid. This time the lyrikz are included, I had the time to type all in time so people will finally get to understand what lies behind antaeus, though it will remain obscure to most or simply fucked up.

DPE is less easy to get into, it took me a few month to get into some trackz myself, having one hell of a hard time to lay vokalz on those & get the whole strukture in the reh’ room

The band does reh’ around 6/7 hours per week in the reh’ room & more when we get nearer to live exp or studio rekording. We get ridd off a lot of material, our work is very serious & we are making sure to have the most efficient offering to the black metal kult.

I think that one thing that would lack on DPE would be the intro sektion that are truely important to me, this time the drummer & I did lack time to meet & do something of my taste, that is my main “negative critic” to the new album. Next release shall see a return to those sonic landscapes & all the frustration that did hide behind those.

Many BM bands are one-person projects (Burzum, Bathory, Taake, Krieg, Ildjarn, eventually Emperor, and at times Darkthrone). What is the band construct of Antaeus? How does the song-writing process work and who does most of the “legwork” for the band, ie: setting up gigs and record-related business. Any comments on past members or development of the band over time?

You would mention there strongminded individuals that had one hard time finding the right members to perform their art with, or simply couldn’t deal with others, due to ego conflikts.I was just a session member in the early days, being too busy with my zine & my distribution (& my former band)

When AntaeuS turned into a virus in me, I felt like it had to evolve further than the limitations that the main man back then had for it. I think that all took shape when I got hold of all the strukture of AntaeuS, getting set as main guitarist was the best move ever, since we have known each other for years & we had the same musikal taste (for the early 90s sound, nowadays we tend to listen to different aktz yet our basis are the same).

Drum wise, we decided to get ridd off the drum machine & never changed since.

Bass & rythm guitar wise, we might have had more than 20 different members within the band, but in 98 we did finally find the right one, being also involved in Eternal Majesty with whom we did a split demo back then. I did know them since they were working a lot with SPIKEKULT (since their first demo, “dark empire”).

Since then, the line up is perfekt & all of us are united & work on the musikal struktures.

For all the rest, interviewz, ideals, propaganda, kontaktz, ALL is done by me & me only. Mostly due to the fact that I am the only one speakin & writtin in english.

That does take a lot of my time, due to this I did stop all others implications (my zine, other bands & even spikekult for some months/years).

We do not seek gigs really, since conditions are always fuckin ridiculous or awful, I try to avoid to the max getting to play live, though we had two or three great shows since 94; mostly over the two past years.

Getting gas money & some beers seems to be the VERY best we could get in europe, even if we perform in front of 300 people… the cost to rent a place is so high that none could ever pay the band.

A couple reviews I’ve read of CYFaWS, while positive, have accused the band of not bringing anything new to the table. Stylistically, I would say that Antaeus is a) faster (I’d say only Krieg is as fast), b) more “grind”, c) less atmospheric, d) more brutal and divided into penetrating structures of noise than in an “epic” sense of many bands. Agree? What is the aesthetic you are going for here, other than just “fast.” Because it is definitely a unique and not just a retro sound.

I do agree with those reviewz, still we never did claim to bring anything to new, so I sometimes wonder why we are accused of that, just like we were lyin about it.True, we are faster, though I would use “more brutal” instead, since speed for itself doesn’t mean much to us, tons of swedish bands are playin hyper fast, but both the drumz & riffs are without any effects on the listener.

Brutality & Hate are the main faktors in AntaeuS sound, we do hold this pulse & seek to create such aura within any rekording of ours.

Our epic approach might be linked to the tension we do put in the rekordin process.

The grind aspect cannot be denied as well, musik wise, some bands are truely unique to me, but the message, most of the time, would be simply ridiculous or be the opposite of my ideas.

Older grind bands had more of a dark or sick approach compared to today’s fun/gore/political bands.

Hate is a large concept of the band. Does this reach over into politics at all? Many BM are clearly fascist, a politics based on hate, while others are nihilistic (and in that sense, partially anarchistic). Views of politics in yourself and in the scene?

Hate is anywhere, but most politics would serve some instead of others, while we support the death of ALL; all those fascist bands are always a source of interrogation in my kamp. All those linked to black metal & openly using both the sigils of SataNism & those of Nazism are creating a nonsense to me.the nihilistic part is often dealing with one hope for a brighter future, built on the ashes of nowadays society & values.

I do not have any hope of this kind, the only hope I have is tattooed on my chest.

Let’s go back on the nonsense, I don’t care about NS bands as long as they are not linked with black metal. Politics would limit the initial meaning of black metal.

NSBM seems more serious to the young than the “inverted cross”, since it would represent something more “socially involved”, having to deal with values that would be more “linked” to todays world & having more impact due to the importance of sigils (ie : the use of swastika or SS sigils are full of meaning & related to happening that took place less than a century ago). Politics are giving black metal a more “humanistic” approach, which I don’t really understand. I would understand sadistik exekution using SS symbols or funeral mist for their vision of death in general, but as far as “human values” are involved, I simply don’t get it.

Any individuals mixin bm with ns should realize that there is already a scene for that, anything metal related is more or less viewed as “outcast” due to the code of life (destruktive, alcohol, aggression)…

anyway when I think of those teens doing “sieg heil” here & there with their beers & long hair, they would be among the first to enter the gas kamp that does make me laugh

Death is the main goal anyway.

In what sense is Antaeus a “do it yourself” band that controls the aspects of recording, promotion, management, and production itself? You are clearly dedicated to the underground, but many people are not familiar with the metal underground as much as the more-established and cohesive American punk underground. How does the underground work and how much is Antaeus a separate entity from outside control and influence of labels, promoters, etc?

A would be my band then, since I would be responsible for most of those aspects.Being honest, I am not too aware of the punk scene, though got to meet up with some labels from around here pressing punk vinylz & their scene seemed much more “supportive” & less “inner war” in between labels & so on. I might have a wrong of it though.

I would be totally dedicated to one aspect of the ug scene, which I could describe as the only real scene, with true sick freakz & not wannabes & morons of any kind that would pollute the bm kult.

those idiots are numerous & for the past years, I would have spent way too much time on those inbreed fags instead on workin on my code of life & supporting what had to be supported with the scene (bands & labels wise). Now we are viewed as traitors to most, since we did sign to Osmose.

Osmose allows us a studio rekording budget & having the whole distribution in their hand, I could never deal with that myself, my daily job takes around 50 hours per week now (compared to 70 h per week for last year) which makes it nearly impossible to cope with the mail & any correspondance in general. Even reh’ with the band got closed to impossible for me. All is getting better now, but as far as I am concerned, if A didn’t sign to Osmose, all would have stopped. I couldn’t go on paying 300 usd per month for the band, not having enough to cope for my own living cost.

Now we do loose less cash, but we still loose. So when I get to read that we did become fucking rockstars or sell out, I might ask to whom did we sell out???

A band selling 5000 copies (which even ain’t our case) could never live out of it, I am sure that you are aware of that, but many readers out there that did write us do think that we do earn enough money with the band to live with….

It was ok to reply to those questions the first years, but after a while, it killed me that most people wouldn’t get how it workz…

But hell, we are talking about fuckin labels detailz & how bands are getting fucked most of the time

Right now with Osmose, all is doing ok, we just did spend around 400 usd for this one, (lay out & mastering) since we did excess a bit the budget allowed for the studio rekording.

How is the French “scene?” Are there many bands, zines, or venues to play in? Are there a lot of posers?

Scene in france is not my fave subjekt, I did support many bands from around here in the past, being proud of my “local scene”, but all those bands did fuckin backstabb us for no reasons or so. “allies of today are the backstabbers of tomorrow”, thus I don’t mention too much about bands from around here.There is a fair deal of akts though, most of them are amateurish to the core & spending more time in front of camera or doing shirtz than working on the musikal parts.

All of them are envious little morons who are offended when they realize it is not that “easy” to have a cd out. They all think that demos are useless & that the underground is just a chat room on the net.

For the older ones, we had either conflikts with them or totally different views.

Apart from a few dozen individual in the whole france, we don’t get along too much with individuals from around here.

I had my fair deal of war around here.

In the newer band ; dark opus & aosoth are among my faves

DEATHSPELL OMEGA must be the ultimate black metal band the traditionnal way. END ALL LIFE is without any doubt the best vinyl bm label, they must have by now the CYFAWS on lp out, & that is one Honour for us to be on that label.

Zines? well 666 is the best in the extreme bm/dm way, eternal fire was killer too but defunct (or simply no newz from them since long), stregoica was kult in its dayz, now they are doing ordealis rekords which is very promising (killer work from their part), deadfuckinchurch is a good zine but he said that his final issue will be the next…

Some distro are great too, like paleur mortelle & warchangel.

AntaeuS will have a split 10″ with AOSOTH on Paleur Mortelle (akhaeus@aol.com) in the comin month btw.

Gigs wise, the audience is way better than any us gigs that I got to visit (& I had my fair deal of us deals over the three or four stayz I did over there), we usually get from 150 to 400 nowadays, but places are not so numerous & each venues does cost around 2000 to 3000 usd to rent for a night, with such prices, no bands would get any payment, asking for gas payment is already a dream for bands.

Due to that, in 2001, antaeus only performed live Once.

We did perform a bit more over the past months, with bands like nargaroth, taake, enthroned, eternal majesty…

The last hellish gig we did do was in Paris with taake & enthroned, our best set ever since 2001

In nov 002 we will be among the opening bands for the DEICIDE european tour, we shall desecrate new countries & I do expekt that tour I must say.

It’s nothing you’d understand, but I do have something to say. In fact, I have a lot to say, but now is not the time or place. I don’t know why I’m wasting my time or breath. But what the hell? As for what is said of my life, there have been lies in the past and there will be lies in the future. I don’t believe in the hypocritical, moralistic dogma of this so-called civilized society. I need not look beyond this room to see all the liars, haters, the killers, the crooks, the paranoid cowards — truly trematodes of the Earth, each one in his own legal profession. You maggots make me sick — hypocrites one and all. And no one knows that better than those who kill for policy, clandestinely or openly, as do the governments of the world, which kill in the name of God and country or for whatever reason they deem appropriate. I don’t need to hear all of society’s rationalizations, I’ve heard them all before and the fact remains that what is, is. You don’t understand me. You are not expected to. You are not capable of it. I am beyond your experience. I am beyond good and evil, Legions of the night — night breed — repeat not the errors of the Night Prowler and show no mercy. I will be avenged. Lucifer dwells within us all. That’s it.

– Richard Ramirez

Most BM has diverged into “symphonic,” commercial crap. I’m sure you have some ventings on bands like this (Dimmu Borgir, Anorexia Nervosa, Ancient), or on “retro” bands like Dark Funeral. To many, Black Metal must remain underground and elite, and yet within it are elements that are more palatable to the masses- a band like Immortal proving that BM can be commodified over time. Thoughts on this phenomenon in Black Metal?

Like anywhere, when you get an artistic style that would be perceived as elitist & underground, one will have the wish to “extand” it on a different level, for various reasons.Some considers that the message should not be limited to one handful of individuals

some seems to think that they would sell more rekords having an “evil” image Some just find it “cool” to use such imagery Others are living the black metal kult, on a daily basis.

Music wise, I am closed minded when it comes to black metal, not opening myself too much to new genres, though I did try to pay attention to all those bands poppin up & crossing goth, indus & so on with black metal.

I must admit that diabolicum & mysticum were the only one that did match my expektations when it comes to the aura created.

On the other level, I also pay attention to the “performers”, for example : Anorexia Nervosa is often quoted as fag band, mostly due to the COF sounding of the musick. But on a personal level, the frontman is really a sicko & is among those few individuals I consider. Yet he would be a bit too much “rock n roll” sometimes eh too much drugz & autodestruction for me (which does provide a smile, that does you an idea on how fucked the man can be) aktually I think that when you get to meet him, he would be more in his place belongin to sadistik exekution than anorexia (musick wise) Ancient & dimmu borgir never made it to me, not even one track from their early days (the ep of ancient was ok though).

You did qualify some elements of black metal as “palatable” for the masses, yet we have to redefine masses then, since those masses would be the “extreme metal scene” which is not that wide, only a few thousands people I would say.

Not something that could be play on the air of any local radio show & musical tv shows or whatever. We are not dealing with “pop” music. But I do agree, black metal did sadly evolve to a wider audience & that doesn’t mean that the real audience did grow bigger, just that it did expand to people that simply don’t get a clue of what real black metal is about.

Having some individuals to compare napalm death to dark throne amazes me… the only link between those bands is mostly in the instruments used & some beats. (& some would kill me for the “rythm” comparaison)

Anyway, on our level, like other bands, we remain an underground band, you will most likely always find “cyfaws” & “dpe” on cd format, but we will go on doing limited tapes & vinylz. Only for those few sick ones that are also the pulse of the band.

It does mean a lot to us to be supported by like minded individuals, band members or zine editors or just listeners.

I do not get much letters in that vein, but with those few with whom we share visions, getting to read some comments on AntaeuS work is always rewarding.

Our satanik audio violence would be a weapon & only some individuals know how to handle it & how to view it properly.

Carcass or Bolt Thrower? Pick one.

Fuck… Bolt Thrower

at least they didn’t change & “cenotaph” is an instant classic for me, such as the “in the battle there is no law” lp. carcass had amazing trackz but fuckin wimped out too much for my taste.

When can we expect the new album (on Osmose, right?) and will there ever be an American tour??

the new rekordin shall be out on sept 23rd in europe, so obviously a bit later in the usa, osmose doesn’t have a distributor over there I think, so most releases are available mostly through ug mailorders & so on. I doubt one will find it as easily as CYFAWS over there. I seriously doubt on the american tour thing, though I wish we could go over there & perform with bands like black witchery, thornspawn, krieg, demoncy, gbk & so on. Since we are doing a european tour for “DPE” in november, as opening band for Deicide, I am not nearly sure that no tour will happen until the next release (the third album that is).Having us on a european tour would mean getting the band on a bigger “bill”, having an headlining band that could make it possible. As of now, I have no big expectation about a us tour, since it seems nearly impossible, we are not “selling” enough to be pushed that way.

The Deicide tour is already something really expensive.

In the future, who knowz? but I wouldn’t be surprised if the band never gets to perform over there.

Bands like marduk, satyricon & others took forever to go to the other continent & most of the time, itz like a money vortex more than anything else.

Time shall tell, we still have to perform over here first, that is our territory & we haven’t visited more than three countries as of now (which would be like performin in three different states for a us bands).

To you, what is most important in sustaining black Metal into the coming years, as it is increasingly an “endangered” form of music?

I see it that way : Evil will never dies, it might change shape, as long as some form of Art will be dedicated to its “grandeur”, I see no problem with itBlack Metal has somehow a more raw approach to it, a darker incarnation meant to appeal to more extreme masses, thus a minority of individuals are truely meant to understand fully the concept behind this genre.

Black metal is nowadays marketed as a musical genre only, with gimmicks to help the sales. Many bands did take the opportunity to rise using those “eye catching” ideas related to black metal.

Your top 5 BM records?

DarkThrone “a blaze in the northern sky”
Funeral Mist “devilry”
Katharsis “666” + “red eye of wrath” demo
Blasphemy “fallen angel of doom”
Beherit “D. down the moon” (& oath of the black blood)those are the ultimategettin near to that, I’d add sadistik exekution (all releases), profanatica, demoncy, krieg… I’d easily give 20 names that would represent the whole list of bands I really support…. Giving 30 names would be impossible though. not enough bands have individuals matchin the right ideology one should have within the bm scene.

Thanks for the interview! Good luck on your upcoming record and in the inevitable Satanic victory over the forces of light. Have a nice day

Forces of Light are forces of lies as well, they are their own failure & we shall be the witness & the temptation for them.Take a look in the abyss & the abyss will stare back at you

For we hold the ultimate void, we shall go on, we are Omega.

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Interview: Ray Miller (Adversary/Metal Curse)

Some people exist as unsung pillars of the underground, and Ray Miller of death metal band Adversary is one of them. First, he started up a zine called Metal Curse that is widely regarded as one of the few quality death metal magazines extant today; next, he began selling death and black metal through his label Cursed Productions, which has also released quality demo compilations from bands such as Varathron and Deceased. Finally, he’s in a death metal band called Adversary which could be described as a more late-night-radio American version of Asphyx. We caught up with him at his country villa in Chingadosmujeres, Mexico, as the first shots of a revolution rang out in the street.

When did ADVERSARY begin?
Just a little over five years ago, in May of 1994. Jack Botos (guitar) and I are two of the original founding members. Our drummer, Bob Burns, is fairly new – he’s been damned with us for about a year-and-a-half.

What’s the distribution of the creative work in songwriting, lyrics, artwork, and concept/pot smoking?
Anyway, in the beginning we had another guitarist, Thom Benford, and he wrote a couple riffs back then. But since he quit (before our first demo was released), Jack and I have written all the music and lyrics. However, when Ed was still in the band (on keyboards and drum programming – before we had a human drummer, of course), he created all the drum and keyboard arrangements. How that would work is that Jack or I would present some riffs, or sometimes a “complete” song (the riffs in the “right” order – we sort of tweaked stuff a lot as we worked on it, so a “finished” song would probably still mutate somewhat), and Ed would listen to us play it a few times and get some ideas.

Then we’d record the riffs on my 4-track, and Ed would work out the programming at home, and at the next practice maybe have something we could play along with. Now that Bob is in the band, we just show him a riff, and he starts playing behind it. Right before Ed quit (he got married…), he had written a few really great riffs for a new song, but we decided to not use them after he left. Not that we parted on bad terms, or anything of the sort.

metal curse magazine has been a longstanding feature of the black and death metal undergroundAs far as the artwork goes for the band, it’s been different on every release. On our new demo-CD, We Must Be In Hell, Bob brought over few books of photos and paintings, and we basically swiped one. I altered the colors and so on, and did the actual layout myself. I’ve done CD packaging designs for a few underground labels, in addition to my own releases on Cursed Productions.

I also publish a zine called Metal Curse, and Bob has done 99% of the art for that for the last several issues.

Concept… Well, I suppose our general sound was more or less my idea, being inspired by “simple” Death Metal such as MASSACRE, ASPHYX, (early) GRAVE, UNLEASHED, IMPETIGO, (early) DEATH, AUTOPSY, and onward into countless others. Of course Jack has done his fair share (or more) to shape our sound since. And now, with Bob, we have the added power of human drumming, but we have also lost our keyboards.

So, I suppose our sound is almost constantly evolving, but still hopefully memorable Death Metal. If that’s what you mean by “concept” at all…

As for pot smoking, I leave that to Jack. I don’t smoke, or even drink unless it’s a “special occasion.” So, Jack gets my share. Bob has been known to partake every now and then, too.

The surest way to corrupt a youth is to teach him to hold in higher regard those who think alike than those who think differently.
– F.W. Nietzsche

adversary are a band of much potential in the old school simple doomy death metal style, like an american asphyx with Are you guys touring?
I wish! That’s exactly what we would love to do, but Cursed Productions is too small to support it. That’s one of the reasons we would like to get signed to a larger label: So we can go out and see the world. And the sluts, of course. We do have some shows lined up during the summer, and there is a really slim possibility of us going to Brazil to play some shows with some bands (NERVOCHAOS and INSANITY) on Muvuca Records.

What kind of instruments do you play, and why?
I have a Washburn bass, and a Fender Bassman amp. I like my Washburn because it does not have all that “active electronics” bullshit. It’s old, but I’m attached to it. And speaking of old, my Bassman is nice and fuzzy, and I really like that sound. I think it adds a lot more depth to our live sound than a clean bass tone would. However, when we recorded our debut album, _The Winter’s Harvest_, I was talked into plugging directly into the board, and got a really clear “Steve Harris” kind of sound. That works pretty well for IRON MAIDEN, but I think it made the album sound more “clean” than it should have. Well, and the keyboards and drum machine also added to the “clean” sound… Believe me, I learned my lesson about that, and will stick with my “warm” Bassman sound form now on.

Jack has had a couple different guitars over the years, and he just got a new one. I think he may finally be satisfied with the guitar, but now he’s looking for a bigger, meaner amp.

And my drum knowledge is pathetic, so all I know about Bob’s kit, is that it’s like nuclear explosions going off whenever he hits the snare.

Do you feel it matters, or matters only for aesthetic (“sound” quality, texture, timbre, “feel”) qualities?
What else would it matter? Just to be like B.B. King and his beloved guitar? No, I’m not that attached to any equipment I own, so if I could afford to get a bass and amp that I thought sounded better, I would. But “sounding better” is obviously extremely subjective, and after many years of using this same gear (I’ve had it and been in bands for a lot longer than ADVERSARY has been around), I guess I’m so used to it, that I’m not sure what would sound better. So, maybe I *am* a little like B.B. after all.

The Christian resolution to make the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.
– F.W. Nietzsche

What are you guys like outside of the band? Do you suffer under the Judeo-Christian pestilence known as “day jobs”? Tattoos? Historical heroes?
Bob and Jack do have “day jobs,” but my full time job is running my label, Cursed Productions. It may seem odd, but none of us have any tattoos. I think we may be the only ink-free Death Metal band in the world! I’m not sure I really have any heroes other than the guys in MOTORHEAD. And, as my pal Psycho would say, “the guy who invented lesbian pornography.”

scheitan is the hebrew/jewish god known as adversary, and is the ancestor of the morally sanitized christian satanIs the ADVERSARY eponym an identification with Satan, the “adversary” of ancient Hebrew religion?
YES! Thank you. You are exactly the second person to ever ask me that. I had thought it was odd that no one had snatched up the name before us, but I guess not many people understand what it means.

What do you see as the difference between Jewish, Christian, Islamic and Buddhist views of “evil”/”suffering”?
I’m not really well enough versed in Islam and Buddhism to answer that. So, what I’ll do instead is say that mainstream (x-tian at least) religions seem to think that a lot of natural behavior should be considered “evil,” and that seems crazy to me. Fucking, well that’s evil. Killing, no matter what the situation, that’s evil too.

What forms of art, ideas, or actions inspired the inception of your artwork?
Early Death Metal, of course. But also other music, such as MOTORHEAD, VENOM, SLAYER (I believe that you consider them to be a Death Metal band, but that’s open to debate, if you ask me), ACCEPT, DEAD KENNEDYS… Non mainstream music in general. And I suppose that honestly, everything I’ve ever heard has inspired me in some way. Maybe not always in a positive way, though. I also read whenever I can, and have certainly been inspired by the authors I like, such as Charles Bukowski, Henry Miller, Vladimir Nabokov, Italo Calvino, Jorge Luis Borges, William S. Burroughs, Douglas Adams, to name just a very, very few. Plus, as geeky as it might sound, Godzilla movies. I’ve always been a huge fan (excepting the dismal TriStar attempt of last summer) of Godzilla and his monstrous pals. And, horror movies. Zombies, especially, seem to grab my interest. I appreciate the special effects, and I suppose like the thrill.

Do you consider your music a form of “art” (the academic definition, not the trendy one)?
Certainly.

What motive inspires your art?
To create something that will outlast us.To, in sort of a Shakespearean sense, live forever. The hope that someday we might be a source of inspiration for others to creatively express what they feel.And to one day take over for MOTORHEAD as the best, most respected, band in the world.

Or maybe just to meet chicks and take over the world.

drugs are a lot of fun, but they can TAKE OVER YOUR LIFE... be carefulDo you think drugs help/hinder art?
I can’t really answer that, since I don’t use any drugs. But I do think that drugs can be used as a tool to possibly help with creativity. However, they can also be detrimental. As I said, I think they’re a tool, and should be used as such, if at all.

Does religion help/etc?
Well, it sure seems like a lot of Extreme Metal bands these days rely on religious (or more accurately, anti-religious) themes in their lyrics, so I guess it helps them in that way. I think that organized religion is a great way to oppress and control the masses, so it “helps” us by giving us a focus on one of society’s problems: it’s easier to be a sheep than to accept responsibility for your own actions, think for yourself, and be your own person.

Of course, x-tian religions love to censor everything they can, from books to thoughts, so in that way, that kind of religion clearly hinders the creative process.

“They train them to drop fire on men… But they won’t let them write the word FUCK on their aeroplanes… Becuase it’s obscene!”
-Colonel Kurtz, Apocalypse Now!

Violence?
I don’t know if violence has any affect on art, but I suppose that as a society becomes more and more violent, the art it as a whole produces will reflect that.

Television?
Most of what’s on broadcast television is extremely dumbed down, so that even the most idiotic Joe Sixpack will understand it, so generally I see TV as sort of a filter that removes most of what is interesting about life. Even worse when a movie is butchered so that it can be “safely” shown without “offending” anyone.

In your personal lives, how do you understand and respond to the presence of corporate control and material need?
Of course you do need to pay the bills, and obviously I like music and books, so I do my best to bring in cash, and spend it just as well. It would be nice to not have to worry about huge companies like Blockbuster having more than a little control in determining the content of the movies they carry, or Meijer driving all the mom and pop grocery stores out of business, but when faced with the decision of having enough to eat if I get the shit at Meijer, or going hungry from trying to support a local store, I must choose to eat.

What do you think of “jobs”?cursed productions has released many underground works and continues to operate as a death metal label and mail order of great promise
I don’t like them. I am lucky enough to be able to make a very modest living at doing something that I enjoy (Cursed Productions, Metal Curse, and ADVERSARY), but I do put in a lot more time at this than Jack and Bob do combined at their jobs. Sometimes, just for a second, I wonder if it wouldn’t be easier to go work for someone else. Certainly it would be easier, and considerably less work. I could have more “free time” to read and relax. But at what cost? So I could go be a nameless cog in some huge machine that cares not at all about me, as I am utterly replacable? So I could “finally grow up and get a real job”? I don’t think so. To quote Jello Biafra, “I’d rather stay a child and keep my self respect, if being an adult means being like you.” But, then again, if one day Cursed Productions fails to provide me with enough to get by, I will be forced to take other actions. That’s not part of the Global Domination plan, though.

Do you blaspheme on a regular basis for dentological, aka done for the intensity of the action itself, reasons?
Maybe. It seems more appropriate to blaspheme for the reaction it generates in others, whether positive or negative, as both responces are extremely important at various times and in various situations. But just screaming “Fuck god!” in an empty room doens’t do much for me.

Are you moral? Do you believe in morality?
I suppose so, but I certainly have my own morality. What I think is “right and wrong” might not match up with what some people think. I’m fairly close to what LaVey says in the _Satanic Bible_ as far as morality is concerned.

Do you think ethics are separate from morals?
I hadn’t considered it before. Perhaps morals could be seen as a personal code of conduct, while ethics might be viewed as more of a code of conduct for groups or whole societies. Perhaps to remain with the given society, one would have to conform to the ethical “guidelines,” while still retaining his own personal morality that might only come into play in other societies or groups.

What is the most important factor for you in creating music that satisfies you at the deepest level?
Knowing that what we have created is honest and true to us.

If you met Jesus, what would you say?
“Until I see you turn this water into wine, you’re just a punk in sandals.”

Or, maybe upon seeing a “miracle” I couldn’t debunk, “Oh shit!”

Hitler?
If I were back in time, I might say, “Stay out of Russia.” But no matter when I saw him, I’d want to talk about eugenics. What else could you talk to Hitler about?

“God”?
Now that depends on what you mean by “God.” But, playing along for a moment, I’d ask why we exist, and what the purpose of the universe is.

friedrich nietzsche is considered by many to be the philosopher of metal Nietzsche?
Maybe I could get him and Hitler together, as the conversations would be pretty related.

Gandhi?
I’d tell him that passive resistance cannot always work.

Without music life would be a mistake.
-F.W. Nietzsche

How would you react if your daughter got breast implants?
Interesting. I’ll try to take this one seriously. From the perspective of a father, I don’t think I’d like it, but I would certainly have to have more information as to why she was doing it. Is it just the fact that she’s small chested and wants to fuck the football team, who will only fuck the big boobed cheerleaders, or does she think that she’ll be better able to control the weak sheep-wills of men and have legions to do her bidding? If she wants to get a boob job so that she can dominate the universe, then okay.

Do you feel society is evolved from the hominid state, aka “ape” social existence with inherent power games?
Evidently not. As George Carlin would say, “It’s the bigger dick policy at work. If they have bigger dicks, bomb them.”

Why do you feel that many experience a dark sense of foreboding regarding the millenium and significant times afterward, such as 2012?
Fear of the unknown, for one thing. And I don’t have to mention that most people are sheep, and that the media has been forcing “millennium fear” on everyone, so it’s only natural that the herd is worried about it. What’s significant about 2012?

2012 is the date the Mayan calendar “ends” an era, with the implication that what comes will be either total destruction or a new frontier. I however think it is the date when the genome of marijuana truly matures, and thus all earth will be unified in clouds of sweet smoke.
More like the number of bong hits you’ve taken during this interview!

Is ADVERSARY is exploring a new type of metal, and an old type of metal, like any other group of self-respecting artists in this age?
Yeah, it’s sort of like my taste in literature: mythological and postmodern.

A giant HAILS and BLACK VOMIT OF ETERNITY to the mighty ADVERSARY for this lengthy interview.Thank you for your time.
You’re welcome of course. I should really thank you for the interest in ADVERSARY.

…The one-eyed man will have one eye the stronger; the blind man will see deeper inwardly, and certainly hear better. To this extent, the famous theory of the survival of the fittest does not seem to me to be the only viewpoint from which to explain the progress of strengthening of a man or of a race.
– F.W. Nietzsche

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Interview: Amebix

amebix logoIt’s hard to introduce a band who were part of the introduction of the genres upon which this site is based. Along with Discharge, Amebix were the punk half of the formula, influenced by Black Sabbath and Motorhead, a potent brew of inspirations which when mixed with NWOBHM made for the elementals of death metal and black metal. Coming to us from the UK, Amebix were also one of those rare inspirations that believed in the idea before the incarnation, and wanted to give meaning to life where others were satisfied with callow rebellion. Taking time out from practice for the new tour, the Baron gave us a few moments aboard a chartered Italian diesel submarine to keep us in the loop on art, music, life and Amebix.

The AMEBIX “sound” has appeared as an ingredient in diverse metal and punk genres, and you’re a foundational influence on all crustcore. How did you hit upon this sound? Are there any parallels in visual art, books and movies?
For myself and Stig our approach has always been very instinctual, not having any musical knowledge or training we had to find our way blindly, mainly through the “feel” of a song, and the way we would try and build it up; it is not clever, but it has a simple and honest power. I am not able to tell if there are parallels in other Art, but our particular Silhouette style artwork was also in the same vein, getting a powerful idea across very simply, leaving the viewer to use their imaginative capacity.

AMEBIX: BaronIt has been said that, initially, AMEBIX did not use chords to create songs. How did you learn to play music, and did you take advantage of any established theory?
I think the answer above is applicable here too, I learned how to play guitar chords when I moved to Skye, but in a very real sense I found that understanding music in any way actually took away a huge part of the “magic” for me.

From the metal side of things, you cite BLACK SABBATH and MOTORHEAD. What about these bands appealed to you, and what elements of their style did you carry on into AMEBIX?
Well, Motorhead was about energy; Sabbath was for me a very deep band, although subsequent discoveries really place the lyrical side with Geezer, it was a dark band that we could really bring our imagination into sympathy with, like Killing Joke. Music for me is about seeing an internal landscape, and I really tried to make that come alive with Amebix.

In an interview with Romania’s Metalfan, you say “I can’t get into the completely predictable sound of so many bands now, why dont people take a risk and do something unusual?” — do you believe the sound itself is what they must innovate, or is there something that comes before the sound — a realization of what they want to make in music, or an idea they want to communicate — that causes them to pick the sound they want?
I think that actually it is the same as when we started: 99% of people who want to make a band base themselves on someone else; there are so very few that are manifesting anything unique only to themselves. People do not take risks. We grew up with Bowie, T rex, Slade and eventually punk, and believed that it was our job not to be like everyone else, back when punk bands were so diverse and original, pre-Crass/Discharge, etc.

I am also a boring old twat too, which doesn’t give my opinion any credibility.

How did musical illiteracy help or hinder you in creating the music of AMEBIX?
It freed us entirely of understanding and allowed us to manifest our true sound.

The transition from signs which dissimulate something to signs which dissimulate that there is nothing, marks the decisive turning point. The first implies a theology of truth and secrecy (to which the notion of ideology still belongs). The second inaugurates an age of simulacra and simulation, in which there is no longer any God to recognize his own, nor any last judgement to separate truth from false, the real from its artificial resurrection, since everything is already dead and risen in advance…Henceforth, it is the map that precedes the territory – precession of simulacra – it is the map that engenders the territory and if we were to revive the fable today, it would be the territory whose shreds are slowly rotting across the map. – Jean Baudrillard, Live Theory

In the AMEBIX biography, you describe living in squats, moving from “one ruin to another, no sanitation, little electricity, and skip raids for food.” Many people seem to romanticize this lifestyle, but it cannot have been easy. How did it shape the AMEBIX sound?
It is difficult to be objective about this, but there is a cold harshness to some of the music that we put out at this time, it is also unrefined and spontaneous. Not having solid practice places or such we would write a song and that was that. If we could remember it then we would take it into the studio, but we had absolutely no discipline regarding recording, so a lot of the songs are poorly recorded and very primitive in comparison to today’s sound.

Jim Morrison (THE DOORS) sang and wrote repeatedly of a “frontier,” or a no man’s land where chaos and conflict ruled, but also open spaces were present. Was he speaking existentially, politically, or both, and how does this apply to music that loves nature (red in tooth and claw), destruction, emptiness and melancholy loneliness?
Morrison was referred to as either an idiot or a shaman, for me personally I don’t have an interest in The Doors, although Stig does. I don’t know whether this is a poetic sentiment he expresses or a psychological state.

What distinguishes great music from bad? Can it be distilled into technique, or is it something less easily defined?
Great music will cause a reaction good or bad, in the listener. Bad music will play in the background of the elevators of existence.

In the Metalfan interview, you say “Punk was about individuality and creativity, it became a cult of Conformity” — it seems many genres and artistic movements go this way — why do you think this is?
There is a general tendency for people to organise and define themselves into genres and groups, it is an instinctual and general behaviour pattern that stems from insecurity; it is the same root as nationalism, bigotry and religious division. Punk swallowed itself, stupid little people.

AMEBIXAfter 17 years, why re-unite AMEBIX? You had said you were tired of playing every variation of A and E chords you knew, and expressed frustration with current music. Are you coming back to change things?
We have an opportunity to redeem ourselves at this point in time, to play as a tight unit using good equipment and with an audience that has actually come to see Amebix. It is of course also partly vanity, but in all honesty this would not have come about if we didn’t meet the mark. There is a ferocity about some of the songs that still remains, and we are really looking forward to playing our “fantasy” gigs, having the backing now that we could only dream of back then. Me and Stig could hear how Amebix should sound back then, but we never had the opportunity to realise it.

One thing that distinguished AMEBIX was that your lyrics were less obviously “political,” or endorsing changes in society, and more focused on values and symbolism, almost like Jungian archetypes. What influenced this, and what did it enable you to express that other methods would not? What do you hope to communicate to the audience this way, and is designed to get past some of their expectations?
My lyrical approach was to create access to internal Landscapes, Archetypes and symbols. This was before I had studied the matter more thoroughly, but I wanted people to bring their own imagination into the Music, and in a sense fill in the spaces, and own that song as their own interpretation of an idea. Ambiguous statements leave room for imaginative interpretation.

In the article about your sword-forging activities, this quote sticks in my mind: “I see the metal as a living thing. It becomes alive when you introduce the elements of fire, coal (earth), air to feed the fire, and water or liquid for the quench.” This reminds me of the movement to sacralize earth and view it as a living thing (Gaia). Do you feel that all of life is alive, or any compatibility with this view that reality itself is sacred? Did you feel this way when making music?
The Forging is an extension of what I was doing then, still trying to be in touch with the elemental forces, although it is 99% a Job now, but I can still get into the right space when I need to.

Once upon a time, in some out of the way corner of that universe which is dispersed into numberless twinkling solar systems, there was a star upon which clever beasts invented knowing. That was the most arrogant and mendacious minute of “world history,” but nevertheless, it was only a minute. After nature had drawn a few breaths, the star cooled and congealed, and the clever beasts had to die. One might invent such a fable, and yet he still would not have adequately illustrated how miserable, how shadowy and transient, how aimless and arbitrary the human intellect looks within nature. There were eternities during which it did not exist. – Friedrich Nietzsche, On Truth and Lies in a Non-Moral Sense

The allusion to living steel is a physical reality, as fire heats up the metal it opens up and begins to move more rapidly as it changes states, when the hammer or Will is applied this will imprint itself into the lattice. The steel will have gone through an actual physical change in accordance with the will of the Smith.

It’s interesting how many punk and metal bands come through modern ideas to discover the ideals traditional societies from a millenium ago, which were: reverence for nature, belief in a transcendental but not dualistic life, independence from humanist morality, desire to create the beautiful and eternal, searching for truth with the self as the lens but not the focus. Do you feel any of these in your own creation?
AMEBIX: StigYes, I absolutely agree with you, transcendence of duality is the goal, to realise that all is from the same.

The AMEBIX biography says that you have completed enough material for “seven full-length albums.” I have Arise!, Monolith and No Sanctuary (which seems to be a re-released Beginning of the End, whose legality I am unsure of). What am I missing?
Nothing missing, I don’t see where seven full length albums comes from.

Also from the article on sword creation: “What contemporary thinking fails to understand about the alchemists’ attempts to transmute base metal to gold is that they were undergoing a process of personal refinement. Transmutation was an ultimate goal that stimulated the imagination. It was a metaphor for the essential creative process. My sole aim is to take the alchemists’ metaphor and give it substance. To give it a more rational setting.” Are you forging your own soul as you make swords? What role does discipline play in life, and in creation? I ask that because it seems to me that it takes discipline to learn to forge swords, and discipline to make a good one.
Yes, Forging was an extension of other disciplines when I started. It is a fine metaphor that can be used by anyone who is seeking some personal truth.

If sound is like paint, and we use different techniques and portray different things in our paintings, what does it say when a genre sounds similar and has similar topic matter and imagery? Can the genre be said to have a philosophy or culture of its own?
Maybe. I would not like to be stuck in a particular genre. It is important to me to keep moving, and not try and fit in. The person who leaves the tribe will have the adventure and come back with the Story that will change the Tribe, if they can listen.

When we feel ourselves to be sole heirs of the universe, when “the sea flows in our veins … and the stars are our jewels,” when all things are perceived as infinite and holy, what motive can we have for covetousness or self-assertion, for the pursuit of power or the drearier forms of pleasure? Contemplatives are not likely to become gamblers, or procurers, or drunkards; they do not as a rule preach intolerance, or make war; do not find it necessary to rob, swindle or grind the faces of the poor. And to these enormous negative virtues we may add another which, though hard to define, is both positive and important. The arhat and the quietist may not practice contemplation in its fullness; but if they practice it at all, they may bring back enlightening reports of another, a transcendent country of the mind; and if they practice it in the height, they will become conduits through which some beneficent influence can how out of that other country into a world of darkened selves, chronically dying for lack of it. – Aldous Huxley, The Doors of Perception

Do you believe objective reality exists?
I don’t believe that we have the sensory ability to discern things on a higher level, that intimation can come through Symbolism and Visionary experience, but I cannot answer that with any authority at all.

AMEBIX band photoAny plans to write a book about the AMEBIX experience, and what the punk/metal movement meant at the time? The “Risen” DVD sounds like it has some inclinations in this direction?
I started to write a book some years ago; this has been shelved for now, but I may take it up again when I am in my dotage.

The world needed punk when it happened, but not much has changed, yet the music seems less relevant. Is there a way to make it relevant again? Dare I ask… Is that what motivated you to break your silence and return?
I think the Spirit of Punk got lost a long time ago, but it can be found popping up in other Cultural milieu. A lot of the scene was just a parody of an idea, although some people lived it. I like to think that you can keep that spirit alive in the way you live your life, not who or what you identify with, keep an open mind, allow new ideas to come in.

Just as only one out of 100,000 has the talent to be an engineer or an acrobat, only a few are capable of managing the matters of a nation or humankind…In this time and this part of the world we are headlessly hanging on to democracy and the parliamentary system, even though these are the most mindless and desperate experiments of humankind…In democratic coutries destruction of nature and sum of ecological disasters has accumulated most. – Pentti Linkola, Can Nature Win?

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