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Revelation: I like later Graveland

Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 27, 2010, 01:48:37 AM
This music is hard to like because (a) it's of nearly uniform dynamic intensity (b) it repeats themes from past homey G-land releases as well as Lord Wind (c) it's very ambient, meaning circular song structures which build layers of triggers through modifiers to motifs, not new motifs. It's an attempt like all post-1995 Rob Darken releases to make a folk music that keeps the balls-out intensity of metal, captures the grandeur of soundtracks, and also has the power of virtuous aggression and an impersonal, large scale view of history that makes metal so appealing. While that makes this less of an easy listen, in that no song stands out as clearly, it's also how he gets us into another world. It's like submerging in a mindset, and the individual parts matter less than the overwhelming atmosphere. My suggestion to him for his next: just make it one big song with related themes. The difference is minimal from what he's doing now, but the effect would be amplified. Also, still too much drumming. Capricornus (pre-heroin) was awesome for his oddball background noise drumming and it's missing here.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 10:03:20 AM
Capricornicus' drumming always left a strange taste in my mouth, but seemed to suit the overall dynamic of Graveland's atmosphere. I just wish more black metal musicians didn't use the "primitive, raw, decayed" aesthetic principle as an excuse for sloppy playing

I've only heard Creed of Iron (of his newer direction), and then only briefly, but it left me out in the cold. I hear what you're saying, and it makes me want to explore further. I haven't listened to any Graveland in years.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 10:30:24 AM
I lost track of Graveland after Immortal Pride, which didn't grab me at all. but I might give it another chance.

any recommendations for entry into later era Graveland?

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 11:12:46 AM
Every release up until Immortal Pride expressed a distinct combination of concept and aesthetic, whereas the later albums could be categorized into "mini-eras", in which Darken tried with varying success to find the best voice for the ideas to be conveyed.
Immortal Pride, Creed of Iron -> 10 minutes of Poledouris per song, compositions veering into "synthesized classical" territory (with lots of phat breakbeats on CoI).
Memory and Destiny, The Fire of Awakening, Dawn of Iron Blades -> tighter songs, presenting motifs to expand upon melodically/structurally instead of expanding ambience.
Fire Chariot of Destruction -> twangy guitarwork reminiscent of FtVoB, arguably a return to the thick ambient layering of Thousand Swords; recapitulated quite a lot of themes from the previous three releases in a new context. I'd say it expresses a sort of ferocity that the other late Graveland lacked and still lacks.
Will Stronger Than Death, Britney Spears of Destiny -> a merger of Darken's current repetitive instrumental style with Lord WInd's meditative approach, which is kind of like sitting before an ancient temple all day and paying attention to the rhythm of people flowing in and out, calves slaughtered on the altar, etc.
The future -> another Fire Chariot of sorts would do, restating what was done up to this point, but with a more conscious use of disparate stylistic implements, i.e. not constantly drowning out majestic themes with Atlantean Valkyrie Choirs, which themselves would benefit from an overhaul towards something more akin to medieval polyphony.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 01:01:22 PM
I "like" pretty much all Graveland.  I'll happily listen to any of it.  The ones which really grab me are Thousand Swords, Will Stronger than Death, and Carpathian Wolves - these are the ones which I will actively listen to.  The others are releases I'll generally only put on when I have friends over, so that we can half listen to the music, half discuss what we think about the music, and what the music makes us think of.  Not as engaging as early-mid Graveland, but definitely better than post '94 Emperor, Enslaved, Immortal, Mayhem, Gorgoroth... pretty much ad infinitum.  Graveland still produce some of the best Metal out there, even if it doesn't shine as brightly as earlier releases.  I actually thought Cold Winter Blades was a bloody interesting EP, even though I'd heard most of it before, either on Fire Chariot of Destruction, in Lord Wind albums, or as general themes/motifs expressed throughout Graveland's career.  Still, I thought that the perspective taken on the material on that EP was interesting enough to be worthy of being listened to again.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 02:04:05 PM
When you consider the fact that Rob Darken takes himself too seriously, you wonder how much artistic merit Graveland truly has...

Well, that, and he's Slavic.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 05:50:54 PM
I lost track of Graveland after Immortal Pride, which didn't grab me at all. but I might give it another chance.

any recommendations for entry into later era Graveland?

I recommend The Four Wings of the Sun song on The Fire of Awakening album.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 28, 2010, 07:38:15 PM
any recommendations for entry into later era Graveland?
Memory and Destiny for flowing, ambient majesty, Fire Chariot of Destruction for dynamic, virile storytelling. The other newer albums tend to take the former approach but become too monotonous, and their few momentary excursions into the latter approach just don't carry the same intensity. All Graveland is good, but as Cargést pointed out, the sheer volume of it makes it almost a chore to wade through it all - there are few actual lows, which means similarly few peaks.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 29, 2010, 01:43:31 PM
When you consider the fact that Rob Darken takes himself too seriously, you wonder how much artistic merit Graveland truly has...

Well, that, and he's Slavic.

I don't think Rob Darken takes himself seriously at all.  I think he takes his music incredibly seriously.

Also, what's wrong with Slavs?

peristil

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 29, 2010, 02:51:12 PM
Post '97 graveland is enjoyable. Slavs exhibit interesting compositions, Clean Hand of the Eternal Gods by Aeon springs immediately to mind.
They are from Pula (Hrv) though. Western Croatia is a cultural crossroads of sorts, the hallstatt people made a home there during the iron age, and Absu dedicated a song to the halstatt culture (see 'in the eyes of ioldanach').
Poland for sure has birthed great artists. Many metal bands use Beksinksi paintings, Nightbringer from the US is one of them.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 29, 2010, 04:43:03 PM
When you consider the fact that Rob Darken takes himself too seriously, you wonder how much artistic merit Graveland truly has...

Well, that, and he's Slavic.

I don't think Rob Darken takes himself seriously at all.  I think he takes his music incredibly seriously.

Also, what's wrong with Slavs?

As a joke, I pasted a pic of the black-metal kid holding an Israeli flag, on his myspace.  He flipped out and cared enough to remove me from myspace friends (lol).

I added him as friends a year later as a joke, and he must've remembered me, because he blocked me after that (my profile was private).  Funny shit!  I could just imagine him slamming his battle axe (while wearing that funny helmet of his he likes to take pics of) into the table in rage after someone posting something on his myspace.

I've been to Poland before.  It's a shithole (especially Katowice).  The women are either extremely hot or extremely weird looking. Can you name one slavic nation that isn't a shithole?

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 30, 2010, 11:30:11 AM


As a joke, I pasted a pic of the black-metal kid holding an Israeli flag, on his myspace.  He flipped out and cared enough to remove me from myspace friends (lol).

I need this picture, can someone repost it here please ?

Quote
I've been to Poland before.  It's a shithole (especially Katowice).  The women are either extremely hot or extremely weird looking. Can you name one slavic nation that isn't a shithole?

Why did you go there ? For Metalmania ?

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 30, 2010, 01:16:47 PM

As a joke, I pasted a pic of the black-metal kid holding an Israeli flag, on his myspace.  He flipped out and cared enough to remove me from myspace friends (lol).

I added him as friends a year later as a joke, and he must've remembered me, because he blocked me after that (my profile was private).  Funny shit

I've been to Poland before.  It's a shithole (especially Katowice).

See? There's too much irony here. He crates in all seriousness and is trying to create *some* image outside of music and all you do is, as usually in internet, as a first impulse, making fun of everything. I guess you would be similarly tired, especially after almost two decades of such treatment. I also assume, that his myspace is maintained by someone else...
It's worth to mention, that the guy isn't some sort icon for metalheads here, in Poland. More of a pariah actually. Behemoth/Vader crowd have no idea about Graveland's music, or use it as a target of internet irony at best. Darken is also bashed by satanic, suicidal-depressive underground etc. and all that Watain/Mayhem type of web communities.

This won't help him either in maintaining his credibility (or credibility of his environment):
http://www.capricornus.y0.pl/

Katowice is actually post-Prussian typical industrial city. Blame them. But it is a "sad" place indeed.

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 30, 2010, 01:56:31 PM

As a joke, I pasted a pic of the black-metal kid holding an Israeli flag, on his myspace.  He flipped out and cared enough to remove me from myspace friends (lol).

I added him as friends a year later as a joke, and he must've remembered me, because he blocked me after that (my profile was private).  Funny shit

I've been to Poland before.  It's a shithole (especially Katowice).

See? There's too much irony here. He crates in all seriousness and is trying to create *some* image outside of music and all you do is, as usually in internet, as a first impulse, making fun of everything. I guess you would be similarly tired, especially after almost two decades of such treatment. I also assume, that his myspace is maintained by someone else...
It's worth to mention, that the guy isn't some sort icon for metalheads here, in Poland. More of a pariah actually. Behemoth/Vader crowd have no idea about Graveland's music, or use it as a target of internet irony at best. Darken is also bashed by satanic, suicidal-depressive underground etc. and all that Watain/Mayhem type of web communities.

This won't help him either in maintaining his credibility (or credibility of his environment):
http://www.capricornus.y0.pl/

Katowice is actually post-Prussian typical industrial city. Blame them. But it is a "sad" place indeed.

I discovered Graveyard thanks to a friend who didn't even know Poland. Darken is opening the gates for stranger immigration, instead of preserving the land for his own kids which he even does not have as far as I know.

He lives in a region which is very specific, for you americans try to compare California to Louisiana...

Re: Revelation: I like later Graveland
December 30, 2010, 02:12:41 PM


As a joke, I pasted a pic of the black-metal kid holding an Israeli flag, on his myspace.  He flipped out and cared enough to remove me from myspace friends (lol).

I need this picture, cane someone repost it here please ?

Quote
I've been to Poland before.  It's a shithole (especially Katowice).  The women are either extremely hot or extremely weird looking. Can you name one slavic nation that isn't a shithole?

Why did you go there ? For Metalmania ?

Family. But shit, Poland fucking sucked.  No wonder the Poles leave there en-masse for places like Britain.

EDIT: I spend literally a half-hour looking for it.  Apparently, the only source I could find was some long-dead link to it.  However, there was a YTMND that referenced it and I was able to find the image by looking in source.  Phew.  I did that because you *needed* the pic, and I'm sure you have a great use for it in your own endeavors :D.