Varg Vikernes: potsmoker

[JewishPhysics]

smart person + drugs = smart results

dumb person + drugs = dumb results

This is always true.

The only thing that determines good music is a smart person, applying themselves, and confronting that which they fear/desire with great intensity.

Otherwise, all the idiots taking drugs would be making magical music.

I'd also like to add that there doesn't appear to be any evidence of association with pot specifically and creativity.  As far as I'm aware, the only two classes of drugs that have ever aided creativity (arguably) are euphoric depressants (e.g. alcohol, heroin) for writers and psychedelics (e.g. LSD, mescaline) for musicians.

[Chaosgoatlaw]

smart person + drugs = smart results

dumb person + drugs = dumb results

This is always true.

The only thing that determines good music is a smart person, applying themselves, and confronting that which they fear/desire with great intensity.

Otherwise, all the idiots taking drugs would be making magical music.

I'd also like to add that there doesn't appear to be any evidence of association with pot specifically and creativity.  As far as I'm aware, the only two classes of drugs that have ever aided creativity (arguably) are euphoric depressants (e.g. alcohol, heroin) for writers and psychedelics (e.g. LSD, mescaline) for musicians.

Marijuana is both of those, although the psychedelic side is far less severe and obvious than the drugs you mentioned. I would use "alter" rather than "aid" because like Conservationist said, creative individuals will be creative and innovative with or without drugs(or at least that what I got out of what you said. Sorry if I'm reading wrong). The drugs just change the direction of creation. Who knows what Varg, or any other great metal musician would have created if their drug intake had been different, but surely it would have been just as genius.

[Jim Necroslaughter]

and on Hlidsqwertyuiop, where he was ripping off Dead Can Dance and Danzig's Black Aria (volume I, the good one).

haha, is that the name of the album now??  I always thought that was how it was pronounced anyway!

[Andrew]

His drug use is probably what made his music good in the first place.

I logged in to reply to this. I could not disagree more. Consider this:

smart person + drugs = smart results

dumb person + drugs = dumb results

This is always true.

The only thing that determines good music is a smart person, applying themselves, and confronting that which they fear/desire with great intensity.

Otherwise, all the idiots taking drugs would be making magical music.

Imagine that Vag Vikernes has not decided to be black metal, but had instead made folk rock or dubstep. He would have renovated those styles as well.

For the last decade or so, Vikernes has not been applying himself. Instead, he has been trying to game the system: make the prison think he's a nice guy, make money, pave the way for a future NSDAP, etc.

Quality of music has declined.

He was best with his early years, when he just wanted to make D&D/Hobbits in sonic form, and on Hlidsqwertyuiop, where he was ripping off Dead Can Dance and Danzig's Black Aria (volume I, the good one).

I was saying that somewhat tongue-in-cheek, and for the most part agree with you.  Drugs are only a tool, and like many tools they can help certain geniuses immensely in reaching their heights, or they can just be (and most often are) abused by idiots.  It does obviously depend on the person, though somebody of Varg's type of short-lived instinctual genius has much more potential to be benefitted by drugs than someone who spends decades consumed by study of their craft.

[sofiana]

Smoking pot should be legal. There's really nothing wrong with this, mother nature has given it to mankind as well as mushrooms etc.
In my opinion, for those who need it, it's far better to smoke some weed instead of taking chemical poisonning pills prescribed by a pill-drugged psychiatrist.

[JewishPhysics]

it's far better to smoke some weed instead of taking chemical poisonning pills prescribed by a pill-drugged psychiatrist.

Cannabis and psilocybe mushrooms contain chemicals; that's how they work.  All matter is made up of chemicals.  Some of the most dangerous chemicals known to man come from nature.

[sofiana]

it's far better to smoke some weed instead of taking chemical poisonning pills prescribed by a pill-drugged psychiatrist.

Cannabis and psilocybe mushrooms contain chemicals; that's how they work.  All matter is made up of chemicals.  Some of the most dangerous chemicals known to man come from nature.

Who cares about your opinion about it ? I don't smoke so it's not my problem. But if some people need it give it to them.
You're a clone or something ? "dangerous chemicals known to man come from nature" ? Mmh perhaps you're from another planet

[JewishPhysics]

Who cares about your opinion about it ?

What opinion?  I haven't shared my opinion.  You implied that Cannabis and mushrooms didn't contain chemicals.  That is factually inaccurate.

You're a clone or something ? "dangerous chemicals known to man come from nature" ? Mmh perhaps you're from another planet

Are you unaware of the plethora of toxins, poisons, venoms, etc. found in nature?

[Dinaric Leather]

What opinion?  I haven't shared my opinion.  You implied that Cannabis and mushrooms didn't contain chemicals.  That is factually inaccurate.

He was probably trying to say that Cannabis and Psilocybin aren't synthetic. Usually, in common English vernacular, when people say something is a "chemical" they really mean it's a concentrated synthetic chemical. For example, someone might say that there are "chemicals under the sink" when they are talking about their cleaning supplies like windex and shit.

Aspergers syndrome, it's a fucking epidemic.

Besides, why are you even trying to debate this dude? He's clearly either a dumbass or trying to bait ass pies that like to correct people about really inane shit.

[Veritas]

What opinion?  I haven't shared my opinion.  You implied that Cannabis and mushrooms didn't contain chemicals.  That is factually inaccurate.

He was probably trying to say that Cannabis and Psilocybin aren't synthetic. Usually, in common English vernacular, when people say something is a "chemical" they really mean it's a concentrated synthetic chemical. For example, someone might say that there are "chemicals under the sink" when they are talking about their cleaning supplies like windex and shit.

Aspergers syndrome, it's a fucking epidemic.

Besides, why are you even trying to debate this dude? He's clearly either a dumbass or trying to bait ass pies that like to correct people about really inane shit.

And presumably what Jew' was saying was that whether it comes from nature or is man-made is totally irrelevant, a chemical is a chemical regardless of where it comes from, and coming from "mother nature, maaan" is in no way a good argument. Being cautious of products made by purely profit based businesses is recommended (which of course applies to your local pot dealer too, but applies to "psychiatry" for additional reasons, as Mr. Cruise has so humbly explained), but the converse is not true, i.e. not being obtained in such a way doesn't make something good.

So, this just leads us back to where we started, i.e. to the question of whether using marijuana to enhance creativity (or any reason, for that matter) is a good idea or not

[Dinaric Leather]

And presumably what Jew' was saying was that whether it comes from nature or is man-made is totally irrelevant, a chemical is a chemical regardless of where it comes from, and coming from "mother nature, maaan" is in no way a good argument.

I was just being a dick because he was acting like a fucking nerd and I hate that shit.

I basically agree with you're statement, there are many benign and useful synthetic chemicals out there. However, I don't really blame people for being cautious about recently synthesized synthetics seeing as how they have little or no history of use, and therefore the long term effects aren't well documented.

Also, it's worth noting that there is a very fine line between synthetic and natural. There are many semi-synthetic chemicals such as LSD. Not to mention "natural" in the strictest sense means everything that exists.

As far as marijuana being a creative aid, it most certainly is. Just as a desert, drag racing, sex or dolphins might be a creative aid if you find it inspiring.

[Conservationist]

And presumably what Jew' was saying was that whether it comes from nature or is man-made is totally irrelevant, a chemical is a chemical regardless of where it comes from, and coming from "mother nature, maaan" is in no way a good argument.

I was just being a dick

Please don't. It makes the forum more acerbic banter and less content, which makes it more like other forums, which makes it less useful to read.

People read forums for information and interest, but the usual bickering is not that.

In my experience, people who think drugs aid their creativity are just high. The creativity comes from within; the drug is just the excuse.

Drugs also carry with them secondary effects. The safest drug, in medical doses, is heroin. Just about everything else has bad physical or psychological effects.

Meth: neurotoxic
Pot: schizoid
LSD: dunno the mechanism, but makes zombies
Shrooms: paranoia
Cocaine: heart failure
Salvia: disassociative
Macintosh: longing for penis

If Vag Vikernes had a burst of creativity, it was his mind channeled through his parents' divorce, his own heartbreak, his social alienation and most importantly, what he wanted to express artistically e.g. the lone spirit in a dying time. Drugs were garnish.

[JewishPhysics]

Drugs also carry with them secondary effects. The safest drug, in medical doses, is heroin. Just about everything else has bad physical or psychological effects.

LSD: dunno the mechanism, but makes zombies

LSD is neurotoxic in heavy doses.  It primarily affects the pre-frontal cortex, so abusing it can basically zap out your frontal lobes.  Also, LSD has the highest association with HPPD.  The combination of those two will get you a grade A fucking zombie.

[Veritas]

In my experience, people who think drugs aid their creativity are just high. The creativity comes from within; the drug is just the excuse.

This is true - the drug is not giving you anything, it is unleashing it. Locally, drugs seem to aid creativity, because it seems like the thoughts you have on it have come from no where. Not so. All you are doing is unleashing the thoughts which you already had stored up, into short bursts. Stoners use up all of their creativity too quickly, and then they are left with depleted creativity reserves, and since they've now become lazy stoners they don't take the necessary steps required to fill it back up.

Altering the rhythm of creative unleashing can be done very effectively, providing that the user knows what they're doing. More often than not, drugs simply waste potential.

[Levy_Spearmen]

abusing it

Isn't that, like, taking a bath tub load of LSD?