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[META] Transcendental Black Metal, by Hunter Hunt-Hendrix (Liturgy)

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Transcendental Black Metal, by Hunter Hunt-Hendrix (Liturgy)
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>: [

Welcome to the internet: where people go out of their way to find unfortunate examples of humanity to feel better about themselves.

But seriously, what's all the fascination / frustration with this dude?

Transcendental Black Metal, by Hunter Hunt-Hendrix (Liturgy)

Some good fodder here. Basically: rejection of nihilism through aesthetics is also rejection of the arc of counterculture.

Problem: indie rock took over black metal, not a transcendental genre.

So he's saying that he thinks Nietzsche was right, and aesthetics are the solution to nihilism, and his suggested aesthetics are nerdy rock music?

Help
Black Metal was already transcendental, so he's attempt to fix something that ain't broke.  Does he think the aesthetic choices in the genre are arbitrary?  I wonder if he's merely a sophist or contrarian or something.  Whatever the case, he's irrelevant.  Nobody takes him seriously.

I don't quite see how people's respect or lack thereof for him affects his relevance in the slightest.  He's irrelevant because he's a hipster; nobody takes him seriously because he's a hipster.

I find it amusing that one of his primary points, as far as I've understood it, is that the ridiculous hipster invention of the "burst beat" is somehow "transcendent".

But seriously, what's all the fascination / frustration with this dude?

He's bringing up some valid topics and he's doing so in a grand public style. Not sure what else is needed there.

I always heard Liturgy described as a rubbish hipster band, but recently via Reddit I read an article criticizing the band, and the criticisms all seemed bogus to me. I saw of video of Hunter and I really liked the way he spoke and what I could gather of his personality from his facial expressions; he doesn't dress in a clothing style I like, however it's the mark of a hipster to judge others based solely on their external appearance. I didn't realize he was the one who wrote the paper for the black metal symposium, so I'm in the process of going back and re-reading the paper (which I had previously glanced at and dismissed).

But seriously, what's all the fascination / frustration with this dude?

He's bringing up some valid topics and he's doing so in a grand public style. Not sure what else is needed there.

I completely agree, and I think it's very silly people don't understand what is a 'manifesto'. Hunter didn't write an informative chapter for a non-fiction book examining black metal, he wrote a manifesto for an out-of-the-box black metal symposium. Before criticizing his manifesto I would definitely criticize the lack thus far of similarly-profound discourse about black metal and about the motivation and meaning behind the music.

Ho I'm getting set up to write a pro-Hunter article and I look so much forward to bashing the mainstream anti-Liturgy bandwagon.

How hipster of you :)

My attitude on this isn't a pro/con on Hunt-Hendrix, Liturgy, etc. The black metal symposium seemed like an interesting idea. They have raised valid points. We have an opportunity to either talk about these ideas, or not. Whether we like the people involved (or they like us) is irrelevant. Clothing does not make the hipster. Intent makes the hipster.

Whoever said "black metal was always transcendental" had a good point. I don't think I find meaning in Hunt-Hendrix's dichotomy between nihilistic and transcendental black metal. The whole point of black metal is that it is both transcendental and nihilistic, like the New Right (if we're honest about what all the good bands were on about) beliefs it tends to support. By nihilistic I mean it rejects inherent value in favor of experience. There is no inherent value to human life. There is only us making beauty of it, or making shit.

So far humanity has chosen the latter because it can't reign in its desires. I'm thinking about the scene from Until the Light Takes Us where Chris Vikernes is bemoaning the introduction of McDonald's, Coca-Cola and Levis to his pristine town. The corporations didn't do this to you; people being willing to buy this crap did this to you. Our modern society is based on a flat hierarchy, e.g. no kings/no gods/no masters. The result is that people behave like snorting pigs and then blame Jesus, money or Freemasonry for their problems.

This thread should be moved to the Commerce sub-board.

Our modern society is based on a flat hierarchy, e.g. no kings/no gods/no masters.

What does this mean? What do you mean by "hierarchy"? What do you mean by saying the modern world does not have gods-kings-masters?

Is this not misdirected effort on both sides?  Hunter may be intelligent, but his ideology is constraining, preventing him from seeing that the older form of black metal is transcendent even if imbued with a Luciferian/Promethean symbolism.

I saw of video of Hunter and I really liked the way he spoke and what I could gather of his personality from his facial expressions...
Facial expressions, fair enough. The way he spoke? Are you fucking kidding me? I've never heard someone insert so many conjunctive "like"s in their speech who wasn't a female in an American high school. He came off as uninformed and worse, unsure. Inspired, but stupid. A mere prod from Socrates would demolish this boy's duodenum.

I saw of video of Hunter and I really liked the way he spoke and what I could gather of his personality from his facial expressions...
Facial expressions, fair enough. The way he spoke? Are you fucking kidding me? I've never heard someone insert so many conjunctive "like"s in their speech who wasn't a female in an American high school. He came off as uninformed and worse, unsure. Inspired, but stupid. A mere prod from Socrates would demolish this boy's duodenum.

It's possible, I only saw one video of him so far..

I saw of video of Hunter and I really liked the way he spoke and what I could gather of his personality from his facial expressions...
Facial expressions, fair enough. The way he spoke? Are you fucking kidding me? I've never heard someone insert so many conjunctive "like"s in their speech who wasn't a female in an American high school. He came off as uninformed and worse, unsure. Inspired, but stupid. A mere prod from Socrates would demolish this boy's duodenum.
Inspired? I would have chosen a very different adjective there.

Vacuous, perhaps.

Here is where I'm coming from on this:

Although I am the most elitist (and intelligence/heritable traits realist) person I know, I acknowledge that good information can come from just about anywhere.

A bum can do nothing productive his whole life, and have one good thought. After that, shoot him; it won't be repeated. But don't deny the thought because of the source (a sneaky form of ad hominem attack; it is separate from a source attack, which is leveled against a publication because it panders to an interest group or baser instincts).

I don't know HHH, nor do I expect he knows of or thinks well of me. However, I think he has brought to the forefront some topics that are worth discussing, whether we agree with him or not:

1. Transcendentalism in black metal
2. Nihilism in black metal
3. The incompatibility of nu-black (indie, shoegaze, drone, doom, punk mixed with black metal)
4. The necessity of academic study of black metal
5. The primal instinct in black metal

Whatever you think of the guy, these are topics we should be discussing, especially as HHH manages to piss off enough people to get people discussing this.

This thread is not a comment on HHH, and what I do or don't think about him -- that's for another (YouTube) thread, I'd guess.

Give respect to black metal, and keep these topics alive.