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How to change consumer society

How to change consumer society
October 01, 2006, 06:20:56 PM
I'm posting these questions as means to stimulate dialogue rather then actually perhaps come to an all agreeing conclusion.

The concept of Consumerist society to some is seen as one, if not thee, key component of what is sucking the world of human life, of any value or meaning that can transcend what is essentially now a thin web of morality that with the slightest bit of reflection shows itself as merely a tight rope above the abyss. With this considered, how do we go about changing it? The easiest suggestion is to change the reigns of power. Those who are worshiped, listened to or make waves in the world should be changed/altered/elevated/lowered.  Should this be done by force? If so, then how? How can those without media power, with out nuclear arms, without a well supplied army, an abundance of wealth (gold, silver, diamonds, something a bit more historically and practically tangible then bucks) and a number of other key components of what it means today to have power change the world and become those with power. Should the world to be, be one even structured on the competition, balance or goal of absolute power? Or is that system in-itself a flaw or an endless circular path?

If the rebuilding or the dawning of a new age has to wait for nature to destroy the fortresses of capitalism, media power and Judeo-Christian-Islamic theocracy/fanaticism, then are we merely rats helplessly waiting till the ship sinks. Will we be even able to re-build or will it take so long that we (and the world) are damaged beyond the hope of a real future?

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 03:46:10 AM
It's futile to try to change the powers that be. Western society and politics is quite ludicrous in a lot of ways but I count the blessings: relative freedom, safety, prosperity. Personal freedom should be the cornerstone of emphasis for anyone who wishes for better ideals. Immerse yourself in culture and rituals you passionately long for. It may be lonely; I do not have any friend right now.

Whatever may succeed Western civilization may or may not be worse for the common good and future of the earth. Let the cards fall as they may. For the vast majority of us, there is no reason at all to concern ourselves with affecting the power structures. Life is meaningless, concentrate on pursuits as an individual toward what you feel are worthwhile ideals. Never take your freedom for granted.

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 12:22:18 PM
Everyone should return to their respective homelands, for starters. Build culture where culture has a chance of survival. Embrace the exoteric while setting our aim towards cultivating esotericism. Be the torch-bearer for this generation, but do not abandon the future: progenerate if you believe that you belong to a lineage with a propensity towards transcendence. Forswear any modern mentality or anything that should serve in the maintenance of this Plastic Empire. It is not enough to get by; that is the norm as people strive to escape intimacy with meaninglessness. Rather, position yourself so that your interaction with the masses is minimal, while your interactions with individuals may be meaningful--there is nothing more dangerous than being swept up in frivolous alliances. But let us never deny our duty: proclaiming idealism in the face of the uncertain.

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 03:51:50 PM
Quote
Everyone should return to their respective homelands, for starters. Forswear any modern mentality or anything that should serve in the maintenance of this Plastic Empire. But let us never deny our duty: proclaiming idealism in the face of the uncertain.



The above parts caught my attention.

Move to respected Homelands? How do you determine where that is and what about people of half  (or even more divided) blood/heritage?

Give up anything modern? Like electricity? or Guns? or Modern Medicine?

Idealism in the face of uncertainty? I suppose I can understand that, but doesn't that also get a little too close to Christian fanaticism?

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 04:23:45 PM
Throwing to the garbage technology is not a good solution.

We don't really know how the world will act, how the sun will act, how the shit we putted in the ocean will act, etc. etc..

It's like throwing away a gun after shoting just one bullet into a unknown beast : it's better to keep it... just to be sure.

And as Ligthning Rider said, returning to homeland is to difficult now.

Vajra

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 05:13:41 PM
Renouncing the modern mentality can mean not falling for the prevailing ideologies that tempt you toward the baser aspects of your existence, which will fade into the abyss at death. When all your 'precious memories' and 'lol fun times' vanish, the machine will collect the shit you've spent your whole life hoarding until it eventually explodes.

It's the fear of transcending the abyss that marks the concensus reality, hidden by a mask of pretending to be different and self-important. Disconnected, without any collective effort to establish something meaningful and strong, how long will the species survive? What's even the point?

Death

Re: A question to all...?
October 04, 2006, 06:47:56 PM
Quote
the machine will collect the shit you've spent your whole life hoarding until it eventually explodes.


Including all your metal CDs, shirts and black nail polish. :o

Good post, though.

Death

Re: A question to all...?
October 05, 2006, 12:36:34 AM
Quote
Wtf you should read my post about titled "The Rebel Sell."  This has much to do with what you are saying and is based on a book.

I'm not sure Apartheid Waltz's nationalistic comments really apply here...criticisms against a multicultural society can really only be leveled against America.  Isn't the rest of the world messed up as well?  Let's just blame it on abrahamic religions.

Also: nice Nietzsche reference with the tightrope and the void LightningRider.  I was only able to get through the first few pages of Thus Spoke Zarathustra, but thanks to you I feel like I have accomplished something.


ugh, can you please read the first few pages of a suicide manual too

Re: A question to all...?
October 05, 2006, 03:43:31 AM
Quote
I'm posting these questions as means to stimulate dialogue rather then actually perhaps come to an all agreeing conclusion.

The concept of Consumerist society to some is seen as one, if not thee, key component of what is sucking the world of human life, of any value or meaning that can transcend what is essentially now a thin web of morality that with the slightest bit of reflection shows itself as merely a tight rope above the abyss. With this considered, how do we go about changing it? The easiest suggestion is to change the reigns of power. Those who are worshiped, listened to or make waves in the world should be changed/altered/elevated/lowered.  Should this be done by force? If so, then how? How can those without media power, with out nuclear arms, without a well supplied army, an abundance of wealth (gold, silver, diamonds, something a bit more historically and practically tangible then bucks) and a number of other key components of what it means today to have power change the world and become those with power. Should the world to be, be one even structured on the competition, balance or goal of absolute power? Or is that system in-itself a flaw or an endless circular path?

If the rebuilding or the dawning of a new age has to wait for nature to destroy the fortresses of capitalism, media power and Judeo-Christian-Islamic theocracy/fanaticism, then are we merely rats helplessly waiting till the ship sinks. Will we be even able to re-build or will it take so long that we (and the world) are damaged beyond the hope of a real future?


Take away the petroleum and what do you have?

Re: How to change consumer society
October 05, 2006, 12:50:47 PM
You still have industrial society with abundant coal mines. Add another ice age with north and south hemispheres blanketed in frost. That would shut down abundant harvests, mass transit and communications.

Re: A question to all...?
October 05, 2006, 03:02:25 PM
Quote
Wtf you should read my post about titled "The Rebel Sell."  This has much to do with what you are saying and is based on a book.

I'm not sure Apartheid Waltz's nationalistic comments really apply here...criticisms against a multicultural society can really only be leveled against America.  Isn't the rest of the world messed up as well?  Let's just blame it on abrahamic religions.

Also: nice Nietzsche reference with the tightrope and the void LightningRider.  I was only able to get through the first few pages of Thus Spoke Zarathustra, but thanks to you I feel like I have accomplished something.


read it. i recommend walter kaufmanns translation.

Re: How to change consumer society
October 05, 2006, 03:10:30 PM
Quote
You still have industrial society with abundant coal mines. Add another ice age with north and south hemispheres blanketed in frost. That would shut down abundant harvests, mass transit and communications.


i think one of our main problems is having a huge amount of incredibly powerfull and cheap fuel. we would'nt have such an out of control world population growth if it werent for oil.

Re: How to change consumer society
October 05, 2006, 08:28:28 PM
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i think one of our main problems is having a huge amount of incredibly powerfull and cheap fuel. we would'nt have such an out of control world population growth if it werent for oil.


Cheap nitrogenous fertilizer is the main culprit; it averted the first Malthusian catastrophe successfully, setting up humanity for an inexorably greater future fall.

Death

Re: How to change consumer society
October 05, 2006, 09:46:33 PM
apparently the next fuel source will be enzyme-driven catalysis of cellulose; energy producing units will be distributed in homes or neighbourhoods to avoid disasters of a centralized power system like the one that hit parts of eastern canada and the US a couple of years back

sounds farfetched, but it's coming

Re: How to change consumer society
October 06, 2006, 12:09:21 AM
I'm not seeing much of a problem with a little power for homes, schools and small businesses. Petroleum is essential for heavy cargo transit, agriculture harvest tractors and excavation rigs and heavy machine industries. The necessary torque can't come from a little trickle current from sustainable bio or solar power; compare a cordless drill with a drill plugged in the wall for an example. Our society is driven by mass quantities and rapid lateral overdevelopment. It's unecessarily heavy, stupidly inefficient and badly designed for our time due to the limitations that existed in the past.