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What will quantum physics research do to Atheism?

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Eleison:
Duality can proceed from unity in two ways, by replication or division.  The former is quantitative, the latter qualitative.  If a unity is total a duality can only be an illusion.  Hence reality remains one whilst appearing to take on diverse forms.

Wolfgang:
The idea ancient man had insight or knowledge into truths on some grander scale is nice and sentimental, and totally nonsense.

The Ancients had some ideas which are worth exploring now, but there wasn't some mystic element they were tapped into. Stop that shit y'all.

Too much dualism. "modernity sucks...the ancients therefore knew better".

It isn't that simple.

Humans have never got it right. Not since we fucked around and developed civilization.

Eleison:

--- Quote from: Wolfgang on April 04, 2012, 07:30:39 PM ---The idea ancient man had insight or knowledge into truths on some grander scale is nice and sentiment, and totally nonsense.

The Ancients had some ideas which are worth exploring now, but there wasn't some mystic element they were tapped into. Stop that shit y'all.

Too much dualism. "modernity sucks...the ancients therefore knew better".


--- End quote ---

I missed the part where anyone said this.

Iron:

--- Quote from: BillHopkins on April 04, 2012, 08:32:47 AM ---This sounds like postmodern anti essentialism to me. "downplay the similarities and focus on how different we all are". Religion has an essential structure, which is being reveled by the research above. This is belief in supernatural agents (persons/intentionality). All other properties of religion are superstructural on belief in supernatual agents. And, low and behold, we have dedicated parts of the brain which evolved to posit agency in the evironment based on insufficient perceptual cues and to make inferences about the internal mental states of agents which we never really directly experience (i.e. I adduce your pissed off when you frown and clench your fist).

--- End quote ---

It really is not postmodern anti-essentialism. At all. I'm talking about very real, concrete differences. The sort of thing you could quantify by examining brain activity (which, in the case of the 7th Day Adventists I mentioned, has been done). Religious experience is not at all uniform. This isn't some sort of wishy-washy bullshit, it's an empirical fact. People who are swept up in an ecstatic experience of divine or demonic possession are experiencing something radically different from a medieval theologian who endeavors to use reason to uncover the existence of God. The reality is that even within a tradition there is a great deal of diversity. There are patterns, of course, that apply to multiple traditions. Realistically, you can probably reduce religious experience to a half dozen commonly reoccurring 'types'.

Also, you're incorrect about the 'essential structure of religion'. Supernatural agency is a commonly recurring feature of religious thought, but is not essential. I shouldn't even have to explain this, but if you cut to the heart of the Upanishads, or examine various forms of Buddhism, you find a perspective in which deities or supernatural phenomena have no real significance. And even in those forms of Buddhism that do involve deities, these often play a symbolic role as something like 'psychological stimulants' or meditational aids.

And then there's neoplatonism, Taoism, etc, etc, etc...

The fixation on theism is very tiresome. Maybe try debunking the 4 Noble Truths or the Vajra Sliver Reasoning to spice things up a little bit. It's really not even in the same category.

Also - the distinction between mathematics that you pointed out is basically valid, but my objective was simply to point out the fact that just because something is rooted in neural activity does not mean that it is false. Religious claims are different from mathematical claims, you are correct.

Wolfgang:

--- Quote from: Eleison on April 04, 2012, 07:33:38 PM ---
--- Quote from: Wolfgang on April 04, 2012, 07:30:39 PM ---The idea ancient man had insight or knowledge into truths on some grander scale is nice and sentiment, and totally nonsense.

The Ancients had some ideas which are worth exploring now, but there wasn't some mystic element they were tapped into. Stop that shit y'all.

Too much dualism. "modernity sucks...the ancients therefore knew better".


--- End quote ---

I missed the part where anyone said this.

--- End quote ---

That seemed to be what you were saying. Can you clarify how this is different than what you mean exactly?

But that general notion is a running theme in Morbid Angel lyrics and Black Metal philosophy, and is common around here.

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