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Origins of heavy metal

Origins of heavy metal
December 01, 2006, 06:31:36 AM
People are so dumb in this day and age. They think in terms of technologies only. I'm listening to this "Blue Cheer" that got uploaded and thinking, this really has very little to do with heavy metal. But people think "It all uses distortion, who used distortion first?" That's a rock of shit. Distortion isn't what metal is. It's a state of mind that takes advantage of distortion.

When you read the rock music critic babblers, they always try to make heavy metal out to be a rock genre. It wasn't. It was a revolution against the rock genre, which itself is a subset of the popular music of the West for the past many generations. It's totally stupid that they can't see past this. Cream, The Who, and Pink Floyd had dick-all to do with metal.

Metal started when Black Sabbath tried to make a distorted version of horror movie soundtracks. Those in themselves are cheap ripoffs of dark classical like Wagner. Why people try to insist "Blue Cheer" is in metal's bloodline is ridiculous.



Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 01, 2006, 07:50:33 AM
Rod Stewart..?

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 01, 2006, 08:05:37 AM
Well I know that Tony Iommi claims that Cream was a big influence on him.  I don't think he said anything about Blue Cheer (well he may have), but it's obvious that it's in the same vein as Cream.

That being said, I never see those bands as actually being Heavy Metal.  That would be like saying Dead Can Dance is a metal band because they influence metal bands.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 01, 2006, 09:15:35 AM
Quote
Well I know that Tony Iommi claims that Cream was a big influence on him.


I'm sure a lot of stuff influenced him. Being in choir or band in high school, all the stuff he heard on the radio, the song "Happy Birthday 2 U," probably any other band he was near at the time...

Interesting he was in Jethro Tull. It's that metal-prog connection again, just like King Crimson. Metal is like punk romanticists making prog rock. Weird.

Annihilaytorr

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 02, 2006, 09:20:35 AM
Sabbath played Blue Cheer covers when they first started. No one on this site has said Blue Cheer was metal, but the influence is there. Do not get lost in aesthetics, and don't make Heavy Metal more than what it was. At first it was a revolution within rock, and as it progressed naturally out grew rock.

Were Black Sabbath, Judas Priest, Motorhead, and Venom rock? Yes. Was it their intent to make rock? Yes.

Were Necrovore, Darkthrone, Morbid Angel and Burzum rock? The answer is debatable. Was it their intent to make rock? The answer is clearly no.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 02, 2006, 10:19:29 AM
Well according to Dictionary.com (not that I consider them a great resource) claims that rock music and rock'n'roll are two different things and that rock is just a generic term for all the kinds of music that came from Rock'n'Roll.  So in that sense all Black Metal bands are also rock bands, but since their music is not simply a combination of rhythmn and blues mixed with traditional country music, then it is not Rock'N'Roll.  Just rock.

That's just one way to look at it though.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 02, 2006, 01:13:06 PM
Quote
Well according to Dictionary.com (not that I consider them a great resource) claims that rock music and rock'n'roll are two different things and that rock is just a generic term for all the kinds of music that came from Rock'n'Roll.  So in that sense all Black Metal bands are also rock bands, but since their music is not simply a combination of rhythmn and blues mixed with traditional country music, then it is not Rock'N'Roll.  Just rock.

That's just one way to look at it though.


Didn't you learn anything from this and this thread at all?

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 02, 2006, 05:50:43 PM
Quote

Didn't you learn anything from this and this thread at all?


Yes.  I learned that while a lot of people on here are right about not simply believing everything that is considered "known" information, but at the same time are wrong for believing any contradicting theory just because somebody typed it on a website.  

They are just picking a different blind horse to lead them around.  All I stated in this thread were definitions, based on something the previous poster said.  I figured that even Anus.com agrees on what the definition of what "rock" music is.  

And like I said, a lot of my knowledge simply comes from what the masses believe, but I am not about to just believe anything from a website because it is contradictory to what others say.  Not without proof.  I may be wrong and I may be right, but there is nothing backing up any other theory either.

I imagine I will be having to reiterate this several more times on this board.  I'll just make a form letter/disclaimer.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 02, 2006, 09:29:43 PM
its like that with any kind of music, as people dont know what a punk band is anymore, or they think hardcore is the only kind of punk, people from outside the genre's walls can never tell how to tell the quality of a band (thats even if they band is from the genre but hey they yell, they must be punk)

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 03, 2006, 05:10:08 AM
Wolfgang Van Bachtoven seems to have nailed this particular issue. Bands like Led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath, while an important stage in the evolution of metal, have as much to do with the music of B.B. King as with Burzum.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 03, 2006, 07:19:20 AM
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I may be wrong and I may be right, but there is nothing backing up any other theory either.


You sit down to pee, don't you?

If you're looking for a single piece of "proof" for anything you don't understand history, or how it's manipulated. You have to look at multiple factors and think beyond the simplistic answers given.

But if all you read is Rolling Stone, of course you'll come up with bullshit... they're paid to sell you bullshit, and you're repeating it here for them. It's good infoterror for the modern world on your part.


Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 03, 2006, 07:39:13 AM
Perhaps posting these links will help boost this discussion. The first 29 seconds of part II should provide adequate comment to BFB's original post.

Heavy The Story Of Metal I
Heavy The Story Of Metal II
Heavy The Story Of Metal III
Heavy The Story Of Metal IV
Heavy The Story Of Metal V


Note that none of the bands mentioned in this documentary are actually heavy metal bands. But hey it's VH1, what do you expect? Sure, disco killed metal when Kiss sold out and that was it... ;) I'm sure they'd continue this story by saying heavy metal went on with Motley Crue, then became big with Guns n Roses and Metallica, and now rocks on forever in the form of Slipknot. Because that's basicly the truth about heavy metal. What makes a "heavy metal band" anyway?

Obviously heavy metal isn't a pure genre, nor is black metal or death metal for that matter. Each period, each band is just a chain in the evolution or useless to it's progress as an artform. The difference between black metal and heavy metal is Dimmu Borgir, who combine black metal imagery with heavy metal music to entertain as many people as possible and still have shock-value. Pure black metal is for instance Immortal's debut album. But what is pure heavy metal? As soon as the term began to spread it indeed became a name for anything that sounded loud, just like black metal has become a term for anything with corpsepaint and a raspy voice. This is a recurring problem when critics and fans judge music by image rather than judging image by music.

Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 03, 2006, 12:36:53 PM
Quote

You sit down to pee, don't you?

If you're looking for a single piece of "proof" for anything you don't understand history, or how it's manipulated. You have to look at multiple factors and think beyond the simplistic answers given.

But if all you read is Rolling Stone, of course you'll come up with bullshit... they're paid to sell you bullshit, and you're repeating it here for them. It's good infoterror for the modern world on your part.



I believe I already stated I don't read Rolling Stone.  I wish you would quit using that as an argument.

Also:  I am just saying that if you are going to try to say that history is false, then you better have something to back it up.  I know that proof can be faked as well, but that doesn't mean I should believe anything posted on a website.  


Re: Origins of heavy metal
December 04, 2006, 03:10:31 PM
pure heavy metal is iron maidens thirds album (there first one was a punk/heavy metal crossover and there second had punk elements), heavy metal is judas priest, because heavy metal is no different from rock it was the lyrical content that defined a metal group and their outlook on life