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Who/What is Satan?

Who/What is Satan?
December 05, 2013, 01:36:56 PM
Satan: a remarkable figure whose adherents usually don't believe in him, with some exceptions.

Blake and Milton saw for him a role in the mythology of heaven, much like Judas Iscariot (or from earlier Jewish traditions, the scapegoat, or ritual sacrifice designed to take guilt away from the population and kill its host, driving it into the spirit realm).

Some see Satan as an analogy for hubris, but this only works if you see God as an "order," or divine mathematics and celestial balance, and thus Satan as the individualistic withdrawal from the order of reality into the order of the Self, at which point he has become a delusional figure. If sin is error, Satan is the justification for sin (denial of reality).

Or perhaps he is the scapegoat to which we assign our fears, and needs no more existence than that. Or do our fears invoke him, and make him incarnate?

Even Slayer do not praise Satan so much as, much as in "War Pigs," warn of the mythological underpinnings to our bad choices here in regular old physical reality.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 05, 2013, 03:49:09 PM
Maybe Satan is All The Above.

Or maybe He is You and I.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 05, 2013, 07:03:34 PM
Satan is doubt, made real.


Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 05, 2013, 11:29:07 PM
Blake and Milton saw for him a role in the mythology of heaven, much like Judas Iscariot (or from earlier Jewish traditions, the scapegoat, or ritual sacrifice designed to take guilt away from the population and kill its host, driving it into the spirit realm).

Some see Satan as an analogy for hubris, but this only works if you see God as an "order," or divine mathematics and celestial balance, and thus Satan as the individualistic withdrawal from the order of reality into the order of the Self, at which point he has become a delusional figure. If sin is error, Satan is the justification for sin (denial of reality).

These are the two most common esoteric interpretations of Satan.  However the latter is superior as it transcends the anthropomorphic (exoteric) interpretation of God.  In this case Satan is something we all carry within ourselves (Ego) rather than an external figure.  It is only this interpretation that can be called truly metaphysical.  Obviously both points of view go beyond that of the majority of adherents of Abrahamic faiths, this does not invalidate them or the more common understanding of these religions.  The real crisis of the monotheistic traditions, and more specifically Western Christianity (Catholic, Protestant), is that they no longer possess a valid esoteric tradition and thus live on as a husk without a kernel so to speak.  This can be clearly witnessed by their total abandonment of traditional forms in architecture, art and the liturgy, as well as their adoption of the modernist counterfeits of these and modernist modes of thought.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 06, 2013, 03:28:00 AM
You think that Evil doesn't exist without egotistical delusion?

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 06, 2013, 07:06:47 PM
That's a fair question, and again, one of those rather too obvious ones that nobody ever asks.
Humans have a unique ability to create evil out of thin air.
It is important to know this, if one is ever going to resist the urge to do this, oneself.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 03:47:12 AM
The real trick is to define Evil.

In my experience, Evil does not benefit any one. Evil is any anti-human act.

Most people would love to think that something like this doesn't exist. That's cute.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 03:56:28 AM
When you stop seeing everything only in terms of humans, you'll see that evil simply doesn't apply to anything else but humans.
Stop focusing solely on humans, and life becomes something extraordinary.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 04:43:34 AM
Well, we ARE humans, After All.

I can go into a brief bit of personal theology here. Tune out if not interested.

"EVIL" is separation.

"GOOD" is joining together.

This does not relate specifically to humans. It happens universally. Primitive humans knew this. In the Christian Bible, we see Lucifer rejecting the authority of Jehovah (singularity, harmony, togetherness) and establishing a kingdom on The Earth (separation). I can provide more references and examples on request.

In modern scientific cosmology, we see that there is a distinct imbalance between "positive" and "negative" energy. Because our universe contains more "positive" energy (which is named arbitrarily [or not]), physical matter is able to exist in a relatively stable state. Due to Entropy, we see a decay in this state. Turns out, "stability" is very relative too. True stability is stasis. No movement. No time. No energy. This is pure "GOOD".

The only reason we exist and interact with various "individual" elements of the universe, is because of "EVIL".

Satan provided us with the opportunity to become "individual" beings.

Jehovah provides us with the opportunity to "individuate".

Both are necessary.

Our (United States citizens [I am only acquainted with those]) current mass mindset is that of individuation. Clearly (to a detached observer [or, in my case, an occultist]) this is destructive to society (which is arbitrariliy valuable). At the same time, I cannot deny the fact of entropy; "we" (as in humanity and the rest of the universe at large) are moving toward a state of minimal motion/energy/time.

Thus I act as a Satanist in the theological and psychological sense. This hinges on the idiomatic interpretation of value: Separation is more interesting than individuation.

That tells you more about me as a human being than any other text ever will.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 05:15:34 AM
It tells me you rely too much on your human mind.
This stasis you mention is actually nothing like the human mind renders it.
It is achieved after mind is shut down, and in this state, time no longer runs.
Past, present, future all become one eternal moment.
Nirvana.

Seriously: the secret is simple. You may be a human, but considering everything else in terms of a human, is the best way yet devised to ensure a human never really lives at all.




Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 05:20:43 AM
You don't think the human mind is limited necessarily to temporal restraints?

I wouldn't argue the other way. Asking out of curiosity.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 07, 2013, 05:26:11 AM
I think it has very few - if any - limits. We are the ones that do the limiting, by the things we believe or don't believe.
It starts early. Conditioning, brainwashing, schooling, socialization, beliefs and wrong beliefs, stigmas and taboos...
I have successfully experienced freedom from all that, and returned to tell of it.
It is possible.


Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 08, 2013, 02:57:48 AM
The real trick is to define Evil.

In my experience, Evil does not benefit any one. Evil is any anti-human act.

Most people would love to think that something like this doesn't exist. That's cute.

Satan - The Universal Enemy
Satan = Freedom (Satan =/= Lucifer).

what is, evil?
what teaching your mother and father?
your family, your church.
evil is only what is not for you.
everything bad is what hurts you.

but for those who sell guns, which is evil?
for those who steal eat for survive, that is evil?
to an alcoholic or drug addict who escapes from the infamous realities.
the police are to help me help you, or strike you, which is good or bad for them?

The Evil That men do!

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 08, 2013, 05:07:48 PM
I think it has very few - if any - limits. We are the ones that do the limiting, by the things we believe or don't believe.
It starts early. Conditioning, brainwashing, schooling, socialization, beliefs and wrong beliefs, stigmas and taboos...
I have successfully experienced freedom from all that, and returned to tell of it.
It is possible.

That, I believe.

The tricky thing is the fact that most everyone (where I'm from) has necessarily endured the conditioning and brainwashing.

How to break that conditioning? It must be destroyed violently, there is no gentle process. One must separate from the corrupt whole. So, one must be EVIL.

Not forever. The point is to synthesize the two evident opposites, good and evil. They are not even really opposite ends of a spectrum. They are more like spokes on a wheel.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 08, 2013, 05:14:23 PM
Maybe that's what it takes, for some, or even most. But it wasn't that way for me.
I was never evil. Sometimes violent, perhaps, but only in reaction to evil.
In my case, transitioning from know-nothing to nothing-to-know was a remarkably peaceful, benign process.
More like dropping stuff over a cliff and walking away from it.
I couldn't be evil if I tried :)