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Who/What is Satan?

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 01:22:19 AM
Satan, Iblees, is cognitive dissonance, jealousy, egotism, arrogance, narcissism, and sociopathy par excellence.  He knows that he is at the whim of a force which he tries to act against because he was too prideful in all of his knowledge and faith to give assistance to something greater than him; that which could benefit tremendously from his guidance and knowledge.  A good teacher or master will produce something greater than themselves.  Being a disembodied force which cannot deliver physical malice, Shaytan must use passive-aggressive delusions and lies that appeal to the parts of the psyche and self which must be subjugated.  He is called "Despair" because of his complete knowledge and knowing that his salvation is denied so far that he cannot submit to the ultimate authority in its hierarchy and sublime nature.  In turn, this would require knowing his station and accepting it ...

This response deserves a more complex and complete explanation, but this is what I have to offer.  It is no wonder that some of the architects of Communism, Anarchism, and extreme forms of Republicanism consider Satan to be a symbol.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 04:59:12 AM
Awful lot of shit-talking Satan for a metal forum.

It didn't take me long to realize why God caused so many problems for people. It's because God is a different thing to everyone. The word is diluted to the point of ambiguity.

Looks like the same thing has happened to the glorious name of Our Horned Lord.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:20:55 AM
Quote
I believe in a horned devil, a personified Satan. In my opinion all the other forms of Satanism are bullshit. I hate that some people think up idiotic ways of making eternal peace in the world and dare to call it Satanism, like so many do. Satanism comes from religious Christianity, and there it shall stay. I'm a religious person and I will fight those who misuse His name. People are not supposed to believe in themselves and be individualists. They are supposed to OBEY, to be the SLAVES of religion.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:27:59 AM
Quote
I believe in a horned devil, a personified Satan. In my opinion all the other forms of Satanism are bullshit. I hate that some people think up idiotic ways of making eternal peace in the world and dare to call it Satanism, like so many do. Satanism comes from religious Christianity, and there it shall stay. I'm a religious person and I will fight those who misuse His name. People are not supposed to believe in themselves and be individualists. They are supposed to OBEY, to be the SLAVES of religion.

I think the people who actually worship the devil of the Christian Bible are referred to as Luciferians and distinguish themselves from other types of Satanists (of which there are too many). O9A Satanism and various other occultist LHP religions are the only legitimate forms of actual Satan worship.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:41:15 AM
Expound on how a LHP person could literally believe in Satan the way being described. I know nothing about the occult and its terminology, but in my experience people who describe themselves as LHP are religious hipsters who define their belief as a metaphor and whatever is convenient for them. RHP seems to refer to real religion, which is the position advocated in the quote.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:58:19 AM
O9A texts refer to an "a-causal continuum", which is a fancy name for the classic spiritual plane.

This plane is inhabited by "a-causal entities", which is a fancy term for gods and demons.

The purpose of the occult discipline is to cause intersections between the a-causal and (our) causal worlds. When this occurs, those entities that "exist" a-causally can actually manifest as a life form (in most specific cases, within the life form that is doing the occult work) in our causal realm. Satan is one of (possibly many) a-causal entities, and the work of a Satanist is to manifest the Satanic will in our causal reality.

Yes, that probably sounds far out, because O9A uses their own terminology to make sure that no confusion takes place when dealing with their specific brand of Satanism. However, Jung suggested more or less the same idea, except he called the a-causal entities "archetypes".

Contrary to Jung's recommendations, O9A suggests that the best (most effective, most assured) way to achieve this connection with the a-causal is to embark down the LHP, which can be thought of as any path that leads one intentionally into evil, chaos, malevolence, and all the other elements of Satanism, of one's own will.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 07:23:35 AM
Broadly, it's the "will" part that makes me skeptical. You still seem to be describing an individualist system wherein Satan "manifests" according to each person's mental state. It brings down Satan as a tool to be manipulated by a practitioner, rather than as a superior being.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 04:44:44 PM
Sort of like seeing Satan more as godhead and less than a god, and manipulable much like occultism, New Thought, etc. suggest.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 04:55:44 PM
Broadly, it's the "will" part that makes me skeptical. You still seem to be describing an individualist system wherein Satan "manifests" according to each person's mental state. It brings down Satan as a tool to be manipulated by a practitioner, rather than as a superior being.

According to O9A and a handful of other occult texts, this is not the case. The individual makes himself a willing servant of the Satanic will. The individual's strength of will is what sends him down the LHP in the first place, but individual choice and preference have little to do with what comes next. This is why O9A specifically insists on committing atrocities against other humans; it goes against what an individual would want, for the sake of a greater cause. You'll find that even Crowley repeatedly warns (or encourages) LHP followers that, once begun, the path cannot be turned from, despite the follower's regrets or misgivings.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:21:02 PM
When you stop seeing everything only in terms of humans, you'll see that evil simply doesn't apply to anything else but humans.
Stop focusing solely on humans, and life becomes something extraordinary.

Do you mean evil can exist only on the actions of humans, or that even this kind of evil (perceived in the harmful actions of humans, say, f. example, shitting in someone's mouth, making him eat it, then torture the person before killing him) does not exist?

Quote from: dead last
You'll find that even Crowley repeatedly warns (or encourages) LHP followers that, once begun, the path cannot be turned from, despite the follower's regrets or misgivings.

Can you point me to where this is said, preferably making the quotations available?

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 05:57:28 PM
Do you mean evil can exist only on the actions of humans, or that even this kind of evil (perceived in the harmful actions of humans, say, f. example, shitting in someone's mouth, making him eat it, then torture the person before killing him) does not exist?


Remove humans, and evil is removed. Nothing else exhibits evil.
Since we are humans, how does this stunning revelation benefit us?
Become inhuman in our interaction with the whole, as in crow-like, and evil can no longer manifest.
Remove that human flaw from the state of being human, by understanding the flaw for what it is.
This is why religion is both vital, and why it so often defeats itself.
Abstraction is the root of evil.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 07:48:58 PM

Quote from: dead last
You'll find that even Crowley repeatedly warns (or encourages) LHP followers that, once begun, the path cannot be turned from, despite the follower's regrets or misgivings.

Can you point me to where this is said, preferably making the quotations available?

This is from Crowley's Book of Lies (version with O.T.O. commentary from 1962):

(part 18 on page 36)

"O thou that settest out on The Path, false is the Phantom that thou seekest. When thou hast it thou shalt know all bitterness, thy teeth fixed in the Sodom-Apple.

Thus hast thou been lured along That Path, whose terror else had driven thee far away.

O thou that stridest upon the middle of The Path, no phantoms mock thee. For the stride's sake thou stridest.

Thus art thou lured along That Path, whose fascination else had driven thee far away.

O thou that drawest toward the End of The Path, effort is no more. Faster and faster dost thou fall; thy weariness is changed in Ineffable Rest.

For there is no Thou upon That Path: thou hast become The Way."

Later in part 32 (page 74) he says the same thing, but without the context of LHP. This observation applies more universally.

"Consciousness is a symptom of disease.

All that moves well moves without will.

All skillfulness, all strain, all intention is contrary to ease.

Practice a thousand times, and it becomes difficult; a thousand thousand times, and it becomes easy; a thousand thousand times a thousand thousand, and it is no longer Thou that doeth it, but It that doeth itself through thee. Not until then is that which is done well done.

Thus spoke FRATER PERDURABO as he leapt from rock to rock of the moraine without ever casting his eyes upon the ground."

This to say that once an individual begins down his fated path, he will eventually become that which he practices. In O9A terms, this is when the a-causal is merged with and given presence in the causal and, despite the individual's will (or what Crowley calls "Thou"), the Act practices itself through the individual, rather than the individual practicing the Act.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 08:09:09 PM
You see the paradox? This is inherent in all truth. If you can see it, you're on your path.
The same rules apply to everything: good, bad, righteous and evil.
When you remove yourself from the equation, things really start to happen.


Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 08:21:56 PM
You cannot expect someone to follow their fated path like an automaton. The will to follow comes first, then the following of the path takes place. At last, there is no difference between the path you are following and what you are. Please don't think me pedantic for explaining this to you; we are probably explaining the same thing to one another at this point.

I don't know how someone can be expected to at-will "remove yourself from the equation" unless you are there to be removed in the first place. Actions need to be undertaken to initiate the change. That is the only practical reason that an individual has a will.

Re: Who/What is Satan?
December 09, 2013, 09:40:53 PM
god is silence

satan is noise.

that's why all the best bands are in league with satan :)