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No God, no Satan.

No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 02:25:59 PM
I observed, today, over at Bruce Charlton's Miscellany (http://charltonteaching.blogspot.ca/), that there is no God any more than there is a Satan...

"...And before you start jumping up and down, what that means is...
Both are linguistic terms, created by humans, as metaphorical descriptions for Reality (the way things are), and Non-Reality (the way things are not).
Subscribing to the idea of 'God', little or no harm results, and a great deal of constructive goodness may occur.
Subscribing to 'Satan', and thereby going directly against what-is, immense disruption and damage can result."

One may move in a way that is in keeping with Reality, incidentally gaining immense potential power by channeling the vast momentum of what-is, or one may move directly counter to it, in effect building a (temporary) dam against that momentum. In the latter case, no immediate disaster may be observable, as a result, but sooner or later, that dam will burst, and then...

If I have a problem with Christianity, it is this:
Whereas it is (or rather was) soundly based upon good and valid concepts, over the ages it has morphed into such abstractedness, that its message and its reason have all but totally dissolved.

There were reasons our ancestors went to such monumental effort and expense, to build their churches and cathedrals of Christianity. Certainly, they didn't arbitrarily do it, on a whim.

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 03:47:44 PM
Satan is not an excuse for evil. There is enough evil in the hearts of men. Anything can be an excuse, and the claim that Satan is some kind of distraction does not seem to have any merit as there is no demonstration of any such thing. If you have something to show in this regard I would like to see it. After all, leftists are godless and satanless.

Satan is real. Christianity itself has not morphed into anything, it is Christians who have changed (touched on in Dr. Charlton`s most recent entry). For if Christianity had indeed become what you say there would be no virtuous Christians, no even partially undeluded Christians, no good visible in Christianity. Ultimately, it is not the concepts, useful or not, behind Christianity that matter, but that it is true. With a rejection of revelation this can never be reconciled. Where exactly is your post by the way crow?

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 04:53:22 PM

Wow: what a long URL. I was actually responding to a comment, rather than the post itself. Or something...
Actually, I have not met any genuinely Christian Christians in a long, long time.
Without them having realized it, their whole belief-system seems to have become transformed into what It can do for them, rather what they can do for It.
Which, when you think about it, is the very same problem afflicting leftists, vis-a-vis society-at-large.

Besides, what is Christianity, anyway, if not the Christians who represent it?
If none of them do, then what remains?

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 05:22:35 PM
If God is defined as moving in a way compatible with reality and Satan is defined as an opposition to that, then of course "following God" would be the correct course of action.

The problem is Christians don't define it that way, if they ever did.

Their God is an unreal god, whom they turn to when they cannot stomach reality and want to wish it away, usually in context of pain and suffering. Satan then ends up as representing the force of reality, undisturbed by human bullshit, which is why so many death metal and black metal bands (which were reality-based) used him as an avatar.

These metaphors derive meaning and purpose only by how humans infuse them - different groups in different times can come up with reversed values concerning the same metaphors.

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 05:36:43 PM
Thanks. That was an interesting view. It isn't so much what it is, as what you decide to do with it.
From where I stand, reality is pretty benign, and non-reality the opposite.
Outlook is everything.
Get it right, and life is an exciting adventure.
Get it wrong, and life becomes an ever-threatening pointlessness.

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 08:29:17 PM
Whereas it is (or rather was) soundly based upon good and valid concepts, over the ages it has morphed into such abstractedness, that its message and its reason have all but totally dissolved.

I think the solution to this is to reclaim those concepts such that they actually become usual.

I don't believe in God, but I do believe in gods. And when I say that, I don't mean the Pagan gods, nor any other collection of gods that were worshiped in antiquity. I simply mean that my conception of godhood (omnipotent and omnipresent) has been manifested in reality.

Jesus is a god, but not for any of the reasons that people tend to call him a god. He is a god simply because his teachings have had an all-reaching influence on human culture. His omnipotence comes from the significance of this influence. His omnipresence comes from its breadth.

Note well that being a god is not equivalent to being good. Earth is currently ruled by evil gods and demons, and that's what makes it a hell. There are pockets of heaven here and there, but in the aggregate, this world is evil.

Which is why need more angels. This website seems to think that we need more demons, but that's only because they conflate angels with bondservants of God and ministers of peace. But angels are not hippies. They're not even nice. They're burning incarnations of goodness that smite all that is evil, and shudder with contempt at those who can't see it as such.

So I think you're doing wrong by saying that there is no God and there is no Satan. That's only the first step, rejecting their historical definitions. The second step is to reforge your own. If you can do this effectively, then you get that much closer to achieving the most ancient dream of man, "to know good and evil". It starts with redefining all of the religious terminology that you've junked. Once you reclaim them, you soon realize that they have a whole lot to offer.

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 16, 2014, 10:50:28 PM
The more I have dealings with people, the more clear it becomes that very little in the way of communication is really possible. Because each person judges every word only by what they themselves think they know of it.
One way in which I am different from almost every other human I have run into, is that I explore things I may not readily 'agree with'. Rather than just not agreeing, and rejecting out of hand, because of that.

There's a simple trick to this: I do not argue either for, or against anything, if I don't know what I am talking about.
I get to know what I am talking about, by observation and/or experience. Never by opinion alone.
Unlike the vast majority.

Not that I care. Just sayin'.

As a side note, consider:
How does anybody ever learn anything, if they automatically reject anything they don't already know?

Re: No God, no Satan.
February 17, 2014, 01:55:35 AM
It ever existed, christians only gave a name and a useful personality for christianity to them in my view.