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Folk "metal" without the rock

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
November 29, 2007, 08:22:33 PM
With varying degrees of "folk" and "metal":

Svafnir
Ashtar
Sig:Ar:Tyr
Fejd
Nest
Primordial

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
November 29, 2007, 08:39:37 PM
I'd like to know more about what the poster thinks of when he says "rock".

Burzum's third album - the one ever present in "top 10 black metal albums ever" lists - uses a rock beat, rock drumming and casual rock-style guitar strumming throughout almost the entire album. No one has any qualms about this. Why then is rock in 'folk metal' a problem?

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
November 30, 2007, 07:17:59 AM
It's restrictive, though I wasn't deriding rock stylings as much as looking for more (modern) music that doesn't adhere to that standard. Then again, wasn't Filosofem good in spite of the elements you mentioned, while not exactly defined by them? (I'd still choose HLTO over Filosofem, though).

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
November 30, 2007, 09:43:32 AM
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I quite like Arkona from Russia.
Excellent female vokillist.

Saw them live, horrible. Esspecialy the vocalist, she was jumping around like some nu-metal kid with his Nike cap around.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 01, 2007, 07:55:55 AM
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It's restrictive, though I wasn't deriding rock stylings as much as looking for more (modern) music that doesn't adhere to that standard. Then again, wasn't Filosofem good in spite of the elements you mentioned, while not exactly defined by them? (I'd still choose HLTO over Filosofem, though).


I was talking about HLTO (their THIRD album), not Filosofem. Det Som Engang Var is as upbeat as metal gets. But yes, the song is good - that fact just shows that quality is not a function of style.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 01, 2007, 12:21:11 PM
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Burzum's third album - the one ever present in "top 10 black metal albums ever" lists - uses a rock beat, rock drumming and casual rock-style guitar strumming throughout almost the entire album. No one has any qualms about this. Why then is rock in 'folk metal' a problem?


First, you assume that rock invented anything. Rock and blues and jazz invented nothing. They are styles.

Next, you forget that half the album is ambient, and while it does have its metal aspects, these do not terminate in a rock-like feeling; they are used as a gateway to something else.

Other bands simply drop into the rock and roll and make a clumsy hybrid and call it a day.

Later Graveland is, as one poster pointed out, uneven. I'm finding the newer stuff to be much improved over "Awakening," which has a rock rhythmic sensibility through its guitar work and doesn't, like Burzum, channel it elsewhere. It's a Lord Wind album adapted to Motley Crue.

Newer Graveland is much improved. The two Lord Wind albums may be his post-"Following the Voice of Blood" peak.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 01, 2007, 03:00:36 PM
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Later Graveland is, as one poster pointed out, uneven. I'm finding the newer stuff to be much improved over "Awakening," which has a rock rhythmic sensibility through its guitar work and doesn't, like Burzum, channel it elsewhere. It's a Lord Wind album adapted to Motley Crue.

Newer Graveland is much improved.



Yes, "Will stronger than death" is much better than the older stuff. "The fire of awakening" i don't even know.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 01, 2007, 07:48:14 PM
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First, you assume that rock invented anything. Rock and blues and jazz invented nothing. They are styles.


Beat me to it - the rhythms of Hvis lyset tar oss are obviously ambient in character, and the guitar technique some are trying to palm off as 'rock' is derived largely from Scandinavian folk music.  There is no such thing as 'rock' technique, because rock was never a genre of music, but rather a commercial aesthetic that can be applied to any genre.  Rock bands don't use 'rock technique' - they use the techniques that emerged from more authentic musics, but organize them in lazy, predictable patterns designed to appeal to the intellectually deficient masses.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 01, 2007, 10:56:31 PM
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Beat me to it - the rhythms of Hvis lyset tar oss are obviously ambient in character, and the guitar technique some are trying to palm off as 'rock' is derived largely from Scandinavian folk music.  There is no such thing as 'rock' technique, because rock was never a genre of music, but rather a commercial aesthetic that can be applied to any genre.  Rock bands don't use 'rock technique' - they use the techniques that emerged from more authentic musics, but organize them in lazy, predictable patterns designed to appeal to the intellectually deficient masses.

yes, the seemingly unconquerable problem repeating itself in modern music is the inability to distinguish between a characteristic found in music (i.e. music which utilizes ambient characteristics/feelings) and mistaking a characteristic for a style, or trying to create a style out of it, then probably settle for existing in that style or genre.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 04, 2007, 02:05:16 AM
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Beat me to it - the rhythms of Hvis lyset tar oss are obviously ambient in character, and the guitar technique some are trying to palm off as 'rock' is derived largely from Scandinavian folk music.  There is no such thing as 'rock' technique, because rock was never a genre of music, but rather a commercial aesthetic that can be applied to any genre.  Rock bands don't use 'rock technique' - they use the techniques that emerged from more authentic musics, but organize them in lazy, predictable patterns designed to appeal to the intellectually deficient masses.


I agree, but the fact that Burzum uses rock aesthetics is undeniable, no matter the amount of ambient content. If that fact doesn't make HVTO suck, why does this thread exist?

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 04, 2007, 03:14:09 AM
People are trying to derail this thread with their own drama.

Are there any good non-rock folk metal bands?

No.

Or for the optimistic...

Not yet.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 04, 2007, 06:10:57 AM
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I agree, but the fact that Burzum uses rock aesthetics is undeniable, no matter the amount of ambient content. If that fact doesn't make HVTO suck, why does this thread exist?


There's no 'rock aesthetic' in Hvis lyset tar oss - there are overlaps in technique, but only because both rock and Burzum draw from similar sources (European folk musics).  What matters is how technique is placed in composition, and Burzum's compositions are radically different from anything rock based.

aimanirrajim

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 08, 2007, 04:46:21 PM
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I agree, but the fact that Burzum uses rock aesthetics is undeniable, no matter the amount of ambient content. If that fact doesn't make HVTO suck, why does this thread exist?

by rock you mean the bouncy drum beats? come one...  ::)

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 08, 2007, 05:02:23 PM
Hvis Lyset Tar Oss rock based? Not really. I don't see the link between both, apart the same instrumentation. The composition is quite different. And the music is layered in a much more complex way.
Even the instruments are mostly simple melodies that layered together create an intricate and moody sound texture.

Re: Folk "metal" without the rock
December 08, 2007, 09:15:33 PM
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Hvis Lyset Tar Oss rock based? Not really. I don't see the link between both, apart the same instrumentation. The composition is quite different. And the music is layered in a much more complex way.
Even the instruments are mostly simple melodies that layered together create an intricate and moody sound texture.


One could say the same thing for Windir, whom the original poster discarded as too 'rockish'.