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other metal sites

other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 05:30:56 AM
I found this site and its probably the most shameless anus clone ever. (http://www.thebleakhorizon.com/)

If this is some sort of offshoot of the main site, i retract my statement.  Otherwise, i'm happy that others take metal as seriously, but somewhat disgusted by the ripping-off factor.  

I'm actually pretty sure that this isnt related to the anus because the little instrospection writings strike me as some sort of twisted blog covered up by poorly arranged sentences and a total copy of anus.com's web design.  It looks like a version of this website thats been sabatoged by a bunch of 14 year old emocore fanatics.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 06:05:02 AM
It's definitely not an offshoot - they have positive Pink Frothy AIDS reviews. They seem less severe than this site in terms of weeding out diamonds from the coal. It still has that feeling of youth, of branching out and discovering what's what instead of already knowing what is what. They would be found open-minded to a fault by some of our members, I suspect, but I think I agree with you - it's nice to see people taking metal seriously in this way, including taking an interest in philosophy and in transcending the banality of modern life.

That other big question you raised still looms large, though - is it simply a ripoff of the ANUS style fashioned to their own liking?

Edit: Upon reading further some of the articles and reviews, the writer(s) of this site seem very sensitive to music as art in a genuine and insightful way. There is alot of good work that has been done on this site and I don't think it should be absolutely disregarded due to the possible prejudices that arise because of its appearance and tone.

shadowmystic

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 09:14:17 AM
This site is excellent because it presents intelligent arguments for the quality of albums that are denounced here.  This means that some members here will be forced to evaluate their positions, creating a greater possibility for genuinly objective judgment of musical quality.  I worry that because most people here do not get intelligent opinions from anywhere else (they are hard to find these days) they start behaving like the reviews here are dogma, which I sincerely doubt is the way the reviewer intended them to be read.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 03:02:59 PM
Quote
This means that some members here will be forced to evaluate their positions, creating a greater possibility for genuinly objective judgment of musical quality.  


More people talking = more objectivity

Really?

Fuck, no!

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 03:08:04 PM
After reading a few of the reviews and skimming through some of the philosophical essays, for which we had high hopes, it becomes obvious that the writer apprehends little more in metal than aesthetic alongside a somewhat incomplete understanding of songwriting. Much of the reviews are of bands which for various reasons are philosophically unfamiliar with the general direction of metal's progression. If anything what can be ascertained is a hypertrophy of the tendency towards limiting oneself to a Romantic perspective, steeped in an agnostic sentimentalism that eschews the necessity of logical application in favor of nostalgia. The writing is well done, but the author's underlying knowledge base seems limited to reactionary philosophical movements against modernity, which, as such, contain elements of modern thought which often pass unnoticed. Particularly striking is the awful misinterpretation of Taoism, which shows an unfamiliarity with metaphysic: "There is found no advancing towards a higher state of being within Taoism, only a humbling stance of mankind modeling itself after nature’s ways for a harmonious life in accordance with the reality of nature." We can only recommend that this writer would do well to seek out writing that is done from an insider's perspective of such traditions, rather than Western Orientalists who have distorted such traditions beyond recognition.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 03:18:19 PM
Quote
This site is excellent because it presents intelligent arguments for the quality of albums that are denounced here.  This means that some members here will be forced to evaluate their positions, creating a greater possibility for genuinly objective judgment of musical quality.  I worry that because most people here do not get intelligent opinions from anywhere else (they are hard to find these days) they start behaving like the reviews here are dogma, which I sincerely doubt is the way the reviewer intended them to be read.


Somehow the site legitimizes the praise of substandard work?  By what virtue?  Using your ridiculously open-ended logic, all sites containing all opinions are somehow helpful in constant re-valuation of all standards by their very existence.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 03:33:31 PM
Quote
After reading a few of the reviews and skimming through some of the philosophical essays, for which we had high hopes, it becomes obvious that the writer apprehends little more in metal than aesthetic alongside a somewhat incomplete understanding of songwriting.  


This may be true, but the article on utilitarianism was great!

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 03:56:05 PM
Quote

More people talking = more objectivity

Really?

Fuck, no!


I think you've misread Moses' intentions with what he said. If we move from 900 people talking to 901 (to mirror the modern picture), we are not going to gain objectivity and may even lose it. There are simply too many voices and opinions and for any individual trying to take it all in, they will likely want to throw their hands up and give up on whatever the issue at stake was. However, if we are in a more sane situation comparing a single voice (the ANUS voice that is often the only source for many people) with a second voice, this has great benefit. The first voice's ideas are still implanted in us, but now they seem to take on a more lively flair when compared with another voice that is often saying the same or similar things but also different things. Both the similarities and differences stand out more and make a stronger impression on the mind, thus increasing their potential to influence the way reality is considered and thus the way action will be performed. The ideas feel more real and are thus being considered more and more as objective for the individual studying them in this sense.

Moses second point amplifies the first point. The reviews of the DLA are not to be taken dogmatically, for this would not allow for a full appreciation of them. Even if these other reviews are seen as lacking for whatever reason, the things that they lack and that the DLA has will be magnified for someone performing the comparison. A stronger impression on the reader can only be seen as good, I think...

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 04:03:57 PM
Quote

Somehow the site legitimizes the praise of substandard work?  By what virtue?  Using your ridiculously open-ended logic, all sites containing all opinions are somehow helpful in constant re-valuation of all standards by their very existence.


Albums are not absolutely good or bad. Mentioning a few positive aspects of a substandard work does not entail some revaluation of our higher standards for quality. It's simply saying "hey, this has some redeeming qualities if we're using a different standard." The reviewer of this site, although a little more liberal in his willingness to praise than this site, is still sensitive to bands losing their spirits and inspiration and producing substandard works, such as his negative review of Morbid Angel's "Domination" and the fact that most of his Pink Frothy AIDS reviews are negative (the only praise he will yield is that some of the riffs are interesting. One could be of the opinion that this is a fairer review than someone saying nothing is praiseworthy whatsoever.)

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 04:05:33 PM
Of course albums aren't absolutely good or bad.  Who said they were?

All I read from it is "Site B is ANUS-like site praising albums ANUS does not.  The reviews are equally valid ["intelligent"] and thus there should be some syncretism of 'worthwhile albums' because I like some of those praised on Site B that ANUS ignores."

Why is everyone always so hung up on "personal taste"?  Even in a place where there is purportedly some level of agreement about these ideas, there is the constant defensive ego-sniping of the underconfident.

No, ANUS reviews are not dogma, but that does not support the notion that there NEEDS to be some other site out there with the "legitimacy" to "overturn" them.

"Fair" reviews be damned.  I'm 100% confident that anyone here would admit the same re: Pink Frothy AIDS albums and their having "some interesting riffs," which is a meaningless sentiment.  Pink Frothy AIDS happens to be a name used to scorn broader negative trends.  If you can find an ANUS review that completely upends anything unequivocally, I'll be happy to see it.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 04:11:48 PM
Quote
All I read from it is "Site B is ANUS-like site praising albums ANUS does not.  The reviews are equally valid ["intelligent"] and thus there should be some syncretism of 'worthwhile albums' because I like some of those praised on Site B that ANUS ignores."

Why is everyone always so hung up on "personal taste"?  Even in a place where there is purportedly some level of agreement about these ideas, there is the constant defensive ego-sniping of the underconfident.

No, ANUS reviews are not dogma, but that does not support the notion that there NEEDS to be some other site out there with the "legitimacy" to "overturn" them.


I don't see where you're getting any of what you just said from the posts above.

I do not see anyone defending personal taste, and I do not see anyone saying this other site needs to exist. The Pink Frothy AIDS albums he gives aesthetic praise to I think are boring, if you want to bring personal taste into this, but it doesn't matter. The only point was that it is often helpful to see the opinions of others, especially when they mesh in most ways with our own (the Pink Frothy AIDS album reviews are bad cases generally), in order to draw out what is important to us and what we will make more concrete. It can be blinding to only have one view phrased one way before the eyes. This is not a strike against the truth or legitimacy of the DLA reviews, either.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 04:19:39 PM
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I don't see where you're getting any of what you just said from the posts above.


I'm getting it from the way people often act around here, as well as the above.

There is always under the surface or outright an insinuation by some users that everybody else here is completely beholden to ANUS unquestionably, and that when things strike at this perceived infallibility it is a personal victory of overcoming.  Instead of talking about ideas, we get distracted by the people clutching their thoughts before all else when they act this way.


Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 04:46:24 PM
Quote

I'm getting it from the way people often act around here, as well as the above.

There is always under the surface or outright an insinuation by some users that everybody else here is completely beholden to ANUS unquestionably, and that when things strike at this perceived infallibility it is a personal victory of overcoming.  Instead of talking about ideas, we get distracted by the people clutching their thoughts before all else when they act this way.



I think I agree with you here, and perhaps I ran with the vitriolic aspect of Moses post, and if I did I apologize. My point was not to make a claim about ANUS members (what the hell do I know what anyone here reads or listens to; onan could have an Pink Frothy AIDS fetish, it really doesn't matter). I was trying to make a point that was a little more general. I think what I wanted to express is that seeing a site like this that holds views very similar to ANUS views, and yet that diverges in some ways from ANUS views, can be valuable for someone relatively new to these ways of thinking. Seeing recurring themes and contemplating where and why ideas are diverging is a valuable exercise.

You are also of course right in mentioning that we should get back to those ideas.

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 05:14:19 PM
Guess Mr. Allen Donaldson forgot to cover up his DNS info. It even has his address on there when you look. However, judging from his profile on metalfordummies (http://www.metal-archives.com/userprofile.php?user=thebleakhorizon), he's one guy who doesn't crave anonymity.

shadowmystic

Re: other metal sites
February 02, 2008, 11:34:53 PM
Quote

Somehow the site legitimizes the praise of substandard work?  By what virtue?  Using your ridiculously open-ended logic, all sites containing all opinions are somehow helpful in constant re-valuation of all standards by their very existence.


No it's not legitimising the praise of sub-standard work.  I'm saying that this site may be useful for less experienced metal listeners, because it offers seemingly sound arguments for the worth of these albums.  This means that to realise why these albums aren't actually good will require the listener to have a greater understanding of the music.