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LOL@modern depression treatment

LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 02:52:04 PM
It's hilarious how doctors think that "depression" is a medical condition. Really, what percentage of depression patients actually have a legitimate medical condition that's making them depressed? Probably very few. For the most part the pills are given to totally normal, capable people who are simply lazy - "We'll give you these pills that make you feel better so you can ignore reality, and in the meantime your life will still suck because your habits sure as hell aren't going to change, but you probably won't care as much about it!".

Bullshit. I have better solutions for myself:
-Find service projects to participate in
-Build a computer for my technology-retarded parents
-Prepare my garden for spring planting
-Get my school's tabletop gaming club off the ground
-Play guitar
-Make friends, get laid, etc

How about you?

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 03:20:03 PM
I am with you their when i am feeling depressed: Guitar, writing a killer fucking riff can rip me out of a slump/depression as quickly as the depression sank on. Although once I went 3 months and felt every riff i wrote was horrible crap, but eventually I finally played the right string of notes that just brought a little smile to my face. Achievement is the greatest way to get out of depression i have to agree.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 04:35:31 PM
P.S. Beware the lower hedonism as opposed to the higher hedonism. "Getting laid" belongs to the lower hedonism of the animalistic herd. Searching the world for and eventually finding a high-caliber member of the female race to found a noble dynasty with, belongs to the "higher hedonism"...
While I agree that in the longterm finding a suitable life partner is more important than just "getting laid", at my age I think it's better to expect very little from the females in my peer group.

NHA

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 07:13:26 PM
If you stop stroking your dick long enough, maybe you'll realize you don't quite have everything figured out like you thought you did.

Most of what you advocated is covered by the branch of behavior therapy in psychology.

Besides, no competent psychiatrist would just give you pills as a solution. The pills are just there to make the patient more receptive to making positive changes in their life.


That being said, i wouldn't beta test pills produced by people with only a partial understanding of the brain.


Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 10:42:25 PM
The pills are just there to make the patient more receptive to making positive changes in their life.

You're right. There are at least three interests at work. The depressed patient. The physician attending to the patient. The pill providers and government oversight the providers see breathing down their necks. Not all three are on the same page.

That being said, i wouldn't beta test pills produced by people with only a partial understanding of the brain.

Do patients always know they are part of trial testing?

NHA

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 24, 2009, 11:37:15 PM
Do patients always know they are part of trial testing?

As far as i know, yea.


The beta testing comment was referring more to the FDA.

The FDAís standard for safety is "reasonable certainty". Its very difficult for them to test long term side affects.

Test group sizes can be a problem too.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 25, 2009, 12:17:39 AM
I think this is a rather simplistic way to see depression. In many cases it is not so much that the person is lazy and so does not do anything but rather one finds no reason to do anything as nothing brings joy. Depression is far more severe than just feeling blue, most psychiatrists will not diagnose depression unless the person has been in this state for a period of at least six months and has not been aided by other mental conditions or drugs. Feeling sad is not considered a mental illness but when it is a pervasive interference in ones life over an extended period of time is considered as much.

More extreme cases can not only bring on rather severe physical symptoms which not only make the foundations for a deeper depression but also can leave a person so empty of purpose that they cannot leave their bed without prompting. Depression can be a hugely debilitating illness that prevents one from doing even the most simple of tasks without massive effort.

The so called solutions provided with the original post are probably about as constructive as yelling at them to stop being sad. It is true that in the end in order to come out of a bout of depression one must use ones internal will which nobody can do for you but the modern methods of treating depression are designed to make it as easy as possible for them to do this. Depression feeds of off itself until a personís total ethos has bent itself so that things which normally bring joy bring further sadness. Rather than just throwing "fun" things at a depressed person you first need to begin to change this ethos by nudging them in another direction until over time they are stable enough to take the reigns to lead them out of unhappiness.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 25, 2009, 12:41:54 AM
In many cases it is not so much that the person is lazy and so does not do anything but rather one finds no reason to do anything as nothing brings joy.

That's when the people start relying on tv, video games or that nature, it's false..that isn't reality. Then they like that, it covers up well and accept it. By having an interest or drive to achieve something that you like doing, that will motivate and you'll be doing something with your life feeling satisfied with atleast something instead of wasting away. The common people out there don't know shit about that, they just pretend and deal with it having nothing that makes them happy, most likely not doing much with their wasteful lives. Once your dead, your fucking dead.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 25, 2009, 12:46:36 AM
I belive confucius once stated you should leave the dead to the dead and live during the day.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 25, 2009, 04:37:39 AM
both sides have valid points here. it is true that psychiatrists over-prescribe  a lot, but a lot of people really are depressed. if you do a brain scan you can actually see that some parts of the brain are less active than they should be, and that causes a wide range of problems based on where it is happening, depression is one of them. drugs do remedy this to a great degree, so you can't ignore their value. ultimately it does depend on the competence of the psychiatrist and his willingness to do the correct thing instead of just prescribing something because they get perks from a company.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 25, 2009, 07:11:29 PM
Modern societies tend to produce two kinds of people: oblivious fools, or obliviots, who fail to notice failure and just blunder on like drunken gourmands; and depressed smarter people, who realize that the long-term prognosis for such stupid decisions is awful, but simultaneously note that everyone else is an obliviot, therefore there’s little chance of change.

So they sink into depression and solipsism (right), or depression and narcissism (left), which in fact worsens the problem by removing them from interaction with reality, which is the one thing that could actually undo the problem.

It’s brilliant.

Now, new research on depression shows us how it is habit-forming. Notice bad things, live in a state of terror and negativity, and soon you can’t see good things — like how just acting sensibly toward a goal could remove all the problems you see, easily.

Depression: a lack of goal

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
September 29, 2009, 01:00:11 PM
"We'll give you these pills that make you feel better so you can ignore reality, and in the meantime your life will still suck because your habits sure as hell aren't going to change, but you probably won't care as much about it!".

Welcome to modernity: we deal in effects, not causes, and means, not ends, because effects/means are what YOU experience.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
October 02, 2009, 03:39:10 AM
My entire young life i was told i was depressed and had all sorts of problem. I was put into treatment against my will with a handful of joyfully insane people and therapists. I was given pills until one day i thought to myself "i would rather experience life as my body was meant to, if i am depressed due to a chemical imbalance which may result in suicide, its a natural fate, if its merely hard i can handle that"

Here i am several years later perfectly fine, better then ever in fact. Even after my parents and doctors all tried to guilt me, telling me i was insane.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
October 02, 2009, 07:46:34 AM
My entire young life i was told i was depressed and had all sorts of problem. I was put into treatment against my will with a handful of joyfully insane people and therapists. I was given pills until one day i thought to myself "i would rather experience life as my body was meant to, if i am depressed due to a chemical imbalance which may result in suicide, its a natural fate, if its merely hard i can handle that"

Here i am several years later perfectly fine, better then ever in fact. Even after my parents and doctors all tried to guilt me, telling me i was insane.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anosognosia (I'm not saying anything with absolute certainty, but your family and doctors obviously had a reason for believing what they did). My ex-partner has a personality disorder and would email me asking for help with her new relationship and is abusing drugs regularly (pot, coke and xanax+alcohol are the ones that I know of, god knows what else), all the while insisting that she was "fine" and felt "peace inside".

Telling someone who is depressed to turn around and change their lives is like telling an anorexic that their solution is eating a sandwich. Yes, that is a positive outcome, but doesn't really provide a solution per se.

Re: LOL@modern depression treatment
November 02, 2009, 04:35:20 AM
Welcome to modernity: we deal in effects, not causes, and means, not ends, because effects/means are what YOU experience.

Ending destructive causes makes the effects disappear. When the effects disappear, the profit and popularity of the numerous effects-fighters ends. There's a motive. What you experience is how it is marketed.