Death/black metal on mainstream radio

[Conservationist]

Over the years, metal has substantionly been recognized as both a unique subculture and an underground movement to express not-so-mainstream emotions. Recently, however, this notion has been taken to the next level. With shows like Dethklok and the mainstream success of both the metalcore and the extreme metal genres, we are bound to have a mainstream radio station playing different kinds of extreme metal in the near future.

What would your reaction be? Would you disband your feelings for metal because you're no longer part of the "underground" ? Or would you be proud of your favorite music genre making mainstream success.

Society is constantly creating subcultures within its own grasp; however underground metal has usually only been played on local college stations. Metal is constantly evolving at an extreme rate - let's see what's in store for it as the next decade is at our doorstep.

[heather]

I think an underground metal radio station I think is more suitable, as there are some today, makes sense to keep it as is. Underground is unquestionably not known to most, let alone would it make it to the mainstream aspect and sound to appear on mainstream radio.

[scourge]

I'd take a look at classical for close comparison.

[infidecimal]

Would I be proud of my favorite music genre making mainstream success? No. I don't support metal as a genre.
Let the week die and support 1% that is meaningful and good.

[Devamitra]

I would like to rephrase, or maybe put a tangential question: would promotion of quality metal be successful on a mainstream radio station?

In Finland metal is mainstream, and on mainstream radio stations. In the 90's many people were introduced to metal through a weekly show (note: nowadays such shows exist on 5 nights of the week) on one of the most prominent (government administered, mind you) radio stations which covered all genres, including interviews. But of course mostly Children of Bodom, less Immolation. And it shows in the demographic - we might have the most Immolation fans per capita, but we still have more Bodom fans.

[Cargést]

Why does the mainstream matter at all?  I don't really care if thousands of morons think they like Extreme Metal.

[Humanicide]

Why does the mainstream matter at all?  I don't really care if thousands of morons think they like Extreme Metal.

The question was, of course, hypothetical.

In reality, something considered "extreme" by the masses can in no way be largely popular, because it is considered "extreme". Would I be mad if a band like Burzum, Immolation, or Phobia got radio airplay? Maybe a bit at first, but then I would think of how royalties would go to the band, and how many people would be exposed to their excellent music. Sort of a double edged sword, but in the end if the artist is spurred financially for making great art, I'd say they deserve it.

[Jim Necroslaughter]

I would be proud.  Abandoning metal because it is "mainstream" is silly and utterly reactionary.

Think about this:  historically, where has metal always been most popular, more accepted, and more "mainstream?"  Europe, Scandinavia, Norway.  I don't think it's a coincidence that this is where the best metal (I would argue) has come from.  I am concerned with listening to good, high-quality metal, not with being part of an "underground."  The ultimate goal should simply be:  more, new, good metal being released.  I contend that quality extreme or heavy metal entering the popular/mainstream conciousness does NOT NECESSARILY hurt the potential for more, new, good metal being released, as is seen in the history of metal in Europe, Scandinavia, Norway.  I'm not saying it will help metal, either, but if we see a complete absence of good metal being released or an even more precipitous drop in quality, in the coming years, I will eat my words.

[Cargést]

Where does the bulk of terrible "new" Metal come from?

Europe.  Scandinavia.  Norway.

Norway hasn't produced a single decent bit of Metal for almost fifteen years.

[Devamitra]

Where does the bulk of terrible "new" Metal come from?

Europe.  Scandinavia.  Norway.

I have to disagree. Nothing in the Old World comes even close to the haven of democracy and freedom that gave us Job For A Cowboy, Linkin Park, Killswitch Engage and Bullet For My Valentine.

Hell, I'd rather have a rubber bondage session with Shagrath and Nergal utilizing the Pink Frothy AIDS discography of background music than think about stuff like "windmill moshing" and it's cultural relationship to Christian metalcore.

[Cargést]

Bullet for my Valentine are Welsh.  I have shown that you are incorrect in one instance, thus, I have won the argument!  Ha ha!

[we hope you die]

I think the point is that metal already has a mainstream face, Metallica, Iron Maiden, CoF, Killswitch Engage, Spinal Tap etc etc. I think we can agree that decent underground metal has no mainstream face because it is underground. By definition it is a more acquired taste and more complex to grasp, otheriwse it wouldn't be underground. It is not pleasant or nice to listen to. I think the point of this thread is to give the mainstream a taste of what real underground metal sounds like and what it's intentions are. It is NOT the desire to popularise and dilute the concepts and music that make underground metal so great.

Granted this is a near impossible task as to make something mainstream you must make it easy to digest for a mainstream audience, because otherwise people get bored/scared. But i think this is a worthwhile project as for every 1000 idiots who misunderstand, mock and demonize, you will get a kid who really digs it and may just be the next Varg Vikernes or Rob Darken.

[Istaev]

greater exposure brings new blood to the genre and it also brings an influx of posers. you need to balance the two, obviously. there needs to be avenues for newcomers to reach the underground (like mainstream radio) but we don't want to saturate society with it.

[Vanguard]

The underground status of quality Metal to me is a trait and condition of its birth to me, rather than a reason to support Metal. Furthermore, I believe that quality Metal should stay underground, as it needs to maintain its occult roots. I also think that Metal is best to do without mainstream support. The mainstream media will often be fascinated with  the phenomenon that is Metal, but its motives are financial and not cultural, and so it is not in the best interest of Metal to become intertwined with commercial powers. Might I add that Metal is already infiltrated by negative mainstream affiliations, hence the Snickers and similar advertisements that can be seen at Metal festivals in Europe. My advice is that Metal affiliate itself with independent types more.

[Jim Necroslaughter]

I think the point is that metal already has a mainstream face, Metallica, Iron Maiden, CoF, Killswitch Engage, Spinal Tap etc etc. I think we can agree that decent underground metal has no mainstream face because it is underground. By definition it is a more acquired taste and more complex to grasp, otheriwse it wouldn't be underground. It is not pleasant or nice to listen to. I think the point of this thread is to give the mainstream a taste of what real underground metal sounds like and what it's intentions are. It is NOT the desire to popularise and dilute the concepts and music that make underground metal so great.

Granted this is a near impossible task as to make something mainstream you must make it easy to digest for a mainstream audience, because otherwise people get bored/scared. But i think this is a worthwhile project as for every 1000 idiots who misunderstand, mock and demonize, you will get a kid who really digs it and may just be the next Varg Vikernes or Rob Darken.

greater exposure brings new blood to the genre and it also brings an influx of posers. you need to balance the two, obviously. there needs to be avenues for newcomers to reach the underground (like mainstream radio) but we don't want to saturate society with it.

This is what I was thinking.  A good way to attract non-hipsters and non-depressed goth/outcast types is via "mainstream."  Enter Sandman on MTV and Seasons in the Abyss in the high school weight room trickles down into my friends' older brothers (who were "popular," well-adjusted, and "cool") listening to Slayer, Sepultura, Deicide, and Morbid Angel when I'm in middle school.  That, in turn, gives me an exposure to extreme metal when I'm 12 and I sort of look up to these guys because they're cool and they lift weights and they play football.  The Sepultura was "Chaos A.D." and the Morbid Angel was "Domination," but it didn't matter because the seed had been planted, and I had an appreciation for metal in a NON-IRONIC way.  Later on when I'm in college I discover black metal, I was late to the party, but hey, in 1991 I was only 8 years old.  The point is that when kids are 12-17 yrs. old, the well-adjusted kids tend toward the mainstream (whatever it may be) and usually branch out a little later on.  I say Immortal or Vader on the radio is better for metal, and kids, in general, than hip-hop/rap on the radio.