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Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs

Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 09, 2009, 09:11:58 AM
Quote
The Czech government today approved the list of hallucinogenic plants and mushrooms, including hemp, coca, mescaline cactus and magic mushrooms, and decided that people would be allowed to grow up to five pieces of such plants and keep 40 magic mushrooms at home, a CTK source said.

http://www.ceskenoviny.cz/zpravy/czech-govt-defines-rules-of-hallucinogenic-plants-growing/411010

Is this a part of the marketing plan for the new Master's Hammer album?

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 09, 2009, 09:58:34 AM
This is excellent news, and a sensible move by the government. It looks like they are making some good decisions there after rejecting the US missile shield and now this.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 09, 2009, 08:05:27 PM
Rejecting the missile shield is the stupidest thing they've ever done. Before you object, come back in twenty years.

Drugs, alcohol, sex, overwork, liberal politics, parasitic social scenes, hobbies that involve collecting things, and mindless religion are the best possible ways to waste your life AND have negative consequences on those around you. Avoid.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 12:58:51 AM
Neat. I wonder how this will turn out for the country's economy? I must say I am not in favor of most hallucinogenic drugs, as many are synthetic and should not be trusted (like LSD or PCP). Marijuana, mushrooms, mescaline, and other natural hallucinogens are OK by me, but I personally refuse to do anything stronger than marijuana.

If it turns out well, perhaps the Czechs could serve as a good example for other countries.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 01:20:19 AM
Neat. I wonder how this will turn out for the country's economy? I must say I am not in favor of most hallucinogenic drugs, as many are synthetic and should not be trusted (like LSD or PCP). Marijuana, mushrooms, mescaline, and other natural hallucinogens are OK by me, but I personally refuse to do anything stronger than marijuana.

If it turns out well, perhaps the Czechs could serve as a good example for other countries.

Could you elaborate on why (semi)-synthetic hallucinogens, specifically LSD (I don't really give a fuck about PCP), are not to be trusted, but naturally occurring one like psilocybin and mescaline are fine?

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 01:33:24 AM
Could you elaborate on why (semi)-synthetic hallucinogens, specifically LSD (I don't really give a fuck about PCP), are not to be trusted, but naturally occurring one like psilocybin and mescaline are fine?

I should've been more specific. I personally do not trust them. I didn't mean to phrase it as I did.

To be honest, observing behavior of those who have done LSD and contrasting them with those who have done marijuana, my experience has caused me to trust the latter. You wouldn't believe how many people I have met or heard about who are permanently on a "trip".

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 01:37:39 AM
Could you elaborate on why (semi)-synthetic hallucinogens, specifically LSD (I don't really give a fuck about PCP), are not to be trusted, but naturally occurring one like psilocybin and mescaline are fine?

I should've been more specific. I personally do not trust them. I didn't mean to phrase it as I did.

To be honest, observing behavior of those who have done LSD and contrasting them with those who have done marijuana, my experience has caused me to trust the latter. You wouldn't believe how many people I have met or heard about who are permanently on a "trip".

Oh, ok.  That makes sense.  LSD in particular has one of the strongest associations with HPPD (Hallucinogenic Persisting Perception Disorder).

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 03:41:53 AM
Quote
Drugs, alcohol, sex, overwork, liberal politics, parasitic social scenes, hobbies that involve collecting things, and mindless religion are the best possible ways to waste your life AND have negative consequences on those around you. Avoid.

Funny thing is, most of those things would be avoided if people took just one magic mushroom each year.

They've also effectively legalized marijuana and ecstasy, which aren't hallucinogens. I'm not sure what their logic is there. I consider both those drugs more harmful than hallicinogens but probably less harmful than alcohol. And the Czechs would probably tear down parliament if alcohol was banned.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 04:52:59 AM
They've also effectively legalized marijuana and ecstasy, which aren't hallucinogens. I'm not sure what their logic is there. I consider both those drugs more harmful than hallicinogens but probably less harmful than alcohol.

Ecstasy, I agree with. That shit puts holes in your brain. Literally. Marijuana is a mild hallucinogen, and while I do not agree that it is physically harmful, it is harmful in other ways (ie - dumbasses who do nothing but eat fast food, sit around and smoke it all day).


And the Czechs would probably tear down parliament if alcohol was banned.

Hahahahaha. Well played.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 05:31:29 AM
Quote
Drugs, alcohol, sex, overwork, liberal politics, parasitic social scenes, hobbies that involve collecting things, and mindless religion are the best possible ways to waste your life AND have negative consequences on those around you. Avoid.

Funny thing is, most of those things would be avoided if people took just one magic mushroom each year.

They've also effectively legalized marijuana and ecstasy, which aren't hallucinogens. I'm not sure what their logic is there. I consider both those drugs more harmful than hallicinogens but probably less harmful than alcohol. And the Czechs would probably tear down parliament if alcohol was banned.
Yeah, because drugs are eye opening and people that take mushrooms never do any of those things...no wait...

I can't think of a more irritating myth. There's a NEGATIVE correlation between drugs and creativity (and critical thinking obviously).

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 06:55:34 AM
Quote
Drugs, alcohol, sex, overwork, liberal politics, parasitic social scenes, hobbies that involve collecting things, and mindless religion are the best possible ways to waste your life AND have negative consequences on those around you. Avoid.

Funny thing is, most of those things would be avoided if people took just one magic mushroom each year.

They've also effectively legalized marijuana and ecstasy, which aren't hallucinogens. I'm not sure what their logic is there. I consider both those drugs more harmful than hallicinogens but probably less harmful than alcohol. And the Czechs would probably tear down parliament if alcohol was banned.
Yeah, because drugs are eye opening and people that take mushrooms never do any of those things...no wait...

I can't think of a more irritating myth. There's a NEGATIVE correlation between drugs and creativity (and critical thinking obviously).

Why does it annoy you and how do you know there is a negative correlation? Have you taken any hallucinogens or had experience with people who have? I'd just like to know where your opinion came from. Mine came from personal experience and there's a good amount of reasoning behind it. I'd like to hear your reasoning too.
http://arpa.allenpress.com/arpaonline/?request=get-document&doi=10.1043%2F1543-2165%282005%29129[1457:TEODDA]2.0.CO%3B2#TOC

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 09:02:40 AM
I'd just like to know where your opinion came from. Mine came from personal experience and there's a good amount of reasoning behind it.

And what is yours? It hasn't been stated yet in the thread, at least not explicitly.

How could a drug which temporarily dissolves various facets of an organism's sensory existence in favor of masturbatory hallucinogenic substitutes afford that organism any additional capacity to think rationally? If nothing else, it perverts the user's ability to be pragmatic. Maybe it's fun -- in the same way that an amusement park or a circus might be -- but to claim it provides one with otherwise elusive wisdom or insight is both absurd and patronizing to non-users.

The stereotypical "Drugs can open your mind and show you new realms of existence" monologues smack of liberalism and "open-mindedness," and are always fallacious, for they are arguments from personal experience, which means they're empirically invalid. I'm sure there a ton of studies demonstrating how some drugs increase vague "positive" feelings and overall happiness levels in individuals, but who cares? Hippies, that's who.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 10:14:06 AM
Quote
Drugs, alcohol, sex, overwork, liberal politics, parasitic social scenes, hobbies that involve collecting things, and mindless religion are the best possible ways to waste your life AND have negative consequences on those around you. Avoid.

Funny thing is, most of those things would be avoided if people took just one magic mushroom each year.

They've also effectively legalized marijuana and ecstasy, which aren't hallucinogens. I'm not sure what their logic is there. I consider both those drugs more harmful than hallicinogens but probably less harmful than alcohol. And the Czechs would probably tear down parliament if alcohol was banned.
Yeah, because drugs are eye opening and people that take mushrooms never do any of those things...no wait...

I can't think of a more irritating myth. There's a NEGATIVE correlation between drugs and creativity (and critical thinking obviously).

Why does it annoy you and how do you know there is a negative correlation? Have you taken any hallucinogens or had experience with people who have? I'd just like to know where your opinion came from. Mine came from personal experience and there's a good amount of reasoning behind it. I'd like to hear your reasoning too.
http://arpa.allenpress.com/arpaonline/?request=get-document&doi=10.1043%2F1543-2165%282005%29129[1457:TEODDA]2.0.CO%3B2#TOC
http://books.google.com.au/books?id=cpc7CJH1-s8C&pg=PT625

"The handful of studies that have involved use of these drugs suggests that, again in direct opposition to conventional wisdom, creativity gains no positive benefit from drug use. Indeed, long-term or heavy use of these drugs may have a detrimental effect on creative production."

No, I have not taken any drugs minus mild analgesics and flu medicine (and I try and avoid the latter two), and I can count the amount of times I've been drunk on one hand. Anecdotal: My experience with drug users is almost negative, they are anti-intellectual and often closed minded ("whoa man, that's not a cool idea").

People seem to think that because creative artist or original person X did drugs, that they must of been creative for that reason. I'm pretty sure that Beethoven wasn't doing pot when he wrote the ninth or that Goethe was tripping on mushrooms while writing Faust. In fact, it seems like the quality of music and literature has downgraded since drugs became more mainstream (not implying causality). Perhaps relative absence of drug use in the early black metal scene is one of the reasons for it's quality and originality.

Reading Nietzsche or listening to Burzum for a few hours is far more "eye opening" than getting high and craving cookies. Good luck critically thinking about morality when you're completely wasted.

Also, all that article demonstrates is a correlation between creativity and psychopathology, there's another study documenting this.  http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/52456

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 12:30:43 PM
I have no problem with personal drug use if it's kept private and controlled, but I hope the people of Prague have good coping skills once their streets are overrun by fucked-up tourists and sleazy parasites (assuming these drugs are legal for public sale).

I don't expect this to last long.

Re: Czech Republic legalizes hallucinogenic drugs
December 10, 2009, 12:59:30 PM

http://books.google.com.au/books?id=cpc7CJH1-s8C&pg=PT625

"The handful of studies that have involved use of these drugs suggests that, again in direct opposition to conventional wisdom, creativity gains no positive benefit from drug use. Indeed, long-term or heavy use of these drugs may have a detrimental effect on creative production."

I don't think we can rely on scientific studies for this issue, this article admits a "handful of studies" is not enough to conclude anything. I do agree that drugs in general do not foster creativity. At least for hallucinogens, they are to me an experience which can allow deeper insight into knowledge which the user already possesses, much like disease and personal problems which are similar experiences. I was already deeply into philosophy when I had my single magic mushroom experience. It seems to strip away my ego and allow me to view my knowledge in a different context. Whether that is a more "true" or "real" context or less can't be ascertained by any study. An untalented person would not gain anything meaningful other than the "whoa, dude..." dumbfounded amazement common to hippie culture. I do think that those who lack purpose in life and the "workaholics" who live to work would perhaps be able see through the meaningless consumerism of modern living that they would otherwise not be able to. It may not be completely speculative to say that Nietzsche's anguish at his personal life is comparable to illness and drugs as it engendered his search for meaning that may not have materialized with a happy and content life.