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GM Foods

GM Foods
January 18, 2010, 03:44:58 AM
I've been learning a lot about genetically modified foods lately. Although everyone here likely avoids anything that is not organically produced, I would like to fortify this perspective by presenting the video "The Health Dangers of Genetically Modified Foods". At the end of the video, the list mentioned can be found here.

A quote from the Genetic Engineering thread, which sparked my interest:
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=6262083407501596844&ei=dbcyS4G5FMyclAfCz7nGDw

Here is a Google Video link to a captivating documentary about the Monsanto company and how their production of genetically modified organisms (GMOs) are affecting or could potentially affect the world. It has been an introduction to some of the challenges we actually face with genetic engineering and related topics.

I will definitely be more cautious when purchasing food after watching these videos.

Re: GM Foods
January 18, 2010, 04:07:47 PM
Thanks for this! There is too much of this genetically modified food in America. You do see a lot of people trying their best to eat right, eat organic, and it is not easy to do this because this country makes it harder to do so. I do all the best I can to eat healthy and organic.  Having my own garden will be my goal.

For Europeans, and in my case Italians, to eat right has been done all along. Living off the land sometimes was not a choice but you had to do it. From this there is a love of the land, and this goes hand in hand especially if you have a pagan view point.

Also with this, if you do not eat right, you have to detox your system on a regular basis. Eating nothing but vegan food for a day, along with green tea and water will help. I do not eat too much meat but if you do you have to detox even more. You will feel yourself lighter and have more energy when you do so...

Re: GM Foods
January 18, 2010, 10:28:29 PM
On the same issue, the film Bullshit, following Vandana Shiva, a hindu anti-globalist anti-capitalist activist. She actually got a few things done
http://www.livevideo.com/video/mercofspeech/CB433A09CB714FFBA061958B296481DE/bullshit-part-1.aspx

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 12:21:21 AM
Most of the hype against GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can't play God with foods, there must be something negative as a result!

I'll stick this in the same category as I stick power lines, TV and computer radiation causing cancer, Scientologists treating illnesses with vitamin supplements and dietary changes and masturbation causing blindness: nonsense.

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 01:31:59 AM
Most of the hype against GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can't play God with foods, there must be something negative as a result!

I'll stick this in the same category as I stick power lines, TV and computer radiation causing cancer, Scientologists treating illnesses with vitamin supplements and dietary changes and masturbation causing blindness: nonsense.

I sense your sarcasm -- how witty. Have a basis for your argument, or fuck off. I've provided the point, you provide the counterpoint. Post something intelligent, or do not post in my threads. I can't stand bullshit like this. Watch this:
Quote
Most of the hype for GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can play God with foods, there must be something positive as a result!

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 01:43:21 AM
I will second the motion of Chessnut , as my wife cured her cancer with vitamin c treatments. As I said before the lack of knowledge  of the food that you eat is amazing.  I am truly at a loss when it comes to this....

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 01:57:34 AM
Most of the hype against GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can't play God with foods, there must be something negative as a result!

I'll stick this in the same category as I stick power lines, TV and computer radiation causing cancer, Scientologists treating illnesses with vitamin supplements and dietary changes and masturbation causing blindness: nonsense.

I sense your sarcasm -- how witty. Have a basis for your argument, or fuck off. I've provided the point, you provide the counterpoint. Post something intelligent, or do not post in my threads. I can't stand bullshit like this. Watch this:
Quote
Most of the hype for GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can play God with foods, there must be something positive as a result!

You haven't provided anything. An hour long video from an author ranting about genetically modified foods is not evidence. There has never been any scientific study or any data proving negative health effects from eating genetically modified food.  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_food_controversy
"A 2008 review published by the Royal Society of Medicine noted that GM foods have been eaten by millions of people worldwide for over 15 years, with no reports of ill effects. Similarly a 2004 report from the US National Academies of Sciences stated: "To date, no adverse health effects attributed to genetic engineering have been documented in the human population."

Feel free to follow through with the sources.

There's Michael Moore videos and 9/11 conspiracy videos which seem cohesive and plausible enough, but they are usually backed up by faulty studies or insufficient data.

Forza Romana: I've been eating a lot more tuna lately and haven't been having hemorrhoids: Did the tuna cure my hemorrhoids?

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/c.html

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/altbelief.html

It's a common human fallacy to overgeneralise things that happen to you as an individual. Your wife's cancer went into remission while she was taking vitamin C, therefore vitamin c cured it. You were bitten by a dog as a child, therefore all dogs are vicious animals and should be feared.

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 02:20:40 AM
Some people think that the average human is supposed to live to one hundred and die peacefully. I think there's a reason most degenerative diseases only manifest after middle age. People seem to be living past their normal life expectancy. Food has a simple purpose. Avoiding junk, processed foods, and a little dose of common sense should be enough for most people. Death will come regardless.

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 05:28:20 AM
Most of the hype against GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can't play God with foods, there must be something negative as a result!

I'll stick this in the same category as I stick power lines, TV and computer radiation causing cancer, Scientologists treating illnesses with vitamin supplements and dietary changes and masturbation causing blindness: nonsense.

I sense your sarcasm -- how witty. Have a basis for your argument, or fuck off. I've provided the point, you provide the counterpoint. Post something intelligent, or do not post in my threads. I can't stand bullshit like this. Watch this:
Quote
Most of the hype for GM foods is based on nothing but laymen opinions and knee jerk reactions. You can play God with foods, there must be something positive as a result!


Umm, what's your problem? Sometimes people have different opinions; get over it. Because someone disagrees with you, it does not mean he is personally attacking you. He does make a good point that you intentionally ignore. The media sensationalizes and manipulates information to get emotional reactions like the one they've gotten out of you. This was his point and you prove it by reacting emotionally to any suggestion that GM foods are not  in fact dangerous.

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 06:41:35 AM
Maybe I am not understanding why this food issue is such a problem to understand. I mean from my point of view and culture I have been raised on organic food or the best I could afford now that I am in America, and I believe it is your american view point that is confusing me. For me this is side affects of this....

In any case, I am trying to understand where you come from. The info you provided was very helpful In understanding this. I also think that as well as I have respect for your input, that it would be vise versa.  There is more to my wife's story than I can share, which I will not. No one here unless they share it can say they been through a tortuous hell like she has....

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 06:52:48 AM
Umm, what's your problem? Sometimes people have different opinions; get over it. Because someone disagrees with you, it does not mean he is personally attacking you. He does make a good point that you intentionally ignore. The media sensationalizes and manipulates information to get emotional reactions like the one they've gotten out of you. This was his point and you prove it by reacting emotionally to any suggestion that GM foods are not  in fact dangerous.
Thank you.

While I generally can agree with the heuristic rule around here where modern equals bad, there's always exceptions to this and when we start blanketing all new things as being wicked and evil, we become no different from Christians and others on the conservative side of things where dogmatic belief conquers reason. The emotional reaction beyond_godlike mentioned is extremely evident in some parts of this site; stories are sensationalised like trashy media output, while facts and data are being conveniently ignored.

There of course is an inevitable risk in genetically modified food, and I don't necessarily agree with the ethical implications of it. However, we take these risks everyday, my computer could be causing radiation which will kill me in 50 years, the microwave could be mutating my sperm and the processed food I eat could be slowly rotting away my brain. Unfortunately, it's not practical to avoid all these risks and becomes more time consuming and counterproductive than useful and life conserving. Abstinence from the unnecessary is perhaps the best rule of thumb (eg: drugs, fast food, unneeded material goods).

Re: GM Foods
January 19, 2010, 07:04:52 AM
Your right, because no matter where we go there is always the risk of something dreadful for us.

Re: GM Foods
January 20, 2010, 07:12:30 AM
You haven't provided anything. An hour long video from an author ranting about genetically modified foods is not evidence. There has never been any scientific study or any data proving negative health effects from eating genetically modified food. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_food_controversy
"A 2008 review published by the Royal Society of Medicine noted that GM foods have been eaten by millions of people worldwide for over 15 years, with no reports of ill effects. Similarly a 2004 report from the US National Academies of Sciences stated: "To date, no adverse health effects attributed to genetic engineering have been documented in the human population."

Feel free to follow through with the sources.

There's Michael Moore videos and 9/11 conspiracy videos which seem cohesive and plausible enough, but they are usually backed up by faulty studies or insufficient data.

Forza Romana: I've been eating a lot more tuna lately and haven't been having hemorrhoids: Did the tuna cure my hemorrhoids?

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/c.html

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/altbelief.html

It's a common human fallacy to overgeneralise things that happen to you as an individual. Your wife's cancer went into remission while she was taking vitamin C, therefore vitamin c cured it. You were bitten by a dog as a child, therefore all dogs are vicious animals and should be feared.

A simple search regarding health risks and GM foods in a search engine for scientific journals gave me 130 results. The point is that both parties do not have enough information, yet actions are already taken that are unsubstantiated. I have taken two courses on genetics and genetic engineering, so I have some background knowledge on the subject already. Furthermore, my future career is in biotechnology, so I am definitely not blanketing it because it is new. Although I cannot provide statistical evidence on whether GM foods have an impact on health or not, I can use what I have learned and logic. Changing a gene in an organism that changes a phenotype in one way can influence other phenotypes, it is very chaotic in nature. Creating new species like this can have dire consequences on the environment, especially corn, soy, etc. as they can spread easily and perhaps interact with wild types. I am personally unaware of the health risk involving GM foods, but these videos are very convincing.

Personally, I don't care about vitamin supplements, or any other food products that are potentially helpful or dangerous. All I care about in this thread is genetically modified food, as it is most pertinent to me due to my understanding of the risks. Sure, I'm also aware of toxic substances all around us, I've cleaned up sulfuric acid before and handled mercury, but genetically modified organisms is a whole other story.

To beyond_godlike: A contradiction is not arguing. See the Monty Python sketch for more details. I was pissed, off not about the subject, but about the lack of substance in his post, much like yours.  Don't come to my threads if you're not going to chat about the subject, arguing what he meant doesn't help him or myself. If you had watched the videos, you'd realize there is exactly the opposite of what you've said.

Anyway, do realize that Monsanto is a monopoly in agribusiness and GMOs, and that the scientists against them are fired from their jobs and lose their tenure.

Re: GM Foods
January 20, 2010, 10:43:41 AM
You haven't provided anything. An hour long video from an author ranting about genetically modified foods is not evidence. There has never been any scientific study or any data proving negative health effects from eating genetically modified food.  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_food_controversy
"A 2008 review published by the Royal Society of Medicine noted that GM foods have been eaten by millions of people worldwide for over 15 years, with no reports of ill effects. Similarly a 2004 report from the US National Academies of Sciences stated: "To date, no adverse health effects attributed to genetic engineering have been documented in the human population."

Feel free to follow through with the sources.

There's Michael Moore videos and 9/11 conspiracy videos which seem cohesive and plausible enough, but they are usually backed up by faulty studies or insufficient data.

Forza Romana: I've been eating a lot more tuna lately and haven't been having hemorrhoids: Did the tuna cure my hemorrhoids?

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/c.html

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/altbelief.html

It's a common human fallacy to overgeneralise things that happen to you as an individual. Your wife's cancer went into remission while she was taking vitamin C, therefore vitamin c cured it. You were bitten by a dog as a child, therefore all dogs are vicious animals and should be feared.

A simple search regarding health risks and GM foods in a search engine for scientific journals gave me 130 results. The point is that both parties do not have enough information, yet actions are already taken that are unsubstantiated. I have taken two courses on genetics and genetic engineering, so I have some background knowledge on the subject already. Furthermore, my future career is in biotechnology, so I am definitely not blanketing it because it is new. Although I cannot provide statistical evidence on whether GM foods have an impact on health or not, I can use what I have learned and logic. Changing a gene in an organism that changes a phenotype in one way can influence other phenotypes, it is very chaotic in nature. Creating new species like this can have dire consequences on the environment, especially corn, soy, etc. as they can spread easily and perhaps interact with wild types. I am personally unaware of the health risk involving GM foods, but these videos are very convincing.

Personally, I don't care about vitamin supplements, or any other food products that are potentially helpful or dangerous. All I care about in this thread is genetically modified food, as it is most pertinent to me due to my understanding of the risks. Sure, I'm also aware of toxic substances all around us, I've cleaned up sulfuric acid before and handled mercury, but genetically modified organisms is a whole other story.

To beyond_godlike: A contradiction is not arguing. See the Monty Python sketch for more details. I was pissed, off not about the subject, but about the lack of substance in his post, much like yours.  Don't come to my threads if you're not going to chat about the subject, arguing what he meant doesn't help him or myself. If you had watched the videos, you'd realize there is exactly the opposite of what you've said.

Anyway, do realize that Monsanto is a monopoly in agribusiness and GMOs, and that the scientists against them are fired from their jobs and lose their tenure.
How is 15 years of no apparent health effects unsubstantiated? The way I see it, the burden is on the opposing side to prove that there IS problems with GM foods. What you have learned and "logic" isn't enough for an argument, it's gut reaction. It seems as though most of the opposition towards nuclear power is due to an association with nuclear weapons (unrelated) and Chernobyl (a poorly run plant in a backwards Soviet nation). Argument against genetically modified food is similarly based on some unrelated Frankenstein nightmare and slippery slope arguments.

Right now there's a need for GM foods, there might be negative consequences (guess what; evolution occurs everyday in nature as well due to varying phenotypes), the risk is worth it and being held back by paranoid fanatics and sensationalist media is disappointing. Like I said before, there's a risk involved in everything. The microwave could alter the expression of genes in my children, but by god, I'm not going to stop using it.

In the end, if I was going to side with the FDA or paranoid fanatics, NASA or hippies worried about nuclear plants on the moon, the Warren Commission or conspiracy theorists, I know where I'd put my money (psst...it's the educated people who know what they're talking about, not the laymen who dispense opinions in between Friends episodes).

Re: GM Foods
January 20, 2010, 04:10:15 PM
In the end, if I was going to side with the FDA or paranoid fanatics, NASA or hippies worried about nuclear plants on the moon, the Warren Commission or conspiracy theorists, I know where I'd put my money (psst...it's the educated people who know what they're talking about, not the laymen who dispense opinions in between Friends episodes).

I agree with this. However, it's a case of a mis-stated argument, not wrong inclinations.

I oppose GM foods because:

(a) When these seeds get into the wild, they genocide existing crop stocks -- and it will take several hundred years to see if we need those.
(b) There is no need for GM foods and "feeding more people" will prolong our problems
(c) Food is tasteless enough as it is. I trust mother nature more than bureaucratic, neurotic, small-minded humankind.

Insert UFO conspiracy here.