Humanity: in decline since '75?

[scourge]

Mindless man-shaped weiners milling about, taking up space, getting in the way, destroying all life, yet demanding respect at all times just for being labeled human since birth:

Their ability to think is limited to memorization. The problem with this way of viewing the world is that it excludes critical thought, intuition, empathy, and wisdom. It traps us in a box composed of all the things we have been TAUGHT, but keeps us from the things we could discover on our own. Useful idiots are walking talking toasters; all they take is bread, and all they make is toast (and the occasional pop tart). Frankly, I’m bored with toast.

http://neithercorp.us/npress/?p=898

[MediterraneanSun]

If the industrial and information ages have lead to a decline in human spirit, is simply looking back to ancient times a suitable answer?

No.  Then we merely project our desires onto the past.

Because they are both technological accomplishments. Look at it this way: the Wonders of the World were something more because they represented people's culture. What does space exploration represent? To me it represents the culture of carny rides, more intelligent of course but it comes down to the same thing. Btw porn also allows me to more directly experience that which once could only be imagined (sorry bout that one, I couldn't resist)

I disagree with this almost entirely.  I understand that there are comparisons to be made between carnival rides and space shuttles, but these are superficial comparisons-- ideologically these 'technological achievements' represent two entirely different matters.

Which is superior:
1. A culture that looks at the night sky and connects the dots to find anthropomorphic figures around which to develop a mythology.  Perhaps the bright dots are also seen as the souls of vanquished warriors.
2. A culture where technology has developed to the point where these 'celestial bodies' can be analyzed and quantified.  This culture supports men who risk (and lose) their lives in order to see what is really out there.

Answer: neither.  Both are working within their means, both have their mythologies, both have their convictions.  Thousands of years from now, those looking back at our era could, for all we know, discover the ancient ruins of our spacecraft and be amazed at these achievements.  Again, the only reason you are able to so readily write them off is that we do not have enough distance from them, and thus see their various relationships to other aspects of the modern world.

Answer, the first. And I will tell you why. I believe in paganism in the Greek "dodekatheo" so I believe that the gods, ie nature or cosmos etc, is an idealistic enviroment of energies running without thinking us. Why I say that? I believe that humanity by now has over-exceeded the point of learning by technology and has gone to playin destruction with technology. Of course the technocrat robots cannot see this. Remember, gods do not care about us.. So we continue in a technocratic race who will be the best? And fuck up everything meanwhile. Technology is a by-product of our "progress" which in other words is industrial development. I disagree with anus when they say Space Exploration as an achievment. What would we do if we learned that the back side of the moon has aliens, even when we destroy our own planet with idiots overpopulating every space. Humanity by now is an overrated atempt to over-crowd nature, and it is bound to fail, I want to see their faces, those special analysts etc etc, when countries wll be attacking themselves for water!

[Humanicide]

Regardless of your personal views, space exploration IS an achievement. Forgive me if I sound like one of those science apologists, but there are few things more exhilarating than the cosmos. Granted, if we were to colonize space hopefully we would send smart people so they wouldn't fuck it up as bad as the Earth has been. To say that reaching the stars and learning vast amounts of knowledge from what we witness and discover is not something to be proud of is an ignorant statement.

[metal on metal]

Granted, if we were to colonize space hopefully we would send smart people so they wouldn't fuck it up as bad as the Earth has been. To say that reaching the stars and learning vast amounts of knowledge from what we witness and discover is not something to be proud of is an ignorant statement.

It's a damn shame it's also smart people who make decisions which determine the reasons for (and, consequently, the direction of) technological advancement which is about to destroy this planet. Conquering the space was a smart move, yes, it's the intention and it's irrevocable consequences that bother me. Maybe the bicycle is the last untainted invention so far.

[Humanicide]

Perhaps I should've said "wise" instead of "smart", as we all know there's a big difference.

[MediterraneanSun]

Regardless of your personal views, space exploration IS an achievement. Forgive me if I sound like one of those science apologists, but there are few things more exhilarating than the cosmos. Granted, if we were to colonize space hopefully we would send smart people so they wouldn't fuck it up as bad as the Earth has been. To say that reaching the stars and learning vast amounts of knowledge from what we witness and discover is not something to be proud of is an ignorant statement.

An achievement would be something done in the real world, for example, Hitler was trying to accomplish an achievement. Organizing a team of few brain nerds who will launch a rocket in the sky is not an achievement in my mind. I may sound almost leftist here but however, when the whole world is in misery, you travel to the stars? Oh what an amazing thing! Fix the problems here first, sir.

You mention colonization of space like some friends of mine. Think, we wouldn't even think of colonizing other planets if we just lived normally and traditionally like in the middle ages. But here we are, thinking of solutions and exits. Ok we fucked the Earth let's go to mars to fuck it too. The problem is inside our heads, not in extraterrestial bodies.

[Dinaric Leather]

Dudes, we should start our own gang. We could spread Death Metal terror through the whole nation! DEMONIC ARMY OF SATAN WAGES DEADLY WAR!

[esoteric]

Regardless of your personal views, space exploration IS an achievement. Forgive me if I sound like one of those science apologists, but there are few things more exhilarating than the cosmos. Granted, if we were to colonize space hopefully we would send smart people so they wouldn't fuck it up as bad as the Earth has been. To say that reaching the stars and learning vast amounts of knowledge from what we witness and discover is not something to be proud of is an ignorant statement.

An achievement would be something done in the real world, for example, Hitler was trying to accomplish an achievement. Organizing a team of few brain nerds who will launch a rocket in the sky is not an achievement in my mind. I may sound almost leftist here but however, when the whole world is in misery, you travel to the stars? Oh what an amazing thing! Fix the problems here first, sir.

Can't we do both? Or would you have suggested that Galileo and da Vinci, back in their respective days, should have been working in soup kitchens "fixing the real problems", instead of having their head in the clouds?

[nous]

That would have been for the better, indeed.

[Humanicide]

Regardless of your personal views, space exploration IS an achievement. Forgive me if I sound like one of those science apologists, but there are few things more exhilarating than the cosmos. Granted, if we were to colonize space hopefully we would send smart people so they wouldn't fuck it up as bad as the Earth has been. To say that reaching the stars and learning vast amounts of knowledge from what we witness and discover is not something to be proud of is an ignorant statement.

An achievement would be something done in the real world, for example, Hitler was trying to accomplish an achievement. Organizing a team of few brain nerds who will launch a rocket in the sky is not an achievement in my mind. I may sound almost leftist here but however, when the whole world is in misery, you travel to the stars? Oh what an amazing thing! Fix the problems here first, sir.

You mention colonization of space like some friends of mine. Think, we wouldn't even think of colonizing other planets if we just lived normally and traditionally like in the middle ages. But here we are, thinking of solutions and exits. Ok we fucked the Earth let's go to mars to fuck it too. The problem is inside our heads, not in extraterrestial bodies.

Normally and traditionally - of course, because I'd really like to go back to dumping my waste right out of the window, having all sorts of curable diseases kill me, and not being able to drink the water from nearby sources as it would be polluted beyond belief.

A bunch of nerds who will launch a rocket into the sky - they have accomplished much. It's not some willy-nilly thing to launch a FUCKING ROCKET. It takes time, money, and a lot of smarts to be able to undertake such a task.

I'm all for some primitivistic thinking but you seem to be dogmatic towards the primitive and entirely shunning of technology.

[metal on metal]

No. There is a difference between an appropriate and one harmful use of technology. Sometimes an ice-cream feels just right, but...

Of course, you could assert the building of the pyramids was harmful to the slaves.

[Humanicide]

No. There is a difference between an appropriate and one harmful use of technology. Sometimes an ice-cream feels just right, but...

Of course, you could assert the building of the pyramids was harmful to the slaves.

First point - absolutely. Ice cream, without a doubt, is delicious, and I find that eating it while running a fever or having a toothache is most relaxing. I barely eat it though, maybe 2-3 times in the summer. However, it's quite obvious that most people like to have their ice cream and eat it too; too often.

Second point - absolutely, but that sounds like some typical college pseudo-intellectual trying to sling mud upon the great architectural wonder that is the great pyramids. Sure, people died building it, but if I were to be working as a slave in that time, then if I was transported to Egypt today to see what all of the hard work I and others put into it, and that it is still standing today, I would feel a sense of overwhelming pride. (BUT PEOPLE SUFFERED AND DIED AND ITS WRONG TO LET THEM DIE EVEN IF WHAT THEY BUILT STANDS THE TEST OF TIME! I'm gonna go read some pitchfork stuff and listen to Iron and Wine)

[scourge]

Egypt's chief archaeologist said new tombs found in Giza support the view that the Great Pyramids were built by free workers and not slaves, as widely believed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/6962860/Pyramids-not-built-by-slaves.html

Assuming we are referring to the pyramids in Egypt, the claim that slaves built them is moving in the direction of myth. That brings us to an important point. If the laborers were not forced to perform this tremendous feat in the ancient world, why did they bother? The answer is probably that they adored their god-kings the pharoahs and through him they showed gratitude to the great pantheon of the gods of all creation. This is beauty, manifest.

My thought is that we need our own equivalent of pyramid building; hence, colonizing the solar system with bravery, fortitude and love of the infinite in our hearts. This fixing the world business is nonsense. The real world isn't broken. The fantasy worlds between our ears is the only thing in disrepair. A golden age type epoch of reaching far and working toward a collective triumph against hardship in our modern time fixes this 'broken reality' perception disease, liberalism, humanism, modernism, or whatever, infecting our brains.