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grindcore and such

Re: grindcore and such
February 08, 2008, 07:39:40 PM
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I'd be interested in uploads of whichever of these are your favorites; I haven't heard any of them.

To add to the list, Downsided by No Comment is an excellent slab of late period hardcore.


I'll upload a few records this weekend. Most likely the Sheer Terror, Citizens Arrest, 9 Shocks and Cold Sweat stuff. That would be the cream of the crop, although I do thoroughly enjoy the whole lot. No Comment were great. Them, along with Infest, Neanderthal, Crossed Out and a few of the other "Powerviolence" styled hardcore bands were keeping the spirit of Hardcore Punk pure while other offshoots and components of that movement were going straight down the shitter.

Oh yeah, and as for grind, you guys pretty much hit the nail on the head. There's very few bands outside of Napalm/Terrorizer/Repulsion/Brutal Truth that I want to hear. Some Phobia and Excruciating Terror stuff is decent. That's about it though. Ironic considering that I front a grind band. Fun music to play, but I often don't feel like listening to it.

Re: grindcore and such
February 08, 2008, 10:01:17 PM
All this misleading talk of the genre of grindcore has got me a little confused.  What I don’t understand is why anybody here or anywhere, would not listen to a piece of music because it interferes or contradicts their ideology.  Music is not about agreeing with what you already think; it is about evoking emotions and feelings.  Someone here said that grindcore is “life sucks” music… and apparently this is a bad thing?  If you want “life is wonderful” music then go find some, there is loads of it: Celine Dion, Boys II Men, Disney soundtracks, and really there is nothing wrong with that.  It is just not what I or the majority of punk/metal fans wants or craves in their listening.  The thing I am getting at is this: pretensions are holding some people here back from enjoying some very good aggressive music.  Pretensions are made up rules about how a certain group of people acts or should act and believe to remain a member of that group.   Some people here say, “Hardcore died in 1985”.  I don’t agree.  The only thing that died in 1985 was your curiosity.  You heard Metallica and Exodus and thought it was the heaviest shit ever, so you decided that metal was what you were into and that being curious about hardcore was a “lefty” thing to do.  I have been a punk fan for as long as I can remember and in that time I have seen ideologies that run the whole gambit from white power, jew hating, and life denying to the opposite side anarchistic, Hummer-smashing, vegan, organizing, + annoying.  Both sides can be annoying, but only one side is totally stupid really makes no sense in our world today (you guess).  Not only does it not make any sense, it makes people have a shittier sense of their world, they think everything is a goddamn Jewish conspiracy.  This just annoys me, I have friends like that and they have a shitty time and their identity suffers, because all they can come up with is “fucking african-americans”.  The lefties can be rough sometimes too, they are always organizing vegan cookouts and trying to get you to sign up on an email list, but at least they have identities, morals, and goals.  Hate can be a great musical tool; use it.  I love black metal, which is hate propaganda; it makes your blood boil and your fists clench.  I have been entranced by hateful bands and I am a fan.  I am hateful when I listen to aggressive music; it fills my desire for aural lust.  But I don’t let the hate cloud my judgments, for I would only be doing myself a disservice.  If you want to stay in into metal you have to STAY CURIOUS!  Don’t pigeonhole yourself as a Black Metal guy or a Punk or a Neil Sedaka impersonator.  Just be a fucking aggressive music fan, make it about the music first and foremost and all the other bullshit will melt away.  With that said my recommendations are:

Rudimentary Peni – The Eps of RP
Assuck – Anticapital
Infest – Slave
Nausea – Extinction (talk about realism…)
Siege – Drop Dead
Man is the Bastard – Sum of the Men, Thoughtless
Jerry’s Kids- Is this my world?
SSD – Discography (what ever you can find)
MOB 47 – Cleanse the Bacteria
Hiatus – El Sueno
Fear of God – I’m Positive 7” (about AIDS!)

Stay angry.

Re: grindcore and such
February 09, 2008, 12:24:04 AM
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Music is not about agreeing with what you already think; it is about evoking emotions and feelings.  Someone here said that grindcore is “life sucks” music… and apparently this is a bad thing?  If you want “life is wonderful” music then go find some, there is loads of it: Celine Dion, Boys II Men, Disney soundtracks, and really there is nothing wrong with that.


Music doesn't fit into two binary states, "life sucks" and "life is wonderful."

My problem with hardcore is that it replaces discourse with dogma. It's one-dimensional. It's thoroughly crowd-pleasing. All of its ideas have failed, yet it repeats itself... again, again and again.

Metal is music about finding meaning in life. Hardcore and grindcore became about finding meaning in bitching about life sucking. It's a linearization of a complex, interesting world into a Democratic party campaign slogan.

Even Napalm Death are guilty of this, but forgiven, because their music had some life for 3-4 albums.

Re: grindcore and such
February 09, 2008, 12:24:38 AM
cheers for mentioning Infest! a true force in the hardcore/grind scene. very violent, angry band. i ignore the fact that theyre straight edge.

Wolfpack's "Lycanthoro Punk" is a great release. havent heard much else from them though.

personally, His Hero is Gone never did much for me. melody and crust punk dont belong together. i listen on some occasions, and mildly enjoy, but then i think that there is better music, and so i listen to that.

also worth mentioning is Spazz, if only for their technique and execution, because they were people who never took their band or themselves seriously. dont go looking for a message there.

Re: grindcore and such
February 09, 2008, 01:18:57 AM
Not only is some hardcore guilty of abiding by a dogmatic set of rules set up by pretentious people, but the same can be said of metal; black, death or otherwise.  The meaning of hardcore for me isn’t about bitching about the world sucking; it is releasing the anger and fury inside you in a spontaneous and uncontrollable way.  When I see black metal bands (that are awesome, and I totally enjoy) talk about how black metal is about spikes and leather (Immortal: Impressions of Death documentary) it makes me think that Black metal is rather one-dimensional.  It is a dimension that is okay, it just has no application in the real world.  If hardcore in your eyes is about a one-dimensional bitching about how the world sucks, then what is metal?  A one-dimensional exposition about the use of spikes and leather and corpse paint in a stage show?  Or in death metal’s case a one-dimensional exposition about the addiction to vaginal skin? (HA HA)  Now I poke fun at metal in these ways to show a point: take the music and the musicians for what they are: MUSICIANS.  These people are performers, not role models or people you ought to try to emulate.  Once a person enters the realm where it is just about the music, you won’t be a poseur anymore, you will just be a guy listening to music.  And you will find that you are not held back by rules like “I won’t listen to that ‘cause its not metal” or “that’s not punk”.  You are just a sovereign entity taking a little of each fruit of sound and giving a taste and judging the music solely on its merits.  As I write this I become aware of a strange phenomenon.  I talk to a lot of people that I meet with about music, and I consider myself a Hessian and a metal head, but if somebody these days tells me they are into metal I instantly think, “Damn, we probably won’t get along then….”          

Re: grindcore and such
February 09, 2008, 08:50:24 PM
Dear Sir, regarding your two propositions:

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Not only is some hardcore guilty of abiding by a dogmatic set of rules set up by pretentious people, but the same can be said of metal; black, death or otherwise.


Wouldn't this be a generic criticism of any genre with conventions and belief systems? The question I would pose is: which is more informative, and has more depth, thus variation?

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The meaning of hardcore for me isn’t about bitching about the world sucking; it is releasing the anger and fury inside you in a spontaneous and uncontrollable way.


And why would we want to release these things, instead of channeling them into a sense of hope?

See Nietzsche's critique of catharsis. Why apply a palliative release when you could work toward a solution?

Re: grindcore and such
February 10, 2008, 01:45:33 AM
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See Nietzsche's critique of catharsis. Why apply a palliative release when you could work toward a solution?


perhaps they are not aware of any solution that exists, or cannot formulate one on their own. sometimes it does feel good to release emotions in a violent sort of way. thats why i enjoy concerts highly.

Re: grindcore and such
February 10, 2008, 12:31:55 PM
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perhaps they are not aware of any solution that exists, or cannot formulate one on their own. sometimes it does feel good to release emotions in a violent sort of way. thats why i enjoy concerts highly.


A non-solution is worse than staying silent, don't you think?

Grindcore has a high burn-out rate, as does simplified death metal (Skinless, Origin, Cannibal Corpse).

There is a reason: futility.

I like the best of grindcore because it rose above this. Terrorizer, Bolt Thrower, Blood, Carbonized, Carcass.

The rest is a repeat of Hardcore, which blew itself out three years before. Why keep repeating dead cycles?

Re: grindcore and such
February 10, 2008, 11:09:59 PM
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A non-solution is worse than staying silent, don't you think?

Grindcore has a high burn-out rate, as does simplified death metal (Skinless, Origin, Cannibal Corpse).

There is a reason: futility.

I like the best of grindcore because it rose above this. Terrorizer, Bolt Thrower, Blood, Carbonized, Carcass.

The rest is a repeat of Hardcore, which blew itself out three years before. Why keep repeating dead cycles?


How much contemporary hardcore have you heard? Can you comment upon the lyrics or the musical progression (or lack thereof, if that's your opinion)of any of the artists that I mentioned above?
I believe in both channeling and releasing pent up frustration and anger. I certainly have enough for both. What sort of actions toward changing the world for the better do Nihilists partake in? I'm genuinely curious.

Re: grindcore and such
February 11, 2008, 03:55:04 AM
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A non-solution is worse than staying silent, don't you think?

Grindcore has a high burn-out rate, as does simplified death metal (Skinless, Origin, Cannibal Corpse).

There is a reason: futility.

I like the best of grindcore because it rose above this. Terrorizer, Bolt Thrower, Blood, Carbonized, Carcass.

The rest is a repeat of Hardcore, which blew itself out three years before. Why keep repeating dead cycles?


Origin isnt SIMPLIFIED death metal, theyre just too overtly technical. good for a song or 2, but i agree in that they get boring after about 8 minutes.

and i suppose it depends on the situation, but not everyone can stay silent all the time.

Re: grindcore and such
February 11, 2008, 04:10:47 AM
Technicality isn't the issue here, complexity of concept and structure are.

Re: grindcore and such
February 12, 2008, 01:18:13 PM
true. i suppose when looking at Origin's structure, it is apparent that it is very simple (straightforward blasting). still, that kind of thing i enjoy in spurts, once in a blue moon.

i take nothing away from them, as they are extremely accomplished and talented musicians. they just need to learn how to compose better.

JJ

Re: grindcore and such
February 12, 2008, 05:28:19 PM
In that case, Origin is in the same league as Mortician. The only difference is their ability to play which means nothing if the music amounts to nothing. Why defend them? They don't play with spirit nor do they attempt to achieve something higher than playing DM for the hell of it. Go through the motions taken at an obnoxious extreme so typical concert going metalheads can jerk off to the fastest DM band in the world.

Re: grindcore and such
February 13, 2008, 02:44:54 PM
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In that case, Origin is in the same league as Mortician. The only difference is their ability to play which means nothing if the music amounts to nothing. Why defend them? They don't play with spirit nor do they attempt to achieve something higher than playing DM for the hell of it. Go through the motions taken at an obnoxious extreme so typical concert going metalheads can jerk off to the fastest DM band in the world.



because there is talent there. instrumental talent. while their songwriting skills are extremely poor, there is enough talent to give hope that perhaps they could in the future write an outstanding album all the way through. they are still a relatively young band. extremely unlikely that this will come to pass, but anything is possible.

JJ

Re: grindcore and such
February 15, 2008, 02:29:30 AM
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because there is talent there. instrumental talent.



Bands with technical skill are a dime a dozen.

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while their songwriting skills are extremely poor,


95% of all metal bands.

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there is enough talent to give hope that perhaps they could in the future write an outstanding album all the way through. they are still a relatively young band. extremely unlikely that this will come to pass, but anything is possible.


My solution is rather than hope for the 95% of metal bands who treat metal like a gimmick rather than expression of spirit is to force them to drop what they're doing and focus on something more down to earth, perhaps auto work or banking.