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Metal => Interzone => Topic started by: Conservationist on July 01, 2009, 08:40:30 AM

Title: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Conservationist on July 01, 2009, 08:40:30 AM
One thing I've noticed about Hessians: they love their drink and drugs, like most rock-descended bohemian genres.

However, how much does this hold them back?

We're familiar with tales of metal bands who lost members because their alcohol or drug habits took precedence over the band. Almost everyone knows a fan or two who has wrecked a car driving drunk, lost a relationship or job for being stoned too much, and so on.

It's possible that reckless hedonism becomes a substitute for achievement, and that this creates a huge pool of people who are working the reverse of that -- because they can't achieve, they pursue reckless hedonism -- in turn, dragging the genre down toward more inclusive material.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: we hope you die on July 01, 2009, 09:27:27 AM
It only takes a small amount of self control to not let alcohol get in the way of creativity, which any self respecting hessian should be able to manage. The problem is letting it get out of control after say, a successful album or when one has too much money to spare. Once you've indulged in it one too many times it becomes harder and harder to pull yourself out of it let alone put your mind to something useful or creative.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Humanicide on July 01, 2009, 11:01:34 AM
Its all about moderation. Moderation takes self control. Self control takes self esteem.

This is why losers just spend their days high and drunk, all the time. They dont know what else to do with themselves.

I say, let the idiots who have no self control suffer the consequences.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: uoyedisni on July 01, 2009, 05:36:28 PM
Somewhat related article on moderate alcohol consumption and the 'Churchill Gene'.
http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?id=10751
Indeed, moderation is the wisest path.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: scourge on July 01, 2009, 06:27:12 PM
Russia: excessive alcohol consumption led to more than half of all deaths for ages 15 to 54. That's basically like the attrition from a major war in their midst for several years now. Alcohol isn't the cause of death. Something else causes these people to go for the booze, but like school shootings, media sources, as if under orders, won't give us a hint.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Jim Necroslaughter on July 04, 2009, 05:48:39 PM
I would say that at the end of the day alcohol is a waste of time and pretty crippling.  I will have a few beers on an "important" day or to celebrate a victory, but I have seen many friends who drink every weekend and have turned into dullards.  I have drunk to excess several times in the past, and a sober life is the life for me.  The "drinking/party culture" where I live is out of control and it upsets me to see so many young people essentially "peak out" at age 20.  Maybe they would have peaked out anyway, but without alcohol I figure they have a fighting chance.  Alcohol can definitely become a substitute for achievement.  And it doesn't bother me so much that alcohol or drugs can result in deaths, but that it turns the living alcoholics or drug addicts into dullards or reckless hedonists, in which case they consume consume consume, but give nothing back.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: My AIDS, Your Arse on July 05, 2009, 01:21:13 AM
I like to drink on occasion as much as the next self-respecting person, but some people just drink too much, like some of my closest friends. It's like they don't even know why they're drinking, and it's a pain.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: hard on July 05, 2009, 11:35:43 PM
Alcohol is a decadence and the truly hard and noble types would naturally seek to transcend such a thing.  This is because the musicians seek as little material gain from their output as possible, part of what makes the art so heroic.  For this reason metal musicians who produce the highest quality outputs may be less prone to alcoholism.  A good example of this may be Varg Vikernes who does not appear to drink much if at all.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Conservationist on July 06, 2009, 12:01:42 AM
It could be the difference between masturbating once, and dehydrating yourself with an eight-hour masturbathon.

Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: istaros on July 06, 2009, 12:48:38 AM
Alcohol's never crippled a soul. The fact some people use that particular tool to cripple themselves is caused by a fault in character - not in the maliciousness of an inanimate object.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Forza Romana on July 06, 2009, 06:04:43 PM
Well, in my case I enjoy a nice glass a wine once a day with my dinner meal. This does stem from my Italian tradition, so I never do let it take a hold of my senses. If there is indeed a day for celebration, I drink 2 to 3 glasses of wine and that's my limit. I also make sure that I have a free day after I drink to rest myself , that way I am capable of making sound judgements.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: chittyxvx on July 08, 2009, 02:06:28 AM
I was quite a large drinker around three to four years ago, a state not helped by the environment where my friends all got together just to drink. I did have fun, other times I let myself go in a frenzy of drinking. It took a five day drinking binge of a large amount of alcohol to make me realise that I was wasting my life. The next day, after returning from the trip we were one I gave up alcohol, and have been completely sober since. The same friends at the time practically disowned me based on my new found position, one that one was not forced upon them at all, and set their life goals as to getting as drunk as they possible can each night.
Each time I run into these friends nowadays they're laying around wasting their lives, and are usually extremely drunk. I, on the other hand, have become far more healthier, have accomplished a lot more and am more in control of my life then I would have been had I continued to drink.
Thats not to say alcohol is a bad thing, its a persons choice and if they succumb to it, it is there own weakness. Its like any other drug. Once it becomes an addiction or your only goal in life is to do it as much as you can then you're no longer living your own life. You're wasting it and a slave.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: hard on July 11, 2009, 02:41:55 AM
It could be the difference between masturbating once, and dehydrating yourself with an eight-hour masturbathon.

Masturbation is a very lowest common denominator activity.  A Ménage à trois on the otherhand is more praiseworthy because it involves interaction with other people making it far more challenging.  I support social eugenics in that those who can't perform at a certain level socially (picking up women for one thing) should be culled from the population to increase its health.  In fact in our apocalyptic age I already see that coming into effect and I find a sense of beauty in it.

Each time I run into these friends nowadays they're laying around wasting their lives, and are usually extremely drunk.

Wasting is probably it.  If you're hanging out with the same people doing the same non-challenging activities (drinking usually isn't) then your not developing at all.  Growing up I spent a lot of time with a few of the same people playing video games and watching films.  Was there any challenge or achievement involved?  Not really.  Sure enough after a few years our friendships quickly dissolved  - basically nothing gained making the time filler.  A tragedy for anyone.  It appears that while us few were doing video games and films, the friendships of quality were forged in trying social circumstances such as parties and odd events.
 
I have the feeling a lot of metalheads hang out with the same people doing the same non-challenging activities, drinking would probably be one of them.  Sure enough, filler.  Such a thing certainly wouldn't live up to the true nature of metal which seeks development through adversity.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Umbrage on July 17, 2009, 09:36:09 AM
Quote
I support social eugenics in that those who can't perform at a certain level socially (picking up women for one thing) should be culled from the population to increase its health.

"Sorry Nietzsche but Casanova says you gotta go..."
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Humanicide on July 17, 2009, 11:38:43 AM
It could be the difference between masturbating once, and dehydrating yourself with an eight-hour masturbathon.


Masturbathon is now one of my favorite words. Hah.

Perhaps, with the way society is going, this wont be an unfeasible public event.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: burewestnik on July 17, 2009, 02:31:49 PM
Masturbathon is now one of my favorite words. Hah.

Awesome )
" I am the one, Masturbathon
the outstreched grasping hand,
my image, is of onany,
my seed has dropped to land"
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: RedReign on July 17, 2009, 11:24:00 PM
I think in terms of its horrible long term effects, alcohol is up there with heroin and perhaps worse-- heroin doesn't kill brain cells the way alcohol does.

Personally I avoid it for the most part.  THC is much more pleasant but even that got boring long ago.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Stars Down To Earth on July 19, 2009, 05:24:55 AM
Masturbation is a very lowest common denominator activity.  A Ménage à trois on the otherhand is more praiseworthy because it involves interaction with other people making it far more challenging.  I support social eugenics in that those who can't perform at a certain level socially (picking up women for one thing) should be culled from the population to increase its health.  In fact in our apocalyptic age I already see that coming into effect and I find a sense of beauty in it
Even the basest of men can pick up women, I don't see how they represent the better portion of the population, white trash in America must be the nobles of society. You equate picking up women to a skill, like drawing a picture or using a computer . God forbid not all of us treat women like objects and "goals". I just got laid, score!
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: sleipnir on July 19, 2009, 10:49:30 AM
Alcohol, like any other drug, is as crippling as you want it to be.

Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Necrophiliac on July 21, 2009, 04:03:18 PM
Alcohol, like any other drug, is as crippling as you want it to be.



This seems closest to the truth, it's like marijuana, heroin or cocaine. The people with a true weakness of spirit or body will become 'addicted', but those with self-control can use it once and leave it at that.

Unfortunately, for some reason being a weak-willed bottom feeder is not reason enough to be pampered by society, so they are 'addicts'. And as soon as that lost its punch, 'addiction' is now a 'disease'.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: RedReign on July 21, 2009, 05:09:24 PM
There's something nobody will ever tell you about coke.

How bad the hangovers are.  Like, wanting to die bad, a deep soul sickness that's like depression but even more horrible and unbearable.

Why people do it I have no idea.  How's this deal sound:  "OK, pay me $80.  Then you will feel absolutely amazing for a day.  Then, I will begin beating you with a baseball bat.  I will do this for about a day as well."

Didn't take me long to realize that I don't like getting beat with a bat.  I also don't like vomiting.  I also don't particularly like the "meh" feeling that comes the next day after weed, or the extreme paroxysms of paranoia that I get when I'm on it.

Are some people just stupid?

Also, what the hell is with AA?  Why do people need to go to a smoke filled classroom to drink vile coffee and have crackheads tell them not to drink beer?
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: scourge on July 21, 2010, 08:32:40 PM
Quote
Sweating, vomiting, and diarrhea also commonly occur during a hangover, and these conditions can result in additional fluid loss and electrolyte imbalances. Symptoms of mild to moderate dehydration include thirst, weakness, dryness of mucous membranes, dizziness, and lightheadedness - all commonly observed during a hangover.

http://biology.about.com/od/physiology/a/alcoholhangover_2.htm

Quote
A fluid imbalance is often associated with imbalances of sodium, potassium (see: hyponatremia, hypokalemia, and hyperkalmia) and other chemicals that help regulate body fluids.

http://adam.about.com/encyclopedia/infectiousdiseases/Fluid-imbalance.htm

Quote
When the amount of sodium in fluids outside cells drops, water moves into the cells to balance the levels. This causes the cells to swell with too much water. Although most cells can handle this swelling, brain cells cannot, because the skull bones confine them. Brain swelling causes most of the symptoms of hyponatremia.

http://adam.about.com/encyclopedia/infectiousdiseases/Hyponatremia.htm

Quote
Potassium is needed for cells, especially nerve and muscle cells, to function properly. You get potassium through food. The kidneys remove excess potassium in the urine to keep a proper balance of the mineral in the body.

http://adam.about.com/encyclopedia/infectiousdiseases/Hypokalemia.htm

Bottom line is to use in moderation (Merciless All Father commands so) or not at all (Allah the Merciful forbids it). To regulate moderate to no use, only buy the best quality product you can afford or skip it altogether.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Glenn Beck on July 22, 2010, 07:23:15 AM
Masturbathon is now one of my favorite words. Hah.

Perhaps, with the way society is going, this wont be an unfeasible public event.

http://www.offspring.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-25278.html (the original text of the MSNBC "news" story isn't available annymore)
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: bovine on July 22, 2010, 08:57:16 PM
I limit myself to 2 beers a day unless there's a social gathering or special occasion. It's not very difficult, and I usually feel bad doing it if I haven't done anything productive yet that day and opt not to drink at all.

It's not that difficult.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Conservationist on July 23, 2010, 07:46:12 AM
The truth is somewhere in the middle:

Personally I avoid it for the most part.  THC is much more pleasant but even that got boring long ago.

Alcohol, like any other drug, is as crippling as you want it to be.

I don't believe it's "as crippling as you want it to be." That sounds like a typical modern sentiment: you're in absolute control! You do get intoxicated and it does affect your judgment. In addition, it is addictive. While the weak-willed are more likely to immediately get hooked, most people simply lose time over it.

And that's kind of where I am on drugs, and alcohol -- they're a surrogate for actually tackling life. They occupy time and make you feel good without good things having yet happened. Sometimes, there are no consequences; but in general, there are. So I avoid them.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Cargést on July 23, 2010, 10:01:23 AM
I drink a hell of a lot when I'm with other drinkers, and not at all when I'm by myself or with non-drinkers.  However, recently, I've been drinking less and less (possibly as a result of delving into Salvia Divinorum; equally likely a result of having no money because I volunteer for a conservationist organisation and thus have no "real job").  Generally, getting drunk is merely the side effect of drinking liquids which I find enjoyable to drink (Jaegermeister, dark rum [these two are my "staples", drunk straight, and copiously], occasionally some Port after dinner, occasionally Cider with lunch).  However, I do "know" people who "drink to get drunk".  They also grab any and every drug which comes their way.  As a result of their general inadequacy and weak wills, I have very little to do with them nowadays.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Gefechtsgruppe10 on July 23, 2010, 04:30:07 PM
"It's possible that reckless hedonism becomes a substitute for achievement, and that this creates a huge pool of people who are working the reverse of that -- because they can't achieve, they pursue reckless hedonism -- in turn, dragging the genre down toward more inclusive material."
Conservationalist-
I knew a really talented musician who really enjoyed hallucinagens.  He took very, very many and ended up burning himself out.  He went from a highly talented individual with a solid history of creativity and boundless potential to a bum who incessantly parties.  Many people defend him saying, "he's just seen the other side, man.  He's seen the truth and doesn't need to do things for the man!"  I figure with or without hallucinagenic experiences, those that have truly seen the other side have something to show for it.  Anybody doubt that Beethoven, Napolean, or van Gogh saw the other side?
I figure that drugs can be used as a means (I like THC for music rehersals) but when the drug becomes an end (the 'marijuana culture') is where the failure happens.  Also, I think an aristocracy or nobility would cancel some of the ill effects of alcohol/drug consumption.  The old nobilities probably partied pretty hardy, but it was expected of their position that they achieve. .
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Cargést on July 23, 2010, 05:00:06 PM
I figure that drugs can be used as a means (I like THC for music rehersals) but when the drug becomes an end (the 'marijuana culture') is where the failure happens.

This.  I've seen this a lot among people.  There are those who smoke weed at an appropriate time to get into the right mindset for something, and then there are those who smoke weed to smoke weed.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: sleipnir on July 23, 2010, 05:24:41 PM
Quote
Alcohol, like any other drug, is as crippling as you want it to be.

I don't believe it's "as crippling as you want it to be." That sounds like a typical modern sentiment: you're in absolute control! You do get intoxicated and it does affect your judgment. In addition, it is addictive. While the weak-willed are more likely to immediately get hooked, most people simply lose time over it.

Lose the useless dualism?

http://www.ceveni.com/2009/01/aghori-sadhus-eating-human-flesh-video.html

Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Conservationist on July 24, 2010, 04:34:23 AM
Quote
Alcohol, like any other drug, is as crippling as you want it to be.

I don't believe it's "as crippling as you want it to be." That sounds like a typical modern sentiment: you're in absolute control! You do get intoxicated and it does affect your judgment. In addition, it is addictive. While the weak-willed are more likely to immediately get hooked, most people simply lose time over it.

Lose the useless dualism?

http://www.ceveni.com/2009/01/aghori-sadhus-eating-human-flesh-video.html

What dualism? Posting video links in response to an argument is very 4chan.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: MediterraneanSun on July 24, 2010, 10:50:05 AM
When I was at age 16 I started drinking (with friends) because I accidentaly discovered that it was a pleasant experience and a way to communicate with others in a non-routine sense. For three years (16, 17, 18) I drank at parties, at the end of school on special occations, in (greek) taverns, always with friends who drank too. I drank like 1 liter of wine at max (I am a tall guy regular weight). All was good way back then, at the surface, but underneath I was building a failure, and alcohol played a significant role in it.

About when I was 18, some mild failings at school happened, and this was exactly at the time of going into the adult world. A combination of things killed my spirit and I wasn't willing (or able) to understand that I was becoming a bitter burnout and better myself. Drinking at parties etc etc quickly gave it's place to drinking alone, or getting really drunk while others were just drinking one or two glasses. I felt and expressed the "need" to drink all day, but as I wasn't a moron I understood that It wasn't possible so I got into binge drinking. I would be sober for let's say 5 days, and drink heavily at friday night, and saturday night. However, these "sober" days narrowed more and more and the binge days widened. During the most extreme drinking "era" I would binge drink for 4 days or even 5 and be sober for 3, 4, at max. The darkness was about to cover the light, it was 50/50% metaphorically and literally. I was starting to experience some withdrawl symptoms, NOT hangover, but withdrawal after days of binge drinking. Annoying things like irritation, that damned and disturbing insomnia, an ugly feeling (that I have never read in any article or site about alcohol withdrawal) like muscle soreness combined with some strange mild burning sensation in the body, ugly smell and taste. Looking back at that period I just don't know what to think.

It all started changing when a series of events happened, I started valuing "being the voice of reality" and not being a hippie, I started changing from an extreme communist to a more traditional type, generally I underwent a change of values. In addition to that I had a small accident caused by alcohol that left me a tiny scar, it wasn't so painful or scary but it was COMPLETELY MEANINGLESS AND RIDICULOUS, I just fell running like an idiot, drunk. I thought: "What the fuck am I doing, what is the purpose of all this?" And the purpose was nothing, I was just a death worshipper who was acutally afraid to look his life in the eyes and say "I am not afraid, I am marching forward, I am going to get what I desire long term and create" like I did after all this. However, the void must be filled with something, and I wasn't able to quit and go sober immediately. Nevertheless, I stopped the binge drinking, I reduced the times I would drink at all, and discovered activities that fill the void (for example writting metal music or physical excercise).

What lesson I got from all this? There are MANY MANY fake people out there, that don't admit that they drink for a reason, most drink to suppress their fears and their inability to talk to girls or general incomfortability. When you admit it "I drink because I am a fucking coward" then you will gradually (not instantly) start to change this and challenge yourself in healthy activities. In a more ridiculous and lowest-common-denominator fashion, some drank (and smoked) just because it was "in" or wild whatever (those actually quit, not even actively, because they weren't ever in the game). Finally, there are many self-assured "wise men, intellectuals whatever" who never drank or smoked etc, some will say that were always wiser than you that indulged in these activities (that might be true at 1% but in nearly all cases it is fake), the reason they play this role is because they need to feel mature-since-birth and wiser than you to congratulate themselves that they have won over you in the power game. What a coincidence that almost all these people never had a normal sexual relationship (I am not kidding, this is not far-fetched).

Years later, I look at the bottles of alcohol with a cynical eye. I think it is all a fake shit, and actually orange juice has a nicer taste than most drinks, so just to drink for the booze is to escape reality. I just move on.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Tachäl Dhäl on July 27, 2010, 11:34:12 AM
I treat alcohol as a drink, not a drug.  Social or alone, it's just not something I find worth thinking much about either way.  I never liked the idea of sucking smoke into my lungs (accompanied by nicotine, THC, or anything else).  Pretty simple really.  Somebody will probably get me with pot brownies or other delicious baked goods one of these days... (I'm 27).
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: My AIDS, Your Arse on July 27, 2010, 04:39:30 PM
It could be the difference between masturbating once, and dehydrating yourself with an eight-hour masturbathon.


Masturbathon is now one of my favorite words. Hah.

Perhaps, with the way society is going, this wont be an unfeasible public event.

In accordance with prophecy...
10th Annual San Francisco Masturbate-a-thon (http://www.sfweekly.com/slideshow/10th-annual-masturbate-a-thon-really-nsfw-30005710/)
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Nightspirit on July 27, 2010, 05:36:10 PM
Let me start off by saying that drunks piss me off. With that being said, if you've ever been to a bar in the morning (which I have on the occasion of a friend's funeral), there's living proof behind those doors as to why over consumption of alcohol (whether it be in large quantities or small but frequent) will fuckin' kill you. Alcoholics are usually a variant of two: those that drink often and moderately, because bank accounts aren't unlimited, and those that drink heavily on more infrequent occasions.

How do you want your waking comatose?
Option A: is living every day like a self-pitying zombie waiting for something "special" to happen and it never comes. You allow opportunity to pass you by easily because "OH NO!!!!" -- success requires work, but alcohol doesn't. I think the psychological effects here are more debilitating than the actual physical damage. People muscle through medical conditions all the time devoid of complaint, but tack on a brooding weight that you willfully place on your shoulders that feels so damn good but you know it's killing your brain function, personality, character and everyday mood.

Option B: is the hobby of most Americans, the weekend warrior status of bro-mance and sausage fests. I'm completely repulsed by these folks. Working 9-5, five days a week is reinforced by THIS activity? You spent all week lucidly dreaming about the bars and women you'll meet there, so real you can almost grasp it before reality sets in. You make plans, map out your adventure, and stick as rigidly as chance, opportunity, metabolism and finances will allow. At the end of the night, who wins? When you don't drink often, but drink heavily for hours in a single night's time period, you have the personality of an Orc: rabid manhood, reduced to the simplest of physical pleasure seeking behavior. Stupid jokes, stories of woe, bad pickup lines, disposable conversation etc... any woman attracted to THAT is not very serious about living her life.

At the height of my drinking career I've avoided these futures like a plague upon mankind. Rather, I use alcohol as I personally define it's merit: as a tool, and like medicine, never too much. If I go out with a woman, my boss, my parents, my family or new friends and we're at a bar and grill, or just a bar, I'll drink because the community and setting dictates to temporarily unlearn my adulthood to properly pass people-words between "not-so-bad" people who have the drink on the mind (at the moment). I can't even do this if I tried, so alcohol will help me here. Alcohol is a good tool to build personal relations, and it's no surprise to me considering that I've found that child-like initiated relationships are bonded on stronger terms than the adult ones (not all but most).

I don't find a lot of uses in alcohol, but when I do use it I'm definitely sure it's not for some frivolous purpose.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: scourge on July 27, 2010, 08:20:20 PM
It would probably be more productive to merge this type of topic under a big tent useless pursuits thread which would also include movies, TV, dope, video games, charity, rock music and whoring.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Cargést on July 28, 2010, 04:42:37 AM
movies... video games

I'm gonna watch Star Wars and play Terranigma.  Might as well pursue "useless" things which have artistic merit.

I've also just noticed that the shitipedia synopsis of Terranigma (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terranigma#Story) manages to completely misunderstand the most important aspects of the game.  It's far deeper and far less dualistic than it's made out to be.  One of the prime concerns towards the end is whether Immortality is a viable goal for any species, and, as with most "good" art, the question is effectively left unanswered - on the one hand, Beruga is attempting to create a virus which will give humans an artificial Immortality at the expense of many other lifeforms; on the other, Kumari and his devotees, as well as many of the protagonist's allies/acquaintances, are already reincarnated throughout the game, which is a form of Immortality.  The protagonist doesn't die over what must be thousands of years, and it is suggested that he can't die unless he's actually killed by something.

Also, I might add that the Dark Side isn't "destroyed" at the end of the game - it's quite clearly stated by Light Gaia that it's simply been resealed, as it was after the first battle between Light Gaia and Dark Gaia (who are never referred to as "God" and "the Devil" in the game).

Actually, for anyone who has the free time (and inclination), I seriously recommend downloading a SNES emulator and getting "Illusion of Gaia" and "Terranigma", both made by Quintet - brilliant stories, crap enough graphics that they don't distract from the actual content, and a fair amount of philosophical value, even if it's all been said before (the guys at Quintet were mad about "balance", and they constantly bring Hindu/Buddhist themes and ideas into the Soul Blazer series).  Definitely a better way to spend your time than watching Comedy Central or playing Sudoku for hours on end.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Arctic Sun on July 28, 2010, 05:50:03 AM
Let me start off by saying that drunks piss me off. With that being said, if you've ever been to a bar in the morning (which I have on the occasion of a friend's funeral), there's living proof behind those doors as to why over consumption of alcohol (whether it be in large quantities or small but frequent) will fuckin' kill you. Alcoholics are usually a variant of two: those that drink often and moderately, because bank accounts aren't unlimited, and those that drink heavily on more infrequent occasions.

How do you want your waking comatose?
Option A: is living every day like a self-pitying zombie waiting for something "special" to happen and it never comes. You allow opportunity to pass you by easily because "OH NO!!!!" -- success requires work, but alcohol doesn't. I think the psychological effects here are more debilitating than the actual physical damage. People muscle through medical conditions all the time devoid of complaint, but tack on a brooding weight that you willfully place on your shoulders that feels so damn good but you know it's killing your brain function, personality, character and everyday mood.

Option B: is the hobby of most Americans, the weekend warrior status of bro-mance and sausage fests. I'm completely repulsed by these folks. Working 9-5, five days a week is reinforced by THIS activity? You spent all week lucidly dreaming about the bars and women you'll meet there, so real you can almost grasp it before reality sets in. You make plans, map out your adventure, and stick as rigidly as chance, opportunity, metabolism and finances will allow. At the end of the night, who wins? When you don't drink often, but drink heavily for hours in a single night's time period, you have the personality of an Orc: rabid manhood, reduced to the simplest of physical pleasure seeking behavior. Stupid jokes, stories of woe, bad pickup lines, disposable conversation etc... any woman attracted to THAT is not very serious about living her life.

At the height of my drinking career I've avoided these futures like a plague upon mankind. Rather, I use alcohol as I personally define it's merit: as a tool, and like medicine, never too much. If I go out with a woman, my boss, my parents, my family or new friends and we're at a bar and grill, or just a bar, I'll drink because the community and setting dictates to temporarily unlearn my adulthood to properly pass people-words between "not-so-bad" people who have the drink on the mind (at the moment). I can't even do this if I tried, so alcohol will help me here. Alcohol is a good tool to build personal relations, and it's no surprise to me considering that I've found that child-like initiated relationships are bonded on stronger terms than the adult ones (not all but most).

I don't find a lot of uses in alcohol, but when I do use it I'm definitely sure it's not for some frivolous purpose.

Yeah, drink in moderation and to what you're capable of within reason.  That's obvious.  But don't type a long-winded and worthless account explaining why, because nobody cares about the boring ins and outs you've had with drunkards.

Some people can get away with and flourish with alcohol, and some can't.  Simple as that.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Antihuman on July 28, 2010, 11:26:34 AM
I treat alcohol as a drink, not a drug.  Social or alone, it's just not something I find worth thinking much about either way.

Alcohol is by definition a drug-- alcoholic beverages are often called drinks, but it should be noted that they are not the type of drink one must consume to live (water is really the only one that fits that definition).  You can call it a drink, but the fact remains that alcohol numbs your mind ("takes the edge off"), and many alcoholic beverages contains large amounts of sugar.  I exclude it from my diet almost entirely for both of these reasons.

Social drinking drags one closer to the LCD-- that's really its only purpose.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Nightspirit on July 28, 2010, 02:00:56 PM

But don't type a long-winded and worthless account explaining why, because nobody cares about the boring ins and outs you've had with drunkards.

I don't think four paragraphs is long winded but that's just me. As for the content of my post, I think that an investigation upon the "type" of drunkard with paragraphs two and three answered through yes, experiences, but also a applicable illustration of these people in response to the OP's topic starting question of:

Quote
However, how much does this hold them back?

Plus, of the two common self-abusive, metal-damaging alcoholics that I've listed, I think it's important to note that "option B" rarely considers him/ herself an abusive alcoholic, so I think that if anything, that example alone has some merit.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Forza Romana on July 28, 2010, 06:44:10 PM
It is true that some can function just fine with alcohol consumption and some can not. If you take a cultural approach to the drinking process, I always have a glass a wine with dinner and maybe then an amaro after I am done. An amaro is a bitter sweet liqueur to help with digestion, as most of them, as far as the true Italian kind go, are made with herbs that have health properties.

But getting carried away is unhealthy so I always am in control of having too much...
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Christ Died of AIDS on July 31, 2010, 02:15:49 PM
I side with the opinion that the crippling effect of the alcohol depends on the individual.  I work with a master carpenter who has been a full blown alcoholic for 20+ years and he's one of the best I've ever seen. Some people manage to defy the odds and keep their wit, charm, and in this case, skills. Even if they lose everything else. If alcohol didn't get him, something else would have.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Emperor_of_Algol on August 01, 2010, 09:35:35 AM
As a teetotaller myself, I cannot offer a first-hand account of  whether alcohol is crippling or not. However, I've known a fair share of drinkers and alcoholics (vastly different groups), and from what I've seen, most people would do better just to leave alcohol alone. I've never actually seen alcohol improve anyone's ability to do anything, even socializing skills (I believe this is mostly a placebo effect, though of course have no "scientific" evidence to back this up). However, I do realise that many people would disagree with me on this point: alcohol is deeply entrenched in the culture of many people, and many would argue it improves, as mentioned above, ability to socialize and have intelligent conversation, and many other things beside.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Cargést on August 01, 2010, 12:26:20 PM
It certainly doesn't improve ability to have an intelligent conversation, it simply dulls the mind enough that you're not hung up about talking to people.
Title: Re: How crippling is alcohol?
Post by: Glenn Beck on August 01, 2010, 03:29:01 PM
It handicaps inhibition, or in other words: "Makes you looser". I'd say a few beers help improve it but anything after that makes you just act freaky.