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Messages - Iron

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Interzone / Re: Archaic video games
« on: July 25, 2012, 01:15:35 AM »
I agree with the above sentiment.

There are worse things than video-games, but I'm uneasy about their celebration. I think they're pretty toxic in the long run. They are designed to satisfy our desire for adventure and world-building without allowing us to actually engage in it 'for real'. The distinction between pornography and actual (good) sex comes to mind. Pornography should piss you off and leave you dissatisfied. So should video-gaming. If you have self-respect, you should expect more from life than such a cheap simulacrum...

Look. Every time the sun sets, the opportunity for adventure begins. I had a spontaneous adventure earlier this evening. Take a walk, take a drive. Soak up the night air, find/invent a mystery to appreciate. If you can do this with other people, even better.

Interzone / Re: Final moral question about killing and this website
« on: July 15, 2012, 07:27:40 PM »
It doesn't follow that by weeding out low IQ people, other positive traits are lost to mankind. Low IQ people are not special bearers of certain virtues that are not also expressed in the intelligent people.

This is true. The idea that you would extinguish people on the sole basis of their intelligence, however, implies that these other virtues are basically irrelevant, or that they're a pleasant bonus at best. Obviously, a number of people around here disagree, including myself.

Interzone / Re: Quebec student protests
« on: June 17, 2012, 05:31:14 PM »
"Education allows people to become not only more aware of the world around them but also to become more self-aware..." <------------------ This is the issue that makes your proposition problematic. Does education really do this for people? It certainly does it for some, but the vast majority of people pass through it without undergoing any genuine intellectual growth. This is disappointing in and of itself, but what's worse is that these hordes of dull, uninterested, uninteresting people transform their environment more than they are transformed by it. They don't read or absorb the assigned readings, they cheat on tests, they do everything they can to avoid engaging with the content of their courses. The end result is implementation of policies that cater to this type of student. Everything gets dumbed down and gets easier. Additionally, the presence of so much chaff in a given classroom makes it difficult for others to learn. The miasma of disengaged apathy squelches all enthusiasm for and discussion of the course material.

The reality is that a lot of people should be brick-layers, but they've been deceived into thinking that they're all born engineers, lawyers, etc.

Interzone / Re: Behave like neurotypicals
« on: May 09, 2012, 08:11:17 PM »
Yeah, it's him. No doubt about it.

But anyway, this is a silly argument. Yes, SOME metal resembles SOME classical in form and in content. Yes, SOME metal is directly influenced by SOME classical. No, not all metal derives from classical, and obviously metal involves its own unique innovations.

The relationship isn't even that important. There's nothing intrinsically good about the classical form. Metal can (and probably should) be assessed on its own merits.

This is what matters:

a.) Metal explores the human state in its most remote extremes... those parts of the psyche and imagination that are typically regarded as inhuman or inaccessible, alien, dangerous, etc, etc. Death, magic, warfare, and raw formless power, etc, etc.
b.) Metal takes all of that ugly darkness and wilderness and makes something orderly and beautiful out of it.

Interzone / Re: Under 120s gone: better or worse?
« on: April 25, 2012, 10:35:55 PM »
I don't know why anyone would answer "worse" for this question. "Better" is the correct answer of course.

Some people are weak in their souls and are afraid to defy taboo.

They want to convince us that we are wrong and impractical, and therefore, we should abandon truth for convenience.

That's cowardice and no nihilist should respect it.

That's a bunch of shrill, emotional noise, right there. You did NOT address the criticisms of your proposal. From the beginning, you just kicked up a bunch of smoke and evaded the issue by attacking people's character and psychoanalyzing their motivations, in exactly the fashion you constantly advise people against. I can do that too - most people on internet forums can, and this is typical internet behavior you're engaging in. Unfortunately, the only people it wins over to your side are exactly the kind of people who you don't need: sycophants who are responsive to hyperbole.

The people who you've been having an allergic reaction to over the past few days are people who are in agreement with ANUS 80% of the time. A more competent person could have and would have openly challenged our criticisms in a thoughtful, dispassionate way. If I thought you had given careful, sober thought to the issue, and your argument was thorough and sound, I would have been willing to listen to and be swayed by whatever you had to say, no matter how disagreeable or absurd it sounded on the surface. If you can't win a person like myself over, you're never going to get anywhere. You'll keep presiding over a tiny circle of forum-regulars, though.

Sorry if I sound like your dad. I'm not going to pursue the issue further.

Interzone / Re: Complaints
« on: April 24, 2012, 03:16:22 PM »
It's so the internet, spend all your time talking, do nothing. Scourge is right though if we don't do something different we fail.

That's our liberal democracy. A bunch of bureaucrat personality types delberating not over whether but upon how and not because of any supposed technical hurdles but secretly because they are each motivated by avoiding culpability.

Nice psychoanalysis - "people only disagree with me because they are cowardly and ethically bankrupt". What an elegant way to sidestep the content of someone's argument.

Even if you really believe it, you should be able to recognize that effective people are capable of addressing criticisms even when they suspect ulterior motives on the part of their critics. Aren't you and Conservationist both always repeating that line about paying attention to ideas, and not the individuals who issue them? This is the way you lead and build consensus - not by falling back on passive aggressive prophecies of doom.

Interzone / Tardocaust objections
« on: April 23, 2012, 04:11:03 PM »
Save our borderline tards so they can grow up into child torturers and ecocidists. In other words, I can't be blamed for anything because I safely stood on the sidelines all my life while our world died.

Yeah, because the only conceivable response to the problem is to try to kill it off all at once. If you're not on board with that, you've obviously abandoned the world to it's fate and decided to eat ice-cream all day instead. Those are the only two possibilities.

Interzone / Re: Complaints
« on: April 23, 2012, 04:07:36 PM »
Your body is fat - obviously we should cut into your flesh and suck all of your fat out with a hose. It's simple! Excessive fat is undesirable, and sucking it all out with a hose gets rid of this undesirable substance! Result is a less fat body! What? You're concerned that you might die in the process or be hideous malformed and crippled for life? NONSENSE, WHAT ARE YOU, SOME KIND OF EMO FAT-LOVER? What? You think exercise and healthy eating is a more rational and realistic solution? LOL, WE DON'T HAVE TIME FOR THAT, TOO MUCH THINKING AND NOT ENOUGH TIME!

Interzone / Re: Complaints
« on: April 23, 2012, 02:06:15 PM »
If you're really serious about getting people on board with an idea, you take the time to address their criticisms or uncertainties. If you can't figure out how to do this, even on a forum where people are all roughly on the same page, how are you ever going to convince anyone outside your tiny little social milieu that your idea is a good one?

Nice 'leadership' effort!

Interzone / Re: Don 't take my tard!
« on: April 22, 2012, 10:31:47 PM »
That being said, I find normal, and slightly substandard, people to be much more of a problem. There's more of them, and they have just enough intelligence to band together in harmful behavior. Actual retards are relatively uncommon, and their being retarded is itself a form of damage control.

Yeah, I agree with this. So-and-so's tardchild, taken as an individual, is probably about as damaging to our society as a pet dog. On the other hand, it occurs to me that the vast majority of our culture's Bad Ideas are spawned in the minds of 'smartish' people with neurotic impulses or twisted visions of the world. As a group, radical Marxists probably possess much more cognitive agility than your typical horde of WalMart shamblers, but their impact on our culture is much more corrosive, because of their ability to influence the social narrative. Similarly, liberals are typically somewhat smarter than conservatives, but their social policies have less to do with reality.

The failure of contemporary culture has its origin in the bad social policies and warped social narratives of older intellectual movements. Truly stupid people never create anything - they don't even create social policy. They never act - they are always acted upon. They can be taught to do and think almost anything. Some of them can even be inspired to bravery and selflessness. Currently, they eat potato chips and watch TV.

Interzone / Complaints
« on: April 22, 2012, 10:10:17 PM »
If all people under 120 IQ points died tomorrow, would life be better or worse?

The answer to this question:

In the short term - worse. As Annihilation mentioned, waste plants, chemical plants, nuclear reactors, plus a whole fucking slew of things that need people to operate would shut down, and possibly blow up. It would be one hell of a trip for the surviving members of humanity; in fact I'd wager the population would decrease even more due to the mountainous piles of dead bodies that would likely harbor diseases in addition to previously mentioned factors.

In the long term - ultimately better, I'd say. A more intelligent humanity overall would lead to greater achievements, smarter people, and a generally better planet.

This does not mean we ignore the short term consequences - because while they may be "short" in a cosmic sense, in a human sense it wouldn't be short at all. A couple decades at least of increased pollution and radioactivity. We need to consider the human factor to some degree. To discard it entirely is ridiculous and short sighted.

The scenario you've described does apply, I suppose, to a situation in which everyone below 120 literally died spontaneously all at once. But the issue here is actually exterminating the populace, which would probably be more time consuming and gradual. It would also probably require direct human agency. So, in addition to the various problems related to maintenance of infrastructure, you can add protracted civil war. Additionally, it's totally obvious to me that even if this absurd scenario somehow did play out, there would be severe psychological and social consequences which would deeply imbed themselves in the newly birthed 'tard free' society. Does anyone here really believe that the dehumanization and trauma of the survivors would not have an impact on the nature of the emergent society?

Everyone would probably convert to Christianity, burn the instigators of the Tardicide at the stake, and spend the next several centuries living in the shadow of what had just occurred.

Interzone / Complaints
« on: April 22, 2012, 09:59:18 PM »
People get fanatical when they're afraid.

Why are they so afraid of this question?

If all people under 120 IQ points died tomorrow, would life be better or worse?

Seems it should be simple, for nihilists or death metal fans.

The way you're using the term 'fanatical' doesn't mean anything. People just disagree with you, and some guy who thinks (quite reasonably) that you'd like to kill his kid decided (quite reasonably) that he'd prefer to kill you.

Seems like somewhere between 30-40% (rough guess based on other threads where you pose the same question) of people on these forums believe that life would be worse if you extinguished all sub-120s tomorrow. They've given you a variety of answers, and then you evade these by pretending that they really mean something other than what they're saying. Every time someone says "No, because it's unrealistic" or "No, because it would have unforeseen consequences" or "No, because these people aren't actually a problem", you fail to address the content of their answer.

This thread is going to produce the exact same responses you've already had elsewhere - what are you trying to accomplish here?

Interzone / Re: Don 't take my tard!
« on: April 22, 2012, 06:18:21 PM »
This is pathetic. Who needs to perform character assassination on ANUS when they do it themselves? Good luck leading the charge into the heroic tard-free future when even half of the people on your own forum think you're a bitter asshole whose natural environment is the internet.

Interzone / Re: Don 't take my tard!
« on: April 22, 2012, 06:15:22 PM »
I have an intellectually disabled son and if anyone came around my home with the intent of causing harm, I would feed them their own intestines

Internet tough guy. If you and your tard wanted to live near me, I'd run you both out with a shotgun for being parasites.

secondly, for supposed traditionalists you parroting a view that was developed in the early 20th century

No. Societies have killed defectives for a long time. Even executing murders fits into this category.

Anyone who has actually spent time with someone with one of these disabilities can see a purer, more transgressive humanity

Did I just accidentally tune in to the justification channel?

Actually, this guy very likely would literally kill you in order to protect his kid. Like most people would. There's nothing internet tough-guy about it. A lot of people would sooner die than allow you to carry out your campaign of tard slaying. The number of people willing to kill and die to defend their sub-120 friends or relatives is almost certainly higher than the number of people who are willing to kill and die for the distant (and highly questionable) abstraction of your 'better society without the dumbs'. You can't just pretend this away.

Also - this whole notion that 'when things get hard enough' the idea of massacring adults with IQs below 120 will suddenly become a realistic plan in the minds of all those people out there who are currently Obama-voting liberals or conservative Christians is totally ridiculous. It's the same thing that radical utopian idealists have always been claiming about their movements: the Marxists insist that one day the proletariat will develop an internationalist class consciousness, the white nationalists insist that one day white people will wake up and stop reproducing with non-whites, etc, etc, etc. It's always somewhere on the horizon, right over the hill in the next decade. These kind of people never realize that: 1.) few are convinced about their assessment of 'the problem' and their prescribed cures, which are typically crude, simplistic, apocalyptic and absolute; 2.) human communities and individuals have a great capacity for adapting to strenuous situations, and will often face physical hardship and sometimes even the threat of annihilation rather than sacrifice their value systems and worldviews.

Nobody is going to get in line to kill half of the people they know. It is a self-indulgent fantasy, and the continuing attachment that people on this site have to this idea is hard to understand when there are more realistic ways to address the same problems. These include: legislated limitations on childbirth based upon various criteria, sterilization of criminals and sociopaths, universal and easy access to abortion, finding a way to mandate the use of birth control, etc, etc.

P.S: on a personal level - which DOES matter for 'leaders' - your inability to articulate yourself or address criticisms without resorting to passive aggression and snideness is a real failing. You realize it just looks like impotent bitterness to everyone else, right? You're not going to get very far in your social revolution acting like this.

Metal / Re: New "Old School Death Metal"
« on: April 09, 2012, 10:19:18 PM »
I tried the Nekropsalms album from Obliteration and zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I'll try it again when I am in a different frame of mind but I couldn't even finish it.

That was my initial reaction. Definitely not an immediate pleaser, but I've listened to it twice through now, and it's starting to unfold. I think I like it.

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