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Messages - Wild

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Interzone / Re: Atheism
« on: February 21, 2014, 03:11:01 AM »
I think that it is fruitless to divorce Humanism from Christianity in the history of ideas.

Christianity emerged saying many of the same things as other religions of that time period.

These two seem to be conflicting here, at least as long as the narrative of humanism deriving from a secular conception of Christianity's ethics is upheld. If Christianity is necessarily a humanistic religion, and Christianity bears similarities to other religions of its time, it would seem to follow that the liberal proto-humanistic tendency pre-dates the adoption of it into this specific belief system (BS).

My case: secular humanism is a vehicle aimed at conveying a BS which derives its nature from an impulse towards degeneracy that pre-dates Christianity. There isn't anything specifically post-Christian about it; it is the already-existing belief tendency spread without any metaphysical additions. 

(There might be a challenge that the humanistic can exist only after the belief in anything higher than oneself has vanished, but this isn't much of a challenge: the Jews, and then the Christians, believed that everything is created for humans, which are the highest order of everything which is not divine.)

It just happened to catch on by a stroke of luck.

This seems highly unlikely; anything with the power to convulse humanity would probably have something to it. Obviously, it owes its initial domination to Rome. Why the Romans were willing to abandon their paganism in favor of this creed is a very intriguing question...

Interzone / Re: The way things are - The way things ought to be
« on: February 21, 2014, 12:00:17 AM »
Walking the plank a bit further:

In regards to the "irrefutable" nature of the process explicated by crow:

Looking at it, it does seem proper that it is, in a sense, irrefutable: he recognizes the change in himself prior to some moment(s) of understanding, and thus achieves a higher state from which he can look back at and compare his prior attempts at understanding. Now, this obviously is the height of subjectivity; which poses a problem for those of us who want to test everything before not-ever-fully trusting it. We cannot know whether he ever had this enlightenment experience, nor what it contained, nor what was actually realized by him.

However, we hold various characters in history in high regard: Lao-tse, Buddha, Jesus [the philosophic compassion of enlightenment aspect, not the liberalism/Christianity™], along with usually unnamed pagan teachers, though identities of some survive, such as among the Greeks. We know far less about these humans than we do about crow, we don't even know whether these people actually existed; however, their ideas confer value to us and we measure their effects upon us as individuals.

To state that all off this is a misapprehension and derives from a psychological pretense seems erroneous, which is probably why crow dismisses those claims without providing any further evidence or explication, as it isn't necessary and wouldn't convince the people who make them anyway.

If we then accept that there is value to this type of attempt to describe an individual's "process of becoming", we must be confronted that when objectively analyzed, there is a common strand running through all of them. We must then use our judgment to determine whether or not this is represented honestly by crow. If it's a deception, at least it's based upon valuable ideas that are worth coming back through again; if it's an honest endeavor, then it retains that while adding far more value of dignity.

Additionally, there isn't an iron hard "THOU SHALLT" coming from any of the afore-mentioned teachers [their followers, on the other hand...]. They "simply" offer their perspective on a similar process of achieving a differing state. There is a large difference in the individuals' beliefs which are additional to the moment of understanding [science, religion, politics, etc]. These people could probably have quite conflicting discussions about all of these areas, all while not denying the original process which led to their understanding. It seems that crow is irritated not by that, but by the method of conversation which denies the understanding can ever occur.

[Insert copy-crow charge here]

Interzone / Re: The way things are - The way things ought to be
« on: February 20, 2014, 08:47:34 PM »
I can understand the (unfortunate) need for a moderator, and Crow seems like a nice soul. But the incessant insistence, on his part, of special access to knowledge inaccessible (isn't that just irrefutable as well) to others is a little insulting. You can't refute it, you can't argue with it, because if you don't get it, well that's BECAUSE YOU CAN'T - which is totally self contained and shut off from other people. No wonder this sort of position is a strong one - because by its very nature disagreeing with it in effect validates it.

Is this true, though? If it was inaccessible, there would be no point explaining it to other critters. The point seems to be that it can be made more accessible through x ways, but it can never have full knowledge of it given through language to another. And it evidently isn't self-contained, as numerous references are made to those who had similar experiences and taught about it (particularly Lao-tse). It seems more accurate to say it is an "objective" [used carefully] "experience of becoming" which undergoes a subjective interpretation that is colored by the individual's predisposition/experiences. And as a non-egalitarian, he recognizes that not all people will achieve this, just as some are incapable of understanding quantum physics/etc.

[Insert copy-crow charge here]

Interzone / Re: My dick.
« on: February 20, 2014, 08:24:12 PM »
Apparently everybody missed this:

It has a slight and graceful curve to the left

Crow's a leftist!


Interzone / Re: My dick.
« on: February 20, 2014, 07:42:19 PM »
@ all

this is the internet





Interzone / Re: Atheism
« on: February 20, 2014, 07:40:48 PM »

Is the tendency towards proto-humanism a divorcible element from the Christian tradition?

If not, one could make the argument that the main point of Christianity™ was to provide a metaphysical justification for that pre-existing belief tendency. God's death simply changed how it was explicated and defended.

If it is divorcible, do you think it's been done before / could it be done?

Interzone / Re: waves and frequencies
« on: February 19, 2014, 06:23:02 AM »

Interzone / Re: waves and frequencies
« on: February 19, 2014, 06:21:45 AM »

Interzone / Re: Birdbrain!
« on: February 18, 2014, 06:10:06 AM »

Poor taste?

Metal / Ildjarn bandcamp
« on: February 17, 2014, 01:50:17 AM »
Evidently, Ildjarn is on bandcamp now: http://ildjarn.bandcamp.com/

Is Ildjarn rising from the dead (turning a Jesus™)?

Interzone / Re: No God, no Satan.
« on: February 17, 2014, 01:22:35 AM »
If God is defined as moving in a way compatible with reality and Satan is defined as an opposition to that, then of course "following God" would be the correct course of action.

The problem is Christians don't define it that way, if they ever did.

Their God is an unreal god, whom they turn to when they cannot stomach reality and want to wish it away, usually in context of pain and suffering. Satan then ends up as representing the force of reality, undisturbed by human bullshit, which is why so many death metal and black metal bands (which were reality-based) used him as an avatar.

These metaphors derive meaning and purpose only by how humans infuse them - different groups in different times can come up with reversed values concerning the same metaphors.

Interzone / Praise Bob!
« on: February 09, 2014, 10:09:04 AM »

Audiofile / Haven In Shadows
« on: February 01, 2014, 02:07:45 AM »
Haven In Shadows
Haven In Shadows MP3s

"Melancholic Finnish black metal which attempts to answer the question posed by the original wave of
black metal: 'What have we forgotten and how can we recall it?' Meditative at heart, this is something lost within the current generation of black metal and is worth rediscovering again."

Haven In Shadows

Legend of the Wolf (1995)

Haven In Shadows - Legend of the Wolf (1995, senditz)

Interzone / Re: Accidentally vegan
« on: January 29, 2014, 02:37:47 AM »
Did you make an account just to talk about veganism?

Did you make an account to complain about vegans?

If you bother to look at his profile, you'll see he's been around for years. So, no.

Metal / Re: What happened to Ildjarn
« on: January 25, 2014, 11:32:16 PM »
Do we have any confirmation that this fellow is Nidhogg?

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