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616
Interzone / Re: 23 degrees: feels like 28 degrees.
« on: July 25, 2013, 03:06:58 PM »
Sure, link me to a wikipedia page, that's not the most dismissive and pedantic way to abandon an argument.

I'm trying to emphasize that mathematics and language are human-imposed translations of natural occurrences (things that occur with or without our knowledge and consent). But you are getting so bogged down in mysteriously shrouded semantics that you can't even stay on the same conceptual level here. I'll repeat it once more and then I give up because it is clear you are not interested in thoroughly explaining or even transparently disproving what I'm saying:

Numbers describe things; numbers are not things. You cannot jump back and forth between both positions. Forget about contemplation and try to focus on definition if you want to get anywhere comparing your ideas with those of other minds.

617
Metal / Re: Goreaphobia
« on: July 25, 2013, 01:33:00 AM »
I just stopped by to say damn this is some interesting music. Thanks for whoever originally took the pains to share.

618
Interzone / Re: 23 degrees: feels like 28 degrees.
« on: July 25, 2013, 01:28:52 AM »
Quote
it is not telling you how you feel.
Actually, that's what its purpose is.

Quote
You are asking a question as unanswerable as this; "How can you tell me how much TEN is?
One more than nine.
Two less than twelve.
Five groups of two.

Quote
How can I know that TEN to you means as much as TEN to me?

You can't, but feelings are irrelevant. Ten is not reducible further as an idea, it refers to an event in objective reality.

One more than nine? So you are defining a relative value by contrasting it with other relative values? Are you trying to disprove or reinforce my point? Numbers don't refer to events in objective reality in the same way that "snowstorm" or "electron" refers to events in objective reality. A number is like my screen name; we both know what we're talking about, but the rest of "objective reality" cares little what a dead last is or what I mean by it.

Feelings are irrelevant? I am suggesting here that the temperature refined through the heat index is a relatable and quantifiable notion. Feelings are not irrelevant because that is exactly what is being described through the numbers (which you claim exist in objective reality and can therefore be used to relate to them) that we use in temperature. If feelings are indeed irrelevant then haven't you nullified your own point?

I'm trying to say that if a weather forecaster tells you what the heat index is, he is not demanding that you now begin feeling a certain way. He is describing what you can expect. I tell you to drive a fork into your eye (make sure your fingers come into contact with the socket please) and that you will experience much pain. Are you going to tell me that know I am somehow imposing feeling on you?

Crow, I've been lurking this forum for a longer time than most of you would be comfortable with knowing and I look forward to your posts more than any others. However this is a case where clarity would behoove you (there I go again, telling people how to feel  8)). Unless this is indeed some concept too vast to be reiterated with language, which may very well be the case. But if so, why try to share?

619
Interzone / Re: 23 degrees: feels like 28 degrees.
« on: July 23, 2013, 04:00:28 AM »
The heat index is only a number, it is not telling you how you feel. You are asking a question as unanswerable as this; "How can you tell me how much TEN is? How can I know that TEN to you means as much as TEN to me? What if MY TEN is greater or less than YOUR TEN? How can we really call it TEN?" Sounds like some sort of solipsism.

It doesn't matter how great or small number X means to you, really, because you will never know how 80 degrees feels to me anyway. We just use it as a measurement for the same reason we name colors. We experience the sensation in a relatively similar way and so it is objective enough to identify consistently and give a name to.

Heat index is a plenty bewildering concept if you want to delve into "the problem of other minds" stuff, but aside from that, it is not so arbitrary or imposing as you make it seem by asking who "decides what it feels like for all".

620
Interzone / Re: 23 degrees: feels like 28 degrees.
« on: July 22, 2013, 06:07:13 AM »
It's a matter of taking into account wind chill and heat index. Sometimes 80 degrees in Indiana feels like 90 degrees in Arizona. Humidity is a factor because at high levels, it makes sweating less effective. Obviously if our sweat can't evaporate quickly, then we won't be able to cool down. Therefore the same objective temperature in two different places will feel different depending on the humidity; hotter to us if the humidity level is high, cooler if it is low.

That's why I like the western states. I like my sweat to work effectively, thanks much.

*edit*

When wind moves over your skin, sweating becomes extra effective, so higher wind chill means lower perceived temperature in general. Forgot to mention that.

621
it makes them look good, if nothing else.

Arresting someone because of paranoiac suspicion looks good to what kind of person?*

*The best answer I can come up with is, "the kind of person that defers to authority's judgment," and while that is not a bad thing, it is also not a good thing, so tell me what you think happened in this instance and what good or bad could come of it.

I did tell you what I think has happened my friend. It looks good to the citizens, the average voter, if the authorities their tax money goes towards are checking people like Varg out. I didn't pass judgement over whether this is a good thing, or a bad thing. Don't be so obtuse.



Alright, fair word. I shouldn't have expected the answer I wanted by asking that kind of question, so I'll just skip to asking for the answer that I wanted; Why do people, the citizens, and average voters who pay taxes, think that this looks good? I am sincerely asking for information because I lack any. I don't know anyone in France, and don't have any clear idea of what the general voter population's views on national security might be.

I ask because I'd like to compare France's reaction to this sort of thing to the way the US might react to the same sort of government action.

622
it makes them look good, if nothing else.

Arresting someone because of paranoiac suspicion looks good to what kind of person?*

There is a bit of a shitstorm in the US right now because the Fed Gov has been situating itself in such a way that it will not cause a stir when they nab some poor innocent sap just because they had cause to be suspicious (maybe he visited a website about the Aryan Brotherhood and then bought some hand guns). Not that I'm defending the poor innocent sap, necessarily, although I would not like to be in that position so I do have a stake in where this whole set up lands us.

*The best answer I can come up with is, "the kind of person that defers to authority's judgment," and while that is not a bad thing, it is also not a good thing, so tell me what you think happened in this instance and what good or bad could come of it.

623
Metal / Re: Why do we all hate -core music?
« on: July 14, 2013, 12:15:03 PM »
Do we all hate nu-core? We are not hive.

I don't see any point exploring it. It's rock music.

That it throws in some metal riffs doesn't distract from its basic inattention to reality and thus, rather boring personal drama that I don't care about.

So where exactly do you find this Line of No Return that divides music between "metal" and "rock"? Is the Line in the lyrical subject matter? And what is it about the lyrical subject matter then? Is it lyrics referencing non-egotistic, inhuman subjects? In that case, what specifically separates spacey prog-rock lyrics from death metal? The level of aggression, violence, or menace projected? I'd like some clarification just because I appreciate your commentary and I find myself drawing all sorts of unhelpful conclusions from tangential logic.

624
Metal / Re: Why do we all hate -core music?
« on: July 10, 2013, 12:12:10 PM »
Shai Hulud's album That Within Blood Ill-Tempered is more metal than most metal and it practically defines metalcore. I'm not going to bother explaining how technically bizarre the structures are or how expertly composed the melodies prove, because it would sound like hyperbole to anyone who hasn't heard it. I will say that it is an album that maintains every musically creative aspect of the better death metal bands (lyrics included), it is just presented with (mostly) tonal and melodic guitar playing.

625
Interzone / Re: Genesis of Melody
« on: July 07, 2013, 04:25:05 PM »
Some recent research suggests that humans are born "biologically hard-wired" to detect the difference between harmony and dissonance, and to respond to harmonic intervals rather than dissonant ones (and by a dissonant interval I don't mean something like a 6th, I just mean generally atonal noise).

However, it is very interesting that people born in, say, the "United" States are much more likely to have a strong response to basic myxolidian or pentatonic melodies rather than, say, microtonal melodies from India or heavily minor-based string music from Japan. My logic suggests that this is a result of conditioning beginning at childhood. Furthermore, the handful of people who listen to Edgar Varese or Igor Stravinsky have evidently subverted their biological programming and have somehow trained themselves to comprehend intervals that otherwise would not trigger an immediate emotive response like the basic pentatonic scales do.

Interesting stuff for sure. What sort of horrific reconfiguration have we subjected our brains to that we can comprehend death metal?

626
Interzone / Re: Suicide
« on: July 07, 2013, 04:03:53 PM »
The original post opened me up to something that I'd never thought of before, not even during the many times in the past where suicide was at the forefront of my mind (more as a moral question than an option). There are indeed a billion motives for suicide, but we only have one word for it, regardless of the circumstances or motives surrounding the death.

Consider how many ways we can describe a death when two (or more) people are involved; murder, assassination, mercy killing, justified self-defense, revenge, manslaughter (say, if one killed another out of carelessness rather than malice). But we don't have many ways to describe the motive behind a suicide. It's just automatically "suicide", and all that implies.

So is this intentional? Do we want to cover all self-inflicted deaths under a blanket term so that people will hear all the negative connotations along with the word? Or is it just a result of the laziness of English speakers in the USA? Clearly other cultures demonstrate an understanding of the differences in suicidal motives (the Japanese seppuku and kamekazi were a great example).

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