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Messages - aquarius

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691
Metal / Re: In that case: Black Metal as Greek or Wagnerian Drama
« on: January 20, 2012, 02:25:12 AM »
This is not neccessarily about the future of metal as it is seeing if there is indeed a case to be made that the activities in Norway in the early 90s were somehow an acommplishment of the Greek ideal of art in music, that being the idea of a full experience of music and drama, along with imagery to match the two.

That is indeed some of the superficial appeal of the early Norwegian scene, that it plays out like a drama with real life consequences. But I don't think this link to real life events enhances the quality of the art, and it also doesn't make the inherent romanticism of the music any less relevant.

I think live performance is the closest aspect to the full visual/audial experience in the Greek ideal, but it's also severely lacking. Not to say I don't appreciate the genius of bands that have mastered their craft, but oftentimes I feel bored with the incongruency of the music and the performance. I hate seeing inferior renditions of the album version and I don't think the typical pub/club atmosphere (and all the loonies it attracts) is worthy of the music. I really admire groups like The Moon Lay Hidden Beneath a Cloud for totally connecting every aspect of their art, playing at old churches, ruins etc.

It would be cool if bands did something akin to live variations around the basic spirit/ideals of the recorded works. Or in the case of a band like Summoning, move closer into the realms of poetry, using music to carry it, actually it's a shame they don't play live as I'm sure it wouldn't dissapoint.


692
Metal / Re: ILDJARN contributes positive view of A.N.U.S.
« on: January 17, 2012, 06:38:34 AM »
Does anyone know what he's up to these days? According to the interview he should be dead by now. It's a shame he didn't make more tracks like the opening on Ildjarn-Nidhogg s/t. Apparently he broke his four-tracker and called it quits, but what the hell kind of excuse is that?

Also does anyone remember his old website where he put up some photography of the Hardanger countryside? I saved a few but it would be cool to get the rest if anyone has access to them.

693
Metal / Re: The album of your day
« on: January 16, 2012, 01:52:49 PM »
I remember making compilations of stuff from late night metal radio shows taped onto cassette. Usually odd songs interspersed by interviews and some introductory effects, that was about the best I had back then. I imagine the process of finding material worthy of listening to was much different than today where everything is downloadable, before it's even released.

Now I tend to listen to one type of music for a few days and gradually move onto something else, ideally making this transition as smooth as possible. Sometimes it might relate to seasons or phases of the moon. Certain albums I can only listen to at night (like Ildjarn-Nidhogg - Hardangervidda). But I guess over time I've also realized that the absence of music can be as valuable as music itself in order to fully defrag the mind prior to immersion.

694
Metal / Re: Deicide
« on: January 16, 2012, 12:43:16 PM »
The first Deicide album was some of the first metal I ever really got into so I still have a soft spot for their old stuff. Though I find Once upon the cross is a bit too simple and blockheaded to really enjoy nowadays, and I wouldn't bother with anything after that. I guess the band kind of fullfil the same purpose as Profanatica, Slayer, Impaled Nazarene etc. as pure and simple blasphemy, it's just that I'm way past that stage at this point. Regarding being raped by priests, well that pretty much says it all; who wouldn't become a narcisistic/borderline self-harming PD as a result?

695
Metal / Re: Production versus Composition
« on: January 12, 2012, 04:19:14 PM »
If production has any legitimate value at all, it is surely when it helps enhance the compositional material in question. So in the case of something like Transylvanian Hunger or any of the Ildjarn albums, I think it's also a matter of there being no more appropriate a production than what they achieved given the compositional material.

But there's also some oddball albums that are not so easily separated in these terms. My Bloody Valentine's Loveless strikes me as more than a little dependent on that twisted, blurry production to carry the material through. It's a great album nonetheless.

696
Metal / Re: Australian/nz metal
« on: January 12, 2012, 11:51:47 AM »
Midnight Odyssey has some good ideas but I mainly like the Firmament album. Otherwise there's not much, but the first four Dead Can Dance albums makes up for it where metal is lacking.

697
Metal / Re: Lost inheritances
« on: January 12, 2012, 11:43:32 AM »
The problem seems to be that a band will find a unique sound and others will think 'we're going to play innovatitive music in the style of x blended with y'. This is just a contradiction. Either you end up playing innovative music or you immitate; the choice is yours but don't lie about what you're doing. Reading interviews from seminal bands one can see that they simply played the music that they loved and let it grow naturally into something unique. There's too much forcing it going.

The thing is though, some music developed a very unique, unmistakable voice i.e. Satyricon (or maybe even a composer like Mahler) but it still doesn't amount to anything. Whereas a band like Darkthrone only ever admits to paying homage to Bathory/Celtic Frost.

698
Interzone / Re: Lack of audience kills quality art
« on: January 11, 2012, 12:26:13 PM »
Interesting question. Supposing someone today wrote music that wholly resembled Bach or any of the great masters in form and spirit, would it cease to have meaning based on the inability of moderns to comprehend it? Or does audience popularity not apply to immortal music?

699
Interzone / Re: Another way technology wreaks your life
« on: January 11, 2012, 11:59:26 AM »
This is true. In my case I have to restrict myself to maybe 1-2 hours every second day otherwise it takes over and totally derails the body-clock.

700
Metal / Re: NEXT metal
« on: January 09, 2012, 05:13:14 PM »
I think that need to change might be one of the things that kills a genre

If you can identify a genre as a means to an end, then it doesn't matter if it dies, especially if the end that is achieved is vastly superior, which in this case I think it would be. Given the already existing dammage done to black metal I'd say it's got nothing to lose. The spirit of speed metal and death metal has always lived in black metal, so why couldn't a non black metal musician be influenced in the same way?

... and certainly when that need to change is early and imagined.  They always end up changing the wrong thing, and it eventually even becomes a rational explanation for selling out.  Look at the trash bands that sold out.  They all explain it by saying they were in a corner and it was time to change.  So then they change to pop music.

I think it's not a true need, and you usually see that "evolution" is not the correct word for what they end up doing.  They look at metal history in the 80s and see Slayer transform from early speed metal into Reign in Blood and then assume it's the game to keep pushing it, when really they were just trying to get to a certain point and not trying to constantly play a game of who is heaviest, which is a trap a lot of important metal bands fell in after that album came out.

True, but isn't it possible that the change is occuring naturally and eventually for the better? Besides I'm thinking more Dol Guldur or Electric Doom Synthesis than Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk.


701
Metal / Re: NEXT metal
« on: January 08, 2012, 11:45:12 AM »
The question of whether metal should jump ship or go back to its roots is somewhat oversimplified in my opinion. But I think genre-evolution (including composition and instrumentation) is inevitable; moreso genre is merely a vehicle for ideas, it changes when the vehicle is depleted of energy and/or when it can no longer accomodate the expansion of ideas. And yes ideas need to expand, not that metal ever required an era-specific voice, as its outlook is mostly romanticist, realist i.e. eternal truths. But the interpretation of outlook must to some extent acknowledge the changing times.

702
Metal / Re: Understanding Metal Composition
« on: January 06, 2012, 09:33:42 PM »
I've noticed in some of the best metal songs and albums, that the conclusion does not imply a feeling of finality, but a feeling of perpetuity. 

Transcendence of ego (perspective of the listener)?

I think the final piece from Holst's The Planets has this quality.

703
Metal / Re: Lost inheritances
« on: January 06, 2012, 09:27:30 PM »
Soulside Journey gets my vote in terms of the most enduring (twisted yet logical) song structures.

Hvis lyset tar oss is also unrivalled. Filosofem has been done with little success.

Godflesh - Streetcleaner, much to be learned here in terms of ambient metal.

704
Metal / Re: Bruckner Discussion
« on: January 06, 2012, 09:12:51 PM »
The previous post pretty much sums it all up with Bruckner.

But I'll say here what I've said before about Bruckner; since all this is the case, why not go straight to the source and listen to his sacred organ and vocal music, which shows his two artistic strengths, contrapuntal mastery and a profound understanding of religion and its associated musical history, in full force?

I recently got a cd with his Te Deum and would recommend this as an introduction to anyone interested in exploring his sacred works. Written around the time of his 6th and 7th symphonies, it showcases his understanding of the early religious music within the time period of his most accomplished orchestral writing.

I'm also waiting on a purely organ rendition of his 8th symphony, might be interesting.

705
Metal / Re: Metal without drums
« on: January 06, 2012, 01:36:44 PM »
To the originator of this topic, I would say, unless you yourself are planning on making a metal album where drums are not used, then just put this entire idea on the shelf for the moment.  What I have learned from all the metal coming out in the last few years is that there is nothing wrong with the instrumentation or even styles of playing in metal, but rather that no one had anything interesting to say with it.  No one had any spirit in their music or inspiration.  It was just a massive game of stupid cross-overs.  For a while, because of these defects, I believed maybe a new genre of metal needed to to be created or a new way of making metal.

But then with all the better albums that have come out lately, I now know that the people who are making great music right now are just doing the same old things great metal bands always did, in instrumentation, playing styles and even lyrical imagery.  The missing component was spirit and quality and not origininality.  Substance before form, as is the popular saying around here.  These thoughts that I am relating are not original and you are probably seeing a lot of this kind of talk lately.

I more or less agree. And I didn't want the suggestion to sound like an artificially imposed idea on something that has evolved naturally, rather it's an already existing direction that should be more thoroughly understood and explored by upcoming musicians. Pure Holocaust certainly occured to me as well as Transylvanian Hunger and a fair amount of examples exist in early Burzum works also.

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