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Messages - aquarius

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751
Metal / Re: Lost inheritances
« on: January 06, 2012, 09:27:30 PM »
Soulside Journey gets my vote in terms of the most enduring (twisted yet logical) song structures.

Hvis lyset tar oss is also unrivalled. Filosofem has been done with little success.

Godflesh - Streetcleaner, much to be learned here in terms of ambient metal.

752
Metal / Re: Bruckner Discussion
« on: January 06, 2012, 09:12:51 PM »
The previous post pretty much sums it all up with Bruckner.

But I'll say here what I've said before about Bruckner; since all this is the case, why not go straight to the source and listen to his sacred organ and vocal music, which shows his two artistic strengths, contrapuntal mastery and a profound understanding of religion and its associated musical history, in full force?

I recently got a cd with his Te Deum and would recommend this as an introduction to anyone interested in exploring his sacred works. Written around the time of his 6th and 7th symphonies, it showcases his understanding of the early religious music within the time period of his most accomplished orchestral writing.

I'm also waiting on a purely organ rendition of his 8th symphony, might be interesting.

753
Metal / Re: Metal without drums
« on: January 06, 2012, 01:36:44 PM »
To the originator of this topic, I would say, unless you yourself are planning on making a metal album where drums are not used, then just put this entire idea on the shelf for the moment.  What I have learned from all the metal coming out in the last few years is that there is nothing wrong with the instrumentation or even styles of playing in metal, but rather that no one had anything interesting to say with it.  No one had any spirit in their music or inspiration.  It was just a massive game of stupid cross-overs.  For a while, because of these defects, I believed maybe a new genre of metal needed to to be created or a new way of making metal.

But then with all the better albums that have come out lately, I now know that the people who are making great music right now are just doing the same old things great metal bands always did, in instrumentation, playing styles and even lyrical imagery.  The missing component was spirit and quality and not origininality.  Substance before form, as is the popular saying around here.  These thoughts that I am relating are not original and you are probably seeing a lot of this kind of talk lately.

I more or less agree. And I didn't want the suggestion to sound like an artificially imposed idea on something that has evolved naturally, rather it's an already existing direction that should be more thoroughly understood and explored by upcoming musicians. Pure Holocaust certainly occured to me as well as Transylvanian Hunger and a fair amount of examples exist in early Burzum works also.

754
Metal / Re: The return of True Metal
« on: January 06, 2012, 01:02:46 PM »
The beauty of bands like bathory (Ildjarn, Profanatica and the like) is that it strips away almost ANY surface technique in favour of unleashing the raw, honest crux of the idea, there can be no mistaking whether it is true metal or not.

755
Metal / Re: Summoning make stand against fascism
« on: January 04, 2012, 12:32:54 AM »
Either would be awesome. It's about time now and a lot of bands are well overdue to release new material so it should be a great year.

756
Interzone / Re: The inversion diet
« on: January 04, 2012, 12:11:11 AM »
I only eat pure vegetaryan food and generally try to view diet as sacred. Weighing up calorie/protein/vitamin/whatever intake in some sort of mathematical equation seems to take away a lot of the basic appreciation.

757
Metal / Metal without drums
« on: December 30, 2011, 01:35:07 PM »
It is certainly an interesting concept that metal with its increased understanding and use of ambient structure could in time propel itself solely by the use of melody/counterpoint/harmony. As I see it, the main advantage of doing away with continuous drumming would be that you remove the idea of melody developing within such strict rhythmic containers, thus giving it more freedom while also requiring that greater attention be put into the initial design. i.e. melody would have to carry its own rhythmic tension and devices to achieve that would have to be utilized. It would also be possible to vary tempo within a melodic phrase, and perhaps even the art of percussion could be sparingly utilized when necessary.

758
Metal / Re: Best metal releases of 2011
« on: December 30, 2011, 01:26:35 PM »
Do any of you psychos even remember the top tier albums from five years ago?

759
Metal / Re: Song Structure in Metal
« on: December 18, 2011, 12:29:59 AM »
I think stucture depends on there being the appropriate building blocks i.e. you need good riffs to begin with that build into that structure. Great post.

760
Interzone / Re: What creeps me out about Christians
« on: December 18, 2011, 12:14:40 AM »
I've met some ultra-conservative Christians that are great people i.e. clean-living, dedicated, knowledgeable etc. One guy even understood that the world was in a state of decay and identified multiculturalism as a 'big mistake'. But when you hear them describing how they know there's a god that loves them it just sounds insane, and yet without that unquestionable faith would they uphold such a healthy life?

761
Metal / Re: Bruckner Discussion
« on: December 13, 2011, 01:17:08 PM »
I find 'getting better with age' is often the case with classical composers (and it seems to be the opposite for metal).

I've found the same thing, with some very notable historical exceptions like Schumann. Probably because metal musicians devote almost no time to developing "craft", and also because many don't see it as their profession. If you're not committed to improving your musicianship every year and working yourself like a slave, then you're likely, as in metal, to use up all your good ideas within a few years. This is a far cry from life-long professional composers like Brahms, who did counterpoint exercises when he was bored.

Something I often think about is the timeframe behind the making of genius music. i.e. is carefully designed and insightful composition a substitute for the spontaniety of energy? In terms of developing "craft", it could be argued that many metal bands actually became more technically skilled (look at Emperor or Immortal for example) and the decline was more in the purity of their vision.

My all time favourite of his works is the unfinished 9th symphony where I think he entered a new period of development yet again, it's still very cyclical but with more subtle variations in the repetition of its phrases, it also contains some of the most beautifully intense melodies/harmonies he ever wrote. By the end of the third movement I always find myself lost in deep thoughts, imagining what would have come next.

Can you recommend a good recording of this piece?

Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra conducted by Wilhelm Furtwängler in 1944 would be my pick. Furtwängler was an expert at shaping tempo around the inherent tension of the music and Bruckner's symphonies are perfectly suited to this method of interpretation.

762
Interzone / Re: Just for kicks
« on: December 10, 2011, 02:20:34 AM »
I remember drawing a picture containing a swastika in the art class (cause to a 10yro it looks pretty cool) and got hauled over hot coals for it. School is extremely toxic as I remember, full of moral-propaganda.

763
Metal / Re: Good electronic music
« on: December 10, 2011, 02:06:32 AM »
I used to listen to old stuff by Frontline Assembly, Skinny Puppy, Leaether Strip and maybe the first Nitzer Ebb. It's miles above techno but still becomes 'see-through' all too quickly.


764
Metal / Re: Bruckner Discussion
« on: December 10, 2011, 01:49:12 AM »
Actually I was lucky enough to hear some of Bruckner's choral music in performance a few months ago and yes it was very moving. On the whole I do need to explore his early organ and choral works but I tend to think this period of his artistic output is one of development, not to say it's unimportant but he really didn't start finding his voice until he wrote his 4th symphony. I find 'getting better with age' is often the case with classical composers (and it seems to be the opposite for metal).

My all time favourite of his works is the unfinished 9th symphony where I think he entered a new period of development yet again, it's still very cyclical but with more subtle variations in the repetition of its phrases, it also contains some of the most beautifully intense melodies/harmonies he ever wrote. By the end of the third movement I always find myself lost in deep thoughts, imagining what would have come next.

765
Metal / Re: Stale
« on: December 07, 2011, 01:37:10 PM »
Black Metal destroyed itself pretty horribly though.

What genre didn't? Death Metal devolved into parody and lost all its mystery. Thrash/speed castrated itself in the 90's either by doing nothing new, or becoming alt. rock/metal.

All true. But I still maintain that Black Metal did it most spectacularly. Perhaps it is because BM was, if truth be told, already dangerously close to self-parody from the beginning(I remember very well back when "A Blaze..." and the like came out the reaction from most harcore Hessians I knew was mockery - not hails and awe!!), and was the easiest to exploit by the mainstream once it began to gain notice. BM went from dangerous, dark and frightening to mall-goth clownery seemingly overnight. By the time most in America even became aware of BM, its best days were well behind it. 

These days when I attend shows and see some unpronouncable BM band of nobodies in Halloween make-up I literally cringe!  I will take mediocre, though sincere Death Metal over that all day long. Perhaps that's just my tastes though.

It is a question of spirit over technique, and this applies more to black metal than any other metal genre (consider the latest Burzum failure). Basically bands need to stop being queer. Go back to the masterworks, take something like Joined in Darkness, study every riff and the structure of each song, find out where it could grow, but above all understand its essence.

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