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Messages - fallot

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Interzone / Re: ✠
« on: December 11, 2011, 07:14:33 AM »
The doctrines of original sin combined with universal salvation are not compatible with this idea. What values or beliefs would be brought out to lessen the impact of these?

Interzone / Re: Liberalism = racism
« on: December 11, 2011, 06:53:29 AM »
Tell me something; in these topics why is the voice one of the opposite side and not an objective observer? Why is it "liberals intend this" rather than "liberals are doing this" or even better; "liberalism will lead to _____ in the near future"? If you speak of intent, surely you drive away the ones you want to reach? The motivation with many of these people is to do good, they simply do not realize what that is. To say intent is to say they have a desire for harm. Even if that is true, it is not widely understood among people who identify as leftist. Forgive me if it is not my place to say, but a "new right" needs to be new more than it needs to be right. American conservatives are pushed this way and that into convenient insanity as much as liberals, even if their vision ends up in something "stable".

Obama gave the drone to Iran!

Interzone / Re: (Sometimes) there is justice
« on: December 10, 2011, 04:40:36 PM »
Justice would have been this man reduced to selling used cars or lumber after his promotion gig washed up because no one listened to trash anymore.

Metal / Re: Summoning - Depressive as hell
« on: December 10, 2011, 11:29:57 AM »
I like the primitive methods of metal. There's room to grow towards complexity too, but it's a lesson in itself. When you take away the layers, still something remains. Lets try both; have a platform where metal spirit and technique is both discussed. That already seems to be coming together, slowly. We should definitely make kiddie attitudes shameworthy though (not with mockery, but with frank reasoned statement); some of the Sadistic reviews were excellent in that regard.

Interzone / Re: ✠
« on: December 10, 2011, 11:15:30 AM »
Culture doesn't trump religion. Religion is a part of culture. A change in cultural identity can occur with change in religion. It happened to my ancestors, and I am grateful. That is my tradition now.

Culture trumps weak religions.

Hey posting like this is pretty awesome! Cosmic realization!

Edit: Are you sure about the Hindu origin? I mean even if it is genetically true it's completely out of the consciousness of your peoples. Lost in the reaches of the past. How could it be introduced or made palatable? The Pagan ones actually persist in terms of values and symbols. Lots of people know and care about Vikings, few about Brahmins. Is there a real world example to look to here?

Metal / Re: Fuck Morbid Angel
« on: December 10, 2011, 09:46:41 AM »
Put me in the minority then, I agree with you completely. It's the logical extension of what they've been doing since then; I'd say Covenant is where it started. Less that attempts something deeper, more just for the sake of more. For new ideas instead of good ideas. It's rock 'n' roll. It's "just music".

Interzone / Re: Overman
« on: December 10, 2011, 09:37:02 AM »
Sounds too conspirational, many scientists are just scientists. The method is open, the data is open, the inferences logically made. To say it is "mostly a leftist invention" is to appear to deny actual science. I doubt this is the intent, but that's how I see it. Why this preconception? Why this value ascribed to intelligence? I don't understand. What would a society gain out of deprecating the less intelligent? Surely what you should do is to allow them to rise to their place? That would require establishing that hierarchy first, rather than just putting people down. The goal cannot simply be "have more intelligent men, the rest is magic!", but an ordered society at every level.

At some level this seems selfish to me. I may have a passable intellect, but it serves its purpose and that's it. I am inferior to a whole host of "dumber" people. I.Q. cannot be a bar, it does not show the worth of an individual. If I believe intelligence to be mostly contributory to worth (as I consider myself intelligent), then that is selfish. The informative posts are great though, disagreement notwithstanding.

Interzone / Re: Overman
« on: December 09, 2011, 09:05:07 AM »
The wealth must be spread, to a degree. The people must be content. When they are discontent, only the blind look to just one force or aspect. This is not the behaviour of kings, of the noble, but of rabble rousers and demagogues. Intelligence itself is worthless, only new knowledge, insight, is itself valuable (if empirically obtained from an objective reality). Intelligence is secondary. Important, inherent (in the individual), but secondary. Although I will agree with you here; many have given up on rising. However, perhaps that is truer for your home and not humanity in general.

Metal / Re: Fuck Morbid Angel
« on: December 08, 2011, 05:02:50 PM »
It's cool to bash Illud Divinum Insanus but I think it deserves a chance. After all, it's just the musicians doing what they wanna do. Put a record out to express themselves. They put everything inside them into this album man, and it really really shows. It may be corny, but listening to the thumping rhythm of Radikult made me want to kill a cop right there and then! I mean it's not like it's making them any money right? David explains it better than I can:

"In a recent interview with AOL's Noisecreep, MORBID ANGEL bassist/vocalist David Vincent stated about "Illud Divinum Insanus", "It's awesome, absolutely awesome . . . We made a masterpiece. I am going to call it that. There is not one bad track on this record. Of course I am going to say that, but I don't normally say such things. It is very unique and very diverse. We didn't go through the normal channels with production, so it's that's much more special because of the decisions we made."

If you really love Morbid Angel, if they've contributed anything at all to your life (they made me open my eyes in a big way), then you'll support this album with all your heart. Even if you dislike parts of it, even if it is a bit shoddy in places. If you don't support them, who will? The album sold 3600 copies in its opening week, 300 less than Heretic. I think we can all band together and really make the next one count for them. Lets vote with our pockets for more classic Death Metal!!!!!!! \m/

So no, no Fuck Morbid Angel. Let Morbid Angel Fuck You.

(I love what Sandoval has contributed to, but the man has really lost it now. Whatever spark he carried in technique or spirit is gone. I have no idea what did it, but I'm going to guess; life. The idea is commendable here, but I question the spirit. Also: lol).

Metal / Re: Understanding Metal Complexity: Visual AIDS
« on: December 08, 2011, 10:43:53 AM »
Thank you for taking the time out to do that, it serves the purpose well. I'll see what results I get with Music Animation Machine, playing around with that should be fairly amusing.

Metal / Re: Burzum - From the Depths of Darkness
« on: December 07, 2011, 11:42:30 PM »
This is not merely a defense of it, but its reality. Varg is acknowledging himself as broken, partly. This is nostalgia + bill paying, probably yeah. It's what he's capable of. It's what drives him. Hence it is what is reflected in his music. His technique has actually advanced overall (but it's a meaningless definition of technique).

It's a good justification, all things considered.

Metal / Re: Islamic Metal - An Alternative View of Traditionalism
« on: December 07, 2011, 11:31:36 PM »
I don't want to delve too much into side issues, my main thrust is related to metal music, but nevertheless: You should live what you believe and believe what you live. To hold a value is not to suspend it in thought. Action decides. If you are closer to the values of the Pagans (than those around you), but still have some that they would consider violations, then you are not a Pagan. You are a Pagan synthesis. This in itself is something though, and can be promoted. However, what is it a synthesis of? Rationality and Paganism? Christian morality and Paganism? I think these are important to understand if one has a cause. Your cause can only be what you believe. I don't claim that you have not achieved this realization, and I tread lightly because I know these are matters that evoke pride (they should).

Interzone / Re: Equality -- how can anyone believe this?
« on: December 07, 2011, 09:40:15 PM »
It can't be that difficult to establish a distinction between the purposeful toward some quality value, thus perhaps introducing something meaningful, and purposeless, which because some quality is never introduced, is effectively at best non-existence. Assigning meaning to this or that is not itself meaningless because quality and the lack thereof, as evaluations, are definite.

"It can't be that difficult" is not a rational, empirical view. You are ascribing arbitrary value. Taking something to its "logical" (subjectively!) extension is one thing, empirical observation is another. One is confirmable, the other not (even if it is reasoned, apparently "logical"). The only logic is what exists. Reason itself is bounded by reality. You can have your view, but you cannot claim its absolute ascendancy by reason in the absence of sufficient "true" knowledge. Your only real mean is violence. This is the logical extension of this view; and hence why the talk about liberalism destroying society grates on some of us I hope (the irony of it). Where is our error with regards to empiricism? Is there one? Is your point of view truly resolved through reason or through falling in love with reason?

Interzone / Re: The appeal of this place
« on: December 07, 2011, 07:08:41 PM »
A reply from religion Transcix: What you desire then, is a natural religion (strictly speaking, a "religion" that equals objective reality i.e. "nature"). However, I ask how that is to be actualized, How do you believe in something, have it inherent, and yet approach it solely from reason? The only answer can be gaining complete empirical knowledge. Yet, will you wait for scientific breakthrough for just basic order? Establish the order somehow. Can't just guess and wonder and wait. If pure empiricism is too slow, is unactionable, then it is also unrealistic.

What you wish to do, is resolve reason and human nature. This is the definition of transcendance. It is something only possible with either insane technological breakthrough (Kurzweil, who is pretty silly but at least consistent), or with the gradual change I mentioned. Is this an acceptable compromise? Are you willing to do this? I am not, but I accept that my reasons for it are partially faith based. Yet how is it resolved from your end?

Interzone / Re: Nihilism in action @ TED - 'The moral mind'
« on: December 07, 2011, 06:25:11 PM »
I agree and further submit that this is such essential truth that Haidt will find it resonating in every "tradition". By definition, tradition fits into Haidt's empirical, rational view; because the traditions that have persisted as forces obviously have something to them (whether it is objectively right/wrong, w/e). I further submit that if a particular tradition understood this very very well, it would be more objective, an ideal balance that leads to a net gain of knowledge (through continued existence guaranteed through moral safeguard + open-ness to experience). That actually leads me into a particular religion, though I accept that it need not be thus. There is a degree of faith involved still.

Still, if I believe what I believe, I must also believe in getting closer to an "objective" religion (obviously, my view is that this is already so; I mean for wide change), one entirely empirical. This fits in with the general sentiment here I think. The overall goal is the same. If my religion is true, then this is proselytization for me. Is that perspective helpful in your research? My justification?

I too meant parts of the forum. I would not insult them. My intent to cooperate with them does not allow me to. After all, deed matters.

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