As the aging and dying of both Western Civilization and heavy metal converge, more people are studying the meaning of both and trying to figure out how those of us who are not in denial can re-create and possibly exceed the greatness of the past.
Two new podcasts address this issue:
- Scale it Back hits hard against the idea that it is “gatekeeping” to demand quality in metal, since only by having quality in metal can it expand its audience:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFp_v4FWM4s
- Music and Ideas tackles the differentiating feature of metal that has it tackle questions of the soul, eternity, history, and meaning, as opposed to rock/pop which just distracts from those with the genitals:
It’s good to see more joining the quest for metal theory.
Tags: metal theory, podcast
The Music and Ideas podcast has a very dadcore vibe to it. A bunch of dads hanging out with one of their daughters lacks a certain vitality crucial to metal. Honestly, it felt like I was listening to a studio contrived sitcom. Are you trying to incorporate your kids into your interests? It seems like you might be going through a Brian Posehn thing.
“A bunch of dads”-lol
bigger LOL: acting as if that is a bad thing
kids who act like they own music, especially music that was developed in the late 70’s and into the 80″s
are precious.
I am an old fuck-early 50’s-and I was there at the beginning of what is now called “extreme” music.
My generation listened, tape-traded and created so much of this. To basically say that metal is just for the young, to the people who created it, is asinine.
Now I don’t know this podcast, nor the people who host it. Don’t know how old they are.
But I have seen this too often-this whole “ageism” thing. Now my parents, they listened to Sonny and Cher, Charlie Pride, etc. They wouldn’t know Judas Priest from Judas Iscariot. I get pointing out previous generations really don’t understand the “vibe” or “mentality” of metal.
But anyone born from 65-80 has an understanding of this music. And I am proud that my 19 yo daughter has picked up the mantle and listens to everything from Bathory to Iron Maiden. That she can listen to Grieg and still appreciate Dokken (laugh if you will, but later Dokken, in many ways, is heavier than most bands passing for metal these days)is brilliant. Fathers teaching their kids about music is fundamental to the future of it, whether it’s Howlin’ Wolf or War Atrocities.
So getting older sucks in many ways, but the spirit and the music never needs to get old.
You will get there. We all do. If we’re lucky that is
(nods in memory of Wes Weaver, Mike Scaccia, Bruce Corbitt, L.G. Petrov, and others we have lost recently)
but Chuck Schuldiner died of AIDS
when Baloff, Quorthon and Ain died…
had this feeling that many of the originators were not hitting their 50’s
As much as it’s cheesy, I do love Kreator’s “Fallen Brother” vid (hate their politics. Same for Tom G social justice Warrior. If it were not for my undying love of Hellhammer and “Morbid Tales”, his existence would be meaningless to me)
There are many young people who respect the past of all this music, whether it’s DM or BM, Doom, Thrash, Power, etc.
I know that, and I dig those kids. Keep it going.
It’s the ones that act like there really is something “new under the sun” and that what’s current is what’s “best”
(conversely, there is much crap from the “old days”, just ask Fenriz. He has stayed relevant trying to sell bad, irrelevant bands from the 80’s to kids enamored with him and anything, ANYTHING retro).
“In my day”…. we couldn’t actually type in a genre and find something we wanted to listen to or be apart of.
Had to dig. Had to read. Had to tape trade. Had to care.
We all have it easy now. The idiot box part 2.
Sorry, cranky old white dude lamenting.
Nothing wrong with “dad humor” to contrast with the 4chan trolling.
That might have been true before the brain damage induced by all the THC/MDMA/alcohol/recurring strokes/autoerotic asphyxiation/consuming mindless navel-gazing drivel on the internet… you get the picture.
“bigger LOL: acting as if that is a bad thing”
It’s not a bad thing to be a parent and nothing about what I wrote gives any indication that this is my position. Quite the contrary, I’m very much pro-family and derive great satisfaction from seeing healthy, reasonably content families. The bad thing is trying to give a Steven Keaton spin to metal. It’s corny and reeks of bogus sentimentality.
“I am an old fuck-early 50’s”
You’re not an “old fuck” if you’re in your early fifties. If you’ve taken care of yourself and live a life in tune with the creation, you may be in better shape than a lot of men in their twenties.
“But I have seen this too often-this whole “ageism” thing.”
Not my angle.
“But anyone born from 65-80 has an understanding of this music.”
Glad to know you think I understand what I’m writing about.
“And I am proud that my 19 yo daughter has picked up the mantle and listens to everything from Bathory to Iron Maiden.”
It’s cool your daughter appreciates your music. However, that’s not what my reply was driving at. Metallica, Slayer, Bathory, Celtic Frost, Possessed, Death, Darkthrone, and Immortal all appreciated and respected the musicians that came before them; but they took those influences and created something NEW that reflected the spirit of THEIR generation. This is the fundamental distinction between my generation and the subsequent ones. Picking up the mantle is fine, just don’t leave it exactly where you found it.
“(laugh if you will, but later Dokken, in many ways, is heavier than most bands passing for metal these days)”
Not laughing at all as I am quite fond of some of Dokken’s material. I own three of their albums (Tooth and Nail, Under Lock and Key, and Back for the Attack) and find George Lynch’s guitar work to be nothing short of excellent.
“You will get there. We all do. If we’re lucky that is”
Hopefully; take care and be well sir.
When Heaven Comes Down !
Gatekeeping is a good thing. Metal would be better off without the likes of Anthony Fantano and Metal Archives SJWs
Scale it Back channel is cool. He knows his stuff and he’s already triggering the hell out of people. Good man.
Just watched one, and read comments.
One guy has such a hard on about musical theory. Kept hassling in comments
It’s wonderful knowledge, don’t get me wrong. But it’s not the “be all, end all” of music.
Some of the most talented musicians I have ever met were self taught with little to no musical theory.
It comes across as pretentious as hell to keep harping on it like that “Jeff” dude does.
He probably spends 16 hours a day, in his room, mom taking care of him-learning all this musical theory.
To what end? So he can spend his day arguing about it on youtube? What is his end goal?
That’s what I love about musicians, especially jazz and metal, they all think it really matters in the end. Unless you’re playing with a philharmonic somewhere, it really doesn’t.
No one cares. Hell, Malmsteen didn’t have any training, and he was thought of as a god.
Where did that get him?
“Hell, Malmsteen didn’t have any training, and he was thought of as a god. Where did that get him?”
It got him to be a multi-millionaire musician who’s also a husband and father with a home that spans one WHOLE city block in one of the most coveted cities in the world. Not too bad compared to a lot of his cohort and the population at large.
I read over your previous responses to me. I appreciate your respectfulness in you reply.
To one point, you said those bands created something new. Did they really?
I think they took those influences and made them their own-but making something new? No.
Music is one of the greatest examples of re-inventing the wheel. It’s all been done.
If your making a stew, and you use your grandma’s recipe, but add some things that you found from the internet, cook and eat it. It’s great-yummy. It’s your stew now, no doubt. But it’s still just a stew, not a rotisserie chicken or anything. You just borrowed. That’s not innovative, that is creative. Stew has been around forever and you will never completely create anything from it other than a stew. That’s music. That’s all it is. A stew.
Those bands you mentioned were all creative, not innovative. And the bands that have stolen from them are just being creative. I agree that too much copying shows no creativity. So maybe we are saying something similar just coming at it from different points?
I don’t mean to be disagreeable but where did you find the info that Malmsteen was a multi-millionare?
Off the net? I find that highly unlikely. He certainly could have come from a wealthy background-family.
But he certainly did not make millions from his recording career. Perhaps endorsements he made a nice chunk back in the 80’s. But virtually no one in the 80’s bought his records outside of the “Guitar Player” mag crowd. I’d say if you asked your typical metal fan of the 80’s if they even knew who he was, 1 out of 10,000. might know. Hell, Venom had more popularity and they tried to pass off they were rich rockstars-but even Cronos admits they never made any realm money from Venom.
And for the rest, that is a positive thing. I am happy he achieved that-family is important.
But that’s not the context I was referring to him in. Maybe it’s hip nostalgia and kids think he is cool now-don’t know.
But in reality, he is a minor footnote, if that, in metal history. For all his virtuoso ability-(self taught I believe-admirable) he is just that. That was my point