Interview: Nuclear Cath (Leather N’ Spikes)

June 22, 2012 –
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I laughed when I saw the editor of Leather N’ Spikes magazine described somewhere as “metal hottie Nuklear Cath.” She’s a lot more than that: she runs one of the magazines which meets metal ideal in spirit and aesthetic, which idolizes the stuff with potential and doesn’t notice the bands that normal people seem to like. Those people who can’t step outside of their own heads and into the world of metal which supercedes the norm will hate it, but to the rest of us it’s a form of journalism unique to metal itself. After a busy day of piling up the corpses of her victims near a temporarily memorial area, Nuklear Cath was good enough to grant us an interview on the eve of the launch of the new Leather’n’Spikes website.

When you reference the container “metal music” in your head, do you think first of a concept or of sounds?

It’s a hard question, I would say it is in a way a concept, it’s about something, the subjects are always related to the same things, which makes what metal music is. Or each band has its own concept within the metal concept?!

Your zine has been long known for its amazing picture layouts.How do you research the visual components to articles?

My goal is always to translate the band’s music into something visual. So I try to respect styles. If a band uses certain fonts in their booklets and promotion, I will use them to layout the interview. Same for the pictures, the kind of drawings, the kind of atmosphere (the band can be extremely serious or sarcastic, into pagan subjects and nature or into nuclear war). So I try to respect the whole concept on each band featured.

How long have you been listening to metal? What did you enjoy hearing before that? Is this a consequence of musical education (self and/or formal) or a process that converged on that growth as well?

There have always been music in the house, I was not a fan of anything but I was initiated to music (rock, mainly) and slowly I started to search for a genre that would suit my endless need for heavy music. It ended up being metal, and then I “studied” the 20 years of metal that had passed before me. I might have been born too late, but I’ve done my homework!

In many ways, your writing appears to obliterate the line between ideology and lifestyle by suggesting a viewpoint where life takes on artlike, and nihilistic, qualities. What enabled you to reach such a view, if it is at all correct?

I didn’t “reach” that view I think, it’s just how I am, or maybe the one idea of an old pile of rare metal vinyls, tenth generation tapes, jean jackets with patches, empty beer bottles on the dirty floor of a rehearsal room and loud music simply leads us to that point. But it isn’t completely nihilistic, or then what would it give for me to do all this, to make that fanzine, to write letters, to spread flyers, it would be pointless. I give myself goals and challenges.

What do you think of the writings of Antonin Artaud? Georges Bataille? Theodor Adorno? Friedrich Nietzsche? Jacques Lyotard?

If this is about philosophy, I don’t read a lot, I don’t take the time to do it. One of my favorite, if not my favorite philosopher remains Nietzsche. The rest you named I haven’t studied.

What do you think is the conceptual link between death and art in the symbolic vocabulary of humanity, even subconscious thoughts?

Maybe both are mysteries. Or they provoke the same kind of fascination. Or they are both abstract things, or concepts in themselves. Or both can provoke the same deep feelings, either of fear, terror, panic or pleasure in a way. Or maybe death is a form of art, expressed with the body and usually not voluntarily. It’s hard to tell what push people to link those two things.

Are you aware of any circumstances under which humans reach a state of free and autonomous thought? Does this occur to all, or to some?

Maybe in their dreams, or when they create. I think both can be related together: you try to reach a certain state where you a free from all the other people’s influences and judgment and you create without any boundaries, moral limitations. Freedom in inspiration and creativity. That’s all I can see right now.

The visual constructions used to anchor the layout of each page in the zine is eccentric and striking. When you conceive of a page, do your thoughts begin with symbols or a shape filling a space?

I never really stopped and thought about that. I think I always already have a very clear idea on how the pages will be, how big the logo will be, what graphics I will use and what kind of feeling it will have. I just then reproduce what I have in mind.

Periodically the zine features a photo involving yourself and bare flesh that causes blood pressure increases across the globe. Do you see sexuality as a tool, for war or art, or do you have a depoliticized view of sexual iconography?

Yeah, maybe sex is art. Unfortunately too many people took advantage of it, so I got bored. But I do use myself for ‘artistic purposes’ and experimentation / creation, in photography for example, or experimental movies. As for blood pressure increases, it’s their problem, hehehe…

When you interview bands, how do you mentally prepare for the interaction?

I think it’s part of the game to expect surprises, violent reactions, insults, totally different answers that I had expected, or yes, sometimes deceptions. That’s the thrill – you work hard on researching on the band and trying to make your questions in the most original way possible, and you wait to see what kind of answers and ideas they will bring up! That’s why all the interviews are different and interesting; people put their personality in them! My concept of the interview is to do like if I was meeting the band in person, in the world of their music (even if it’s snail mail interview). Some bands embarked in the game, it was really cool.

What publications do you read, metal or other?

I like underground extreme metal fanzines, I also read a few comic books because I’m working on one, and I read mags and books related to my work (graphic design, illustration or desing in general). Almost no novels or anything like that, no time anymore.

Which do you consider to be the most important bands from Canada at this time? And Québec, over the history of metal?

OK from Québec I would say Voivod, Soothsayer, Yog-Sothot, Vensor… I should have mentioned brutal death metal bands, but it has been too exploited here. From Canada – Blasphemy, Voor, Infernal Majesty, Slaughter, Razor, Disciples of Power and maybe a few more I can’t think of at this moment!

Some characterize the metal movement “as a whole” in terms that describe its cathartic nature for angry youth, while others see it as a revolution against the social for youth who later, metalhead or no, carry these ideas into society. Still others see metal as an endorsement for hedonism, relativism and a good time. Among these how does your own judgment fall?

Well I tend to only think for myself and not analyzing the impact on the society and how it is perceived by it. So it’s hard to tell. Sometimes a metal genre will start as a rebellion but then go into an independent genre not fighting anymore for a cause but just producing music. Music can be done just for a specific purpose – fighting against a religion, a race, a trend – and then end up giving birth to bands who aren’t fighting but simply being influenced by the musical side.

If you could interview any musician in history, who would it be?

Lemmy! But I wouldn’t know what to say.

Can you list five bands that you feel contributed the most to black metal as an evolving genre?

Well the first that come to mind is (old) Mayhem. Also Venom with all their satanic imagery, Bathory, Hellhammer and… well Sarcofago, Blasphemy, Beherit, aarrgh it’s going over five…

“Image” has a bad name to many in the underground, yet visual presentation of concept is an important piece to any communication. What are your views on this?

There are contradictions in this scene and I think that’s why in the first place metal became sportsuits, short hair, baggy pants and white socks and that’s why a guy like Euronymous got sick of that and tried to get back the real metal look – spikes, patches, leather, long hair, black band tshirts etc… It is important to have a metal image, but the contradiction is in the fact that ‘poseurs’ (whoever you consider them to be) will try to look the most metal possible – so then image is more important than their dedication. Same for corpsepaint, it’s starting to be too much revisited, without any meaning anymore. So what I say is, the dedication comes first but the image should have a certain importance as well, as long as there is a reason remaining behind that.

You manage to extract the ironic humor underlying many of even the most extreme human outlooks. Do you see this humor as inherent characteristic to the process of self-actualization?

I just think that there is a kind of humor that have its place in this nuclear metal scene – and it’s sarcasm, black humor. The result is sometimes violent reactions, or people don’t understand, or they take themselves so seriously that even the smallest smile is forbidden.

Many of us consider Texas to be a separate nation from the Judeo Christian States of America (JCSA). Do you consider Québec a separate country from Canada as a whole? What does America appear to be, from your national and political perspective?

Yes Québec is a completely different country, another world. I don’t feel being part of Canada too much, just like most of the people here. 2 languages = 2 cultures, 2 ways of thinking, 2 different people. America? That is from the Southern countries to the North Pole right? If you were talking about USA, well I think this country is taking too much place here and in the world unfortunately.

What is your ideal solution to human overpopulation?

Hehehe I don’t know, or else I don’t dare saying it.

Hypothetically, you are given a corporation to run with funding from an alien government to initiate world destruction plans. How would you approach this real world scenario?

Well I would approach it in a highly creative way. No problems for the funds, right? Well then let’s have fun. I’m working on a comic book with a story a little bit related to that, so all I’ll do is re-create the devastated landscapes and junkie people of my story, and then draw them as models for my comic book. And maybe make a movie. Ah, my own story come true, what an honor!

Some define art as the end product, others define it as the communicative process between artist and audience. Which do you think is closer to the truth?

And if there is no truth in this world? My own truth is, art is like alchemy. You work on it very hard, and your skills get developed, but you evolve as well besides that, in your mind, as a person. Whatever people might think, even though they don’t like what you do, you know that what you do is ok, and people being shocked by your art might be a good sign.

Are you of any mystical belief?

You mean occultism, satanism and things like that? Yes, I do have my own thoughts about it.

If so, does your mystical belief involve entities and processes beyond this world, or within it?

I don’t really know. It’s something very complicated.

What importance do you place upon the conceptual process in the artist before making work, including ideological, mystical and philosophical beliefs? (when I say philosophical here, I mean the existential and valuative processes of cognition)

The artist puts himself into his art, even though he might be trying not to. His art is his blood. So it reflects his mind, personal thoughts and beliefs. It is nothing objective. Someone looking at the artwork of an artist will therefore look into this artist’s mind and personal life.

If going into combat under idealized circumstances, from which era would your weapons come? (are you a medievalist, or a modernist? regarding weaponry)

I’m not as fascinated as some people I know, but it seems war and battle was an art in the ancient times. The weapons of those eras – dark age and medieval – are definitely nice pieces of art, and the honor and the idea of dedicating your life to war is quite different from today’s red-button pushing countries. Fighting man to man, with or even without weapons, in honor, is something that seemed quite more appealing. And the different weapons, some sacred, with runes carved, some unique and rare, forged by those people themselves…

Are there any generalized opinions you have of metal journalism, and where other zines differ from Leather N’ Spikes?

We all have our own ways of making a fanzine. I might think that my ways are the best, criticizing others for doing this and not doing that, but anyway that makes a diversity in the fanzine world; but the editor needs to be serious and dedicated, and to make ‘information’ is first priority.

If you had to pick a metaphor for the individual in modern society, would you choose “the castaway” or “the fortuneteller” – and why? Do you see the individual as important, philosophically or politically, and what is your opinion of democracy?

It’s a tough question. I don’t know if ‘the individual’ is important, it should unless it starts building McDonald’s and churches and gives away Pepsi bottles and make propaganda for the arrival of Jesus or something. In general the individual should have the right to say what he wants to say but some people often should shut up. As for the metaphor, hard to tell. I don’t really think about it.

Is cruelty essential to humanity?

I think people tend to deny that side of their being, I don’t know if it is essential but it is remaining there as a manifestation of what we are – not always cruel but every once in a while (or more for certain people!) with a tendency to that.

Leather N’ Spikes has garnered praise from across the underground. Do you consider metal to be a “sub-culture” to mainstream or “alternative” or “counter-” culture?

A counter-culture is against the mainstream I guess, so it should be called this way I think. But there are some bands playing a trendy style or an ordinary style but they don’t have any success so they remain “underground” – as they aren’t against the mainstream I would not put them in the counter-culture category at all.

Most people deny that they are beasts. Is this really true?

I would say yes, they deny their own human nature of being animals and having instincts and an animal nature, which includes other animals as daily food, sex, violence and certain primitive instincts etc. A nice example of something against the human nature is catholicism.

How do you, as every thinking individual must, conceptualize your own death?

I kind of saw it when I was younger and it was terrible, so I’m trying to avoid that kind of death. Now I just don’t think about how I will die, but how I want to live instead.

Some thinkers reduce philosophy to a conflict between the eschatological and the existential. Is this logical, in your opinion, and if so, on which side does your greatest sympathy stand?

Philosophy, just like politics, is not something I care for as much as I care for art, for example. There are people that are better than me for this.

If I left anything out, or there is something of useful clarification you wish to state, please say what is needed here.

OK well back to the zine, I just re-designed the whole website (with a huge art section, excerpts, reviews etc!!) which should be online by the end of August. It will be announced on my old website, see address below. Around the same time, issue #7 will be out with Blasphemy, Summoning, Desaster, Destruction, Crucifier, Grand Belial’s Key, Canadian Assault zine, Goatvomit, Abominator, Canadian scene report 1982-1993, etc. Write for prices, info, wholesale prices etc!!
Still available are #4 (4$US), #5 (4$US) and #6 (5$US), check out the contents and excerpts of each issue on the website.s
Ask for the wholesale prices and don’t hesitate to write or send promos!!

Catherine Lachance
35 Brousseau
Loretteville QC
G2A 2R2 CANADA
catherinel@globetrotter.net

So monstrous a mode of valuation stands inscribed in the history of mankind not as an exception and curiosity, but as one of the most widespread and enduring of all phenomena. Read from a distant star, the majuscule script of our earthly existence would perhaps lead to the conclusions that the earth was the distinctively ascetic planet, a nook of disgruntled, arrogant, and offensive creatures filled with a profound disgust at themselves, the earth, at all life, who inflict as much pain on themselves as they possbily can out of pleasure in inflicting pain — which is probably their only pleasure.

– F.W. Nietzsche, Genealogy of Morals

Interview: Jon Konrath (writer)

June 17, 2012 –
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What does it mean for you, to be a writer? Do you consider yourself in this position?

It’s a tough call – I mean, I put the profession of writer on my tax return, and that’s what I do for a living. But I think a lot of people expect a writer to be something different, some kind of Stephen King character, or a celebrity that publishes millions of books and appears on Charlie Rose and stuff. I’m far from that, because I really avoid the classes and readings and events – I’m not interested in the business of publishing or books, and I find most writers to be far too aggressive and egotistical. Most of my coworkers don’t even know that I write books. My parents don’t even know I write books. Writing in this day and age is considered strange, but I see it as a necessary evil.

What has been different about writing your second book than the writing of the first?

Summer Rain, my first book, was very linear. It was based on reality, and it followed an outline that I carefully managed. There were things that completely didn’t happen, but much of it could have occured during your typical summer on campus in 1992.

Rumored to Exist, on the other hand, is completely random. It’s the literary equivalent of Kentucky Fried Movie, a bunch of pieces put together to form feeling, terror and energy rather than emotion. It involves a lot more research, reading stuff to get ideas for bits and pieces. And a lot more stuff comes to me spontaneously, and ends up on scraps of paper and backs of envelopes before it is developed further. It’s not about character development and fleshing out a huge outline like Summer Rain. It’s a lot more the way I like to write, and it’s closer to my voice. But it’s much harder to do. The two are very different.

Both of your books have been print-on-demand, and you’ve been doing web-based writing for over a decade. Do you use these technologies to avoid conventional publishers, or do they have other advantages?

iUniverse and print-on-demand happened at the perfect time, just as I finished a draft of Summer Rain and really wanted to print a few hundred copies for fans and maybe to sell online. I looked at printing companies that could do 500 or 1000 books for several thousand dollars, and didn’t have any way to put that much into a book. And I was certain publishers weren’t going to even answer my mail if I sent them a thousand-page coming-of-age tale set in Indiana. Then I found iUniverse, and within six months, had this first novel sitting on my shelf and sitting on Amazon and other stores ready for purchase.

PoD is really analogous to the web’s model of letting anyone publish. When I first did zines online, I was able to avoid dealing with jerkoffs at Hit Parader or Metal Edge and write my own reviews for anyone to see. Later, I wrote fiction, and did a literary zine called Air in the Paragraph Line without dealing with any of the pretentious people that usually run small literary journals. Print-on-demand let me take the same style of writing and move it to paper without dealing with the logistical problems of storing a bunch of paper copies, going to the post office every day, cashing rubber checks for $3, and so on.

With Rumored, the decision for iUniverse was a tough one, because I really wanted to find a publisher. But I know a lot of former publishers here in New York that are begging for spare change, and nobody’s doing anything adventurous now that the entire economy is collapsing. And I didn’t want to deal with a bunch of agents or publishers that would look down their nose at a book that advocated sex with sheep and spends page after page talking about the Satanic anti-Christian holocaust or whatever. Also, I just wanted it DONE, and in paper. So it’s out now, and I’m sure it will sell less copies, but it’s out and I didn’t have to deal with anybody to print it.

Do you do any graphical or layout design besides what’s on the book? if so, which do you think will be more important as a stressed aspect of any new design, during the next two decades: perspective, color contrast, impact fonts or religious icons?

I do a limited amount of web page work, and I do some layout stuff for my day job, but it’s not my specialty. I’ve also been experimenting with some fake porn stuff lately, putting people’s heads on naked people’s bodies – I think this is one of the most underrated art forms out there.

I think perspective has the most subliminal impact on any layout, at least the ratio of everything in the layout. The golden ratio has always been a strange constant in nature and in classic art, and it’s amazing that you can still see it in most modern movies. I had an old roommate doing a thesis on the films of Stanley Kubrick and the use of the golden number in how he framed his shots and arranged some stuff during editing. I thought it was total bullshit, and then he brought me to The Shining in a big-screen movie theatre, and every fucking shot was perfectly framed that way. I did a lot of reading about film a few years back and I realized that every aspect of film editing has to do with this – make a plane come into a shot one way and it’s beautiful, but the other way is threatening. I think the way people are drawn to a web page, to a subway ad – it’s the biggest aspect of anything.

Color contrast – that’s a fad. In a few years, it will be something else. My mom used to be an interior decorator, and used to go to these big conventions and they would basically say “this will be the next color”. One year, she came home and told us that small appliances and electronics would be coming out in pastel colors, and I thought she was smoking crack. Next Christmas, every store was selling pink jamboxes and baby blue telephones. Much later, we had the iMac and all of the clear plastic, clear color stuff. Who knows what will be next.

It’s weird that you say religious icons, because I don’t see them in ads much, but then think of what icons have replaced religious ones in our culture: Coca-Cola, Microsoft, AOL, Britney Spears, MTV. You see Pepsi billboards more than you’d see large crosses in towns a hundred years ago. The Nike swoosh is probably more recognizable than the crucifix. And there are billboards with just that swoosh. Not a picture of the shoe, not a description of how much it costs or what its value is over other shoes. Just the fucking swoosh, and maybe a slogan that sounds more like a self-help mantra. I’ve never created any layout that has to do with that, but seeing as I spend a lot of time on the subway, I see it constantly.

When you describe the writing of Summer Rain, is this close to the William S Burroughs cutup technique, or that of oral literature? How similar do you suppose this process is to the means by which death metal bands compose technical masterpieces by collecting riffs and shaping them recombinantly into narrative?

It’s funny you should mention that, because I’ve been talking to Ray Miller (creator of Metal Curse zine and the death metal band Adversary) about how he should start writing a book. He worked for years in an indie record store, and every shift there was some strange, weird story. It could be like that book High Fidelity, but much more underground or strange. And in talking to him about how to get started, I mentioned the analogy of a death metal band creating an album. Instead of starting at page one and telling the story, sometimes it’s helpful to write these “riffs” and collect them, and later put them in place, like how you’d write songs. Rumored to Exist happened very much like that. So did Summer Rain, but it’s much less apparent because it’s a linear story. Rumored prospered from this lack of concentration on my part. It also made things much more difficult to edit.

And from what I’ve heard, that’s how Burroughs got Naked Lunch together, as opposed to the Kerouac straight-narrative, typing on rolls of paper approach, which would drive me nuts.

Do you find that being a writer makes you more prone to socialize, or more paranoid?

I wouldn’t say I’m paranoid, but I’m not a social diva, either. I’ve generally kept to myself, partially because I spend a lot of my time chained to the computer, but also because there aren’t many social outlets for writers that aren’t swimming with writers that have severe ego problems. I don’t like classes or workshops because I usually end up getting in fistfights with diva writers who think they are the next Michael Crichton or something. That said, New York is a decent place to be as a writer, especially if you work the corporate office environment. I know a lot of people who are aspiring actors, or long-time musicians, or occasional standup comedians, or wannabe screenwriters, or part-time directors, or something. So there can sometimes be some support from these people, so that’s cool. But most of the time, I socialize and don’t talk about the book, because I don’t want to be like those Amway people, always trying to push their product on everyone.

When you sit down to write, do you have an outline in front of you or in your head? how much of your work is improvisational? how many times do you edit and, what intoxicants are required to begin the editing process?

It depends on the book, of course. My first one, Summer Rain, was very outlined and regimented – I had to plan out with a calendar what would happen and I vaguely followed what really happened to me that year. But Rumored was more like playing with legos, because of the nonlinear format. At first, I simply wrote bits and pieces that gelled into segments. Later, I had a lot of trouble balancing this out – some things were a line long, others were the size of a short story. So I had to do a certain amount of planning on paper to balance things, move things around, and give the whole thing a feeling of continuity.

Most of Rumored was born from ideas I’d get anywhere – while in the shower, while reading a book, a web page, watching a movie. I wrote ideas, phrases, bits of dialog on scraps of paper, notepads, spiral notebooks, and in a slush file in emacs. Bits and pieces got moved around, and improv had a large amount to do with how to place those ideas and actually turn them into readable pieces of text. My best writing was when an idea came to mind and had enough inertia to pull out a very energetic piece without much thought. When I had a good night, it was much more like channeling than actual writing.

Of course, this left a very fucked up and uneven manuscript that required a lot of editing. And edits actually rewrote the entire book several times over. There were seven major versions of the book, with each one comprising of sometimes more than a dozen paper edits. Even with this, I know there are still mistakes in there. But the other problem with a book like this is that it’s hard to say when it’s done. I can’t just say, “the good guy beat the bad guy and got the princess, so I guess it’s done.” It took a lot of work just to put the fucking thing down and concede that it wouldn’t get any better.

As far as substances, the drug for this trip was caffiene, with some ephedrine thrown in for good measure. Anything else would slow me down or change the tone. I still don’t see how Bukowski or Hemingway or whoever could load up on booze and write. And I’m not into any other drugs. I even quit caffeiene during the final editing of the book, and it made the work in the last stretch twice as hard.

Who are your favorite postmodern writers?

I’ve always thought the phrase “postmodern” was too vague and gimmicky in categorizing writers, kindof like how “open standard” in the computer world doesn’t really describe anything. But I guess Mark Leyner would be at the top of the heap, and Raymond Federman. I’ve read a lot of Burroughs, although I like the story of his life more than I like his actual work. Naked Lunch is a landmark book, but I’d rather read interviews with WSB where he’s rambling on about Mayans and Yage and Control and everything else. His theories are incredible, and I wish I could live a life a percent as interesting as his.

Do you believe that postmodernism – the concept of linear rationality being dead and supplanted with the world of subconscious imagery – in literature has place, or is merely a deviation soon to be forgotten by history?

I think it has more of a place than people realize, now that everyone’s using the web, and that’s the biggest mess of nonlinear shit out there. It’s only a matter of time before people write good nonlinear books of pieces of imagery cataloged by link instead of linear pages, and people will be able to parse it perfectly. I don’t think that the human mind thinks in a straghtforward way, and it’s just a limitation of technology that presents literature in a straightforward way. If they ever start injecting works of art into peoples’ brains like a drug, the linear story will be the one that is forgotten by history.

Some people claim to remember stories and ideas visually, like William Gibson’s concept of cyberspace, but others describe a non- linear structural memory. Is this because events, actions, objects have internal mechanisms that describe their function in a unified external reality, or because of our tendency to associate ideas with other ideas for the purposes of contexting?

The original concept of Rumored to Exist was that each section would be a part of a person’s brain or memory, and at that time, I did a lot of reading and research on human memory to see if this was true or if I was just making it up. And human memory isn’t linear, it is organized chronologically or in neat pieces like an MP3 library or something. It’s easy to see when you look at stroke victims, and how they selectively remember things, but because other organic parts of their brain were destroyed, other parts are gone. So after a stroke, you might not remember how to speak, or butter a piece of bread, or operate a microwave oven. And it’s sometimes possible for these people to re-learn these skills using free memory in other parts of the brain. That makes me think the mind is more like a hard drive with a bunch of loose inodes and a file allocation table, and the importance or relevance of different things determines how well that information is kept. That’s why you can’t remember the songs a band played at a show, but you remember the way the beer tasted.

To answer your question, I think this is a feature and limitation of our organic brain. I think the way we group disparate parts and pieces of our external reality into events and stories and nightmares and memories is how the software works for this hardware.

But it was a particularly unlucky star for the Italian painters of genius in the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries that, in the narrow sphere to which they were arbitrarily referred for the choice of subjects, they had to resort to miserable wretches of every kind. For the New Testament, as regards its historical part, is almost more unfavourable to painting than is the Old, and the subsequent history of martyrs and doctors of the Church is a very unfortunate subject. Yet we have to distinguish very carefully between those pictures whose subject is the historical or mythological one of Judaism and Christianity, and those in which the real, i.e., the ethical, spirit of Christianity is revealed for perception by the presentation of persons full of this spirit. These presentations are in fact the highest and most admirable achievements of the art of painting, and only the greatest masters of this art succeeded in producing them, in particular Raphael and Correggio, the latter especially in his earlier pictures. Paintings of this kind are really not to be numbered among the historical, for often they do not depict any event or action, but are mere groups of saints with the Saviour himself, often still as a child with his mother, angels, and so on. In their countenances, especially in their eyes, we see the expression, the reflection, of the most perfect knowledge, that knowledge namely which is not directed to particular things, but which has fully grasped the Ideas, and hence the whole inner nature of the world and of life. This knowledge in them, reacting on the will, does not, like that other knowledge, furnish motives for the will, but on the contrary has become a quieter of all willing. From this has resulted perfect resignation, which is the innermost spirit of Christianity as of Indian wisdom, the giving up of all willing, turning back, abolition of the will and with it of the whole inner being of this world, and hence salvation. Therefore, those eternally praiseworthy masters of art expressed the highest wisdom perceptibly in their works. Here is the summit of all art that has followed the will in its adequate objectivity, namely in the Ideas, through all the grades, from the lowest where it is affected, and its nature is unfolded, by causes, then where it is similarly affected by stimuli, and finally by motives. And now art ends by presenting the free self-abolition of the will through the one great quieter that dawns on it from the most perfect keowledge of its own nature.

– Arthur Schopenhauer, The World as Will and Representation

If there is an afterlife, what do you think it would be?

I don’t think there is an afterlife, so I try not to speculate about it. I think the afterlife is the carrot on a stick that leads the religious to do really stupid things and waste their lives. People should stop thinking they are one of the chosen few that will go on to a better place and actually do something with their lives that will make this world a better place.

Are you following the growing penetration of drugs into American society? From where do you think this originates? What is the significance of drugs – altered perception – in the time after perception was considered inherently faulty?

Let me hijack this question and answer it in a different order. First, drugs are omnipresent in American society because any highly industrialized nation doesn’t utilize its population efficiently. Back in the old days, people spent all of their cycles hunting game, planting gardens, making quilts, raising babies, building log cabins, and tending fires because they had to, to survive. There wasn’t much leisure time, and it was used by religion. There was little free will – you either hauled water from the well a mile away, or you died. Humanity doesn’t always have things easy now, but it’s not hard to get an easy job at McDonalds or a factory, pay your rent, never break a sweat, and have 128 of your 168 hours a week free to your own devices.

Now some people use that time in a cool way. They go to school, they create cool web pages, they climb mountains, they work on their car. But many people don’t know what to do with their time. They feel a need to belong, this tribal instinct. They watch sports, they drink beer, they become xenophobic, they develop ulcers, they try to keep up with the Jonses. Most of the ailments of the late 20th century have to do with people who have too much free time on their hands, from corporate corruption to gangs to religion. This isn’t a new theory; even though he is legally considered criminally insane, this is the logic the Unabomber was laying down.

Okay, so you have this straight man’s culture, where you’re expected to buy into the white picket fence thing, and have kids, and buy a sports utility vehicle and play golf. And more and more people think this is a crock of shit. And they get high. They find out that controlled substances make them forget about this void in life. And it might even make then enter a new subculture with other stoners, where these rules don’t exist.

I’m not a drug user, except for the occasional beer with friends, so I don’t know if I really buy either side of it. I’m not the kind of person to hang onto either extreme and consider it right, so I’d rather sit in the middle, or not even participate. I write about drugs a lot, though, because this culture interests me. It’s something that hasn’t been touched in a creative way, something to be explored.

I thought Naked Lunch was pretty creative, but the reams of drug fiction following were mostly social irresponsibility pornography. If you were going to write with drugs as your topic, what might you create?

I think the best way to write about drugs would be to have them an integral part of the story, but not be in the forefront. Drugs are just a chemical; any real story is about humanity, and any compelling story about drugs would have to describe the human condition in a compelling way. Drugs are usually used in a plotline as an evil, or an excuse. Like, a guy robs a bank because he’s on drugs. Occasionally, someone writes about drugs as a catalyst, a conduit to action, like in most crime films where mobsters have a shitload of cocaine and that temporarly reverses things so they are on the heavy side of the law, and there’s no way the cops could win. Think about movies like The French Connection, where these guys with a fuckload of heroin were above the law. That’s about as far as most books and movies really go with it.

I think Hunter S. Thompson did some great work beyond Burroughs in this area, but I also think if he wasn’t taking a drug store full of junk when he was in Las Vegas, he would have written a book just as entertaining as Fear and Loathing. But it’s a book about excesses, and the writing and the search for humanity is what makes it for me.

Do you see writing in this time period as democratic, or elitist?

It’s probably more elitist. Most writing in this country is actually the production of “media” by “media figures” who are pop stars known for their name instead of their craft. It’s nice that technologies like Print on Demand and the Internet are making it easier for anyone with skill to create art, but I don’t see much of a community surrounding this. I’m hoping we’re at a crossroads where the truly intelligent will realize that writing for fame and fortune is futile, and it’s better to write for yourself and put it out there, even if only a dozen people see it on the web or in a zine or whatever. And then those intelligent will congeal and find each others’ work and form an unstoppable movement of real work, rather than the imitation writing that marketers present to us in book stores.

This seems to be the same problem faced by aging death metal bands however. At some point, having a day job to write books or death metal music reviews all night becomes tedious, and one wishes to be supported by the primary labor of life, writing. How does this fit into ideological niche marketing as you describe?

It doesn’t fit, and that’s the catch. You can’t support yourself selling twelve copies of your work a year. And there are other forms of support, like grants or communes, or scholarships, or universities, but they all dilute you into something else just as much as a day job. Like, I went to an art museum once, and there was an exhibit that was a bunch of hay and horse shit on a floor, and a bunch of Macintosh computers showing bitmapped animated pictures of Planet of the Apes. Was that art? I’m not sure. But the grant application that paid for all of that hay and shit was probably incredible art. And if you want to do that all day, and you are good at it, that’s great. But it probably means you aren’t producing art like you originally wanted.

When did you first decide to be a writer? If a role model, what qualified that person as insurmountable by their world?

I’ve always been able to write to a certain extent, but I got more involved with computers as a kid, and during school, so I always thought that was my destiny. I thought I had a book in me, but I was more concerned with learning how to hack and program. I eventually hit a wall in my formal CS training, around the time I also got dumped by this girl I was dating. I was going through a serious “what should I do with my life” phase, and didn’t entirely know what I wanted to do. I’d been working on a few Death Metal zines and I enjoyed the journalism and writing, but didn’t know if I could become a “serious” writer.

So the writers that got me started were guys who were not pretentious, and made it look easy. I liked the spoken word of Henry Rollins, and it got me into writing in a journal every day, and observing things around me. Charles Bukowski made me look at autobiographical fiction and consider it easy. So did Henry Miller, but Bukowski’s work had a certain sense of truth to it, and showed me that it wasn’t what you were writing about as much as how you wrote it. That got me started on short stories, and eventually Summer Rain.

Should writers stay celibate?

Not really, or at least not by choice. Granted, it’s hard to write on a daily basis and maintain any kind of relationship. I can’t write as well when I take off Friday and Saturday to spend time with a girlfriend or cruise around looking for one. Those are the days I write most, so my stretches of not getting any also tend to be when my writing volume increases. But interacting with people is – well, it’s not essential to writing, but it helps.

This seems to me why ancient religions and cultures recommended a studied celibacy for men. It seems that one workaround to this would be a more anti-social culture, where fewer people attempt the emotional interdependency that works well to glue society together like plywood, in which a relationship offered briefer, more passionate encounters with a significant other living in a close but separate location.

Do you see there being any humor in that being hard makes it hard to write?

There are a lot of strange catch-22s in our society like this. For example, most people that teach acting are not good actors, because if they were, they’d be getting parts, not teaching. If you’re teaching any practical field, like business, you can’t be working in that field, unless you are doing a half-ass, part-time consulting job or whatever. Very few people can pull it off, but many don’t, so it makes you wonder how the hell people figure this stuff out.

Writing is the same because writing involves translation of the human element into word. And to be a specialist in the human experience, you’re going to date people and be married, and go to parties, and have a family, and travel all over, and do all of this stuff. But if you did all of this, you wouldn’t be able to write! And I always wonder if my writing would be better or worse if I was hidden away at my ranch in Colorado all year around, where the nearest living person is ten miles away. I also wonder what would happen if I simply went full-tilt wife-hunting and gave up everything to get married and settle down. I wonder if I did that if I would ever write again.

On the other hand, it’s no coincidence that when I’m not in a relationship and I want to be in one, I tend to write more vividly about the situation. Summer Rain was started after a horrible breakup back in college, one that probably wasn’t that horrible at all, but I just couldn’t kick it. That kind of pain gives you motivation to do more, so I can ultimately appreciate the cruel irony of the whole thing.

How do you feel about Christian presence in American politics?

It’s sickening. There’s supposed to be a freedom of religion, and a freedom FROM religion, but look at any piece of American money and tell me that this is nothing except a joke. Christians funnel serious money into American politics, and this won’t change. I wish someone would get in the primaries to have some visibility, and then just get up during a speech and say “If you believe in God, go FUCK yourself.” Until then, we have politicians pandering to these idiots. It’s scary stuff

Do you think psychology as a science is unduly influenced by Judeo-Christian values?

It depends on the brand of psychology. When a lot of people go to a shrink after they get dumped or someone dies or whatever, they usually get this fast-track band-aid treatment that involves spilling out your problems and reassuring you that it will be better, but not actually offering any “reprogramming” or heavy understanding of what possible psycho-somatic issues could be causing your problems. That dovetails nicely with the christian belief that if you have problems, you just pray to Jesus and it will all be better. Both are simply a distraction, and that works for a lot of people, but I’m the kind of guy who wants to know what the hell is really going on. I mean, as a kid, every toy I was given was taken apart as soon as I learned where to dig up a phillips screwdriver. So when I was in high school, college, and I wanted to go to a shrink and really pull apart my head and find what was defective and either comment it out or replace it with a new subroutine, I was always running into these shake-and-bake therapists that just wanted me to tell them what was wrong in sixteen one-hour sessions, maybe give me some pills, and it was better. And it wasn’t!

There’s a smaller, but more focused area of psychology that focuses on finding the basis of problems, realizing that your actions and reactions shape the way you see the world and eventually how well you work with it. This is called NLP, and it’s more analogous to debugging a computer program than praying to Jesus, which is why it’s interested me. It’s also more expensive, harder to find, and takes a much longer time to work through, which is why I’m currently not working on it.

What do you think in the same context as Christian political presence about Muslims? About Jews?

There’s less of a Jewish presence in politics, although you see it here in New York. If anything, it’s refreshing to go from Indiana, which is 107% fundamentalist Christian, to New York City, where there are enough Jews that a fundie probably couldn’t run for office without some flak. I don’t even know much about the Muslim influence, and I’m not up on the Middle East, so I’ll leave it at that.

According to the doctrines of Buddhism, the world came into being as the result of some inexplicable disturbance in the heavenly calm of Nirvana, that blessed state obtained by expiation, which had endured so long a time – the change taking place by a kind of fatality. This explanation must be understood as having at bottom some moral bearing; although it is illustrated by an exactly parallel theory in the domain of physical science, which places the origin of the sun in a primitive streak of mist, formed one knows not how. Subsequently, by a series of moral errors, the world became gradually worse and worse – true of the physical orders as well – until it assumed the dismal aspect it wears today. Excellent! The Greeks looked upon the world and the gods as the work of an inscrutable necessity. A passable explanation: we may be content with it until we can get a better. Again, Ormuzd and Ahriman are rival powers, continually at war. This is not bad. But that a God like Jehovah should have created this world of misery and woe, out of sheer caprice, and because he enjoyed doing it, and should then have clapped his hands in praise of his own work, and declared everything to be very good – this will not do at all! In its explanation of the origin of the world, Judaism is inferior to any other form of religious doctrine professed by a civilized nation; and it is quite in keeping with this that it is the only one which presents no trace whatever of any belief in the immortality of the soul.

– Arthur Schopenhauer, On the Sufferings of the World

It seems to me the only difference between fundamentalist Christians and Jews is that Judaism is a materialistic religion with a racial xenophobia, while Christianity is a pseudo-idealist religion with a xenophobia of abstract orthodoxy. In many ways, that last phrase could describe what happened to European intellectualism, with a few bright exceptions, after Christianity arrived. What are your thoughts on these provocations?

I don’t know. To me, I see the main difference is that Christianity has sought to grow by being a very inclusionary religon. That means if you aren’t Christian, you can always be saved and sign on the dotted line and give us money and all will be well. That’s why if you sat in a bus station in Indianapolis on the average Tuesday, someone is going to try to convert you to Christianity about every twenty minutes. And that’s why Christianity is such a basic, dumbed- down religion, with very little orthodoxy. There aren’t a lot of rules to learn or classes to take (unless you’re Catholic) and you can even get an illustrated kiddie bible to read if the King James is too tough for you. Everyone’s invited, and that’s why their numbers grow.

On the other hand, I see Judaism as a very exclusionary religion. Jewish singles are taught to date only partners who are also Jewish. It’s very hard to convert to Judaism. It’s all protected by a very complicated and orthodox system of language, rules, calendar, holiday, diet, and everything else. But that means it’s kept pure.

I think both methods are inherently wrong, though. Any religion stresses that its members are the chosen one, and that other people are pieces of shit. Otherwise, religion would be universal, and individual churches wouldn’t have a way to make money anymore.

Which would you kick out of bed more quickly, Janet Reno or Keanu Reeves?

I think if you had an amateur porn of yourself fucking Janet Reno, it would be pretty much the ultimate party conversation item. And you know I’d go for the ass, as a little Waco retribution.

Speaking of Waco, what is the function of government?

Good question. I’m far more socialist than liberitarian in that I think the government should provide the functions that a free market economy can’t or won’t provide. In the old model, that’s stuff like roads and healthcare, retirement and men on the moon. There’s also protection and enforcement, from jails to armies. You could argue that any of these things could be done better by private companies, but corporations might not want to do them if there’s no bottom line for them. If a company is paid a billion dollars to build a one billion dollar university, they don’t have any motivation to do it, unless the company is a Christian-run shell corporation that wants to ram religion down the students’ throats, or unless Microsoft wants to build the school and brainwash the kids into using their crap. That’s why in theory a government would get involved – to make sure the alterior motives are decided by the people instead of some marketers.

In my perfect world, peoples’ greed and stupidity wouldn’t come in the way of advancement of society, and government projects like space exploration, computing, scientific research, and healthcare would actually be progressing instead of just being a sick joke. The problem is that people are too greedy, and want to know what’s in it for them. We haven’t found the cure to cancer because the top research scientists are figuring out how to make Sports Utility Vehicles even bigger, because that’s where the money is.

Does this imply that all governmental systems share common functions of both socialist and capitalist behavior? Would it be possible play with words and call socialism “social behavior” governmental theory, and call capitalism simply “competitive behavior” theory? One is implicit centralization; the other abstract. In this view, it might be possible that capitalism is closer to the anti-democratic social ideals I have interpreted from some of your statements above. If competitive rather than capitalism were seen as an American value, how do you think our social outlook might change? Would there be a blurring between the “public fiction” and “private truth” of various economic, social, governmental enterprises?

Socialist socieites also work for a collective goal by the nature of social behavior, but libertarian societies expand social behavior to include as a basic value an indifference to collectivism. Is this true in your view?

It’s true, and I think it’s an inherent flaw of most libertarian systems. For one, I think collectivism is a basic human instinct – one that can be unlearned and avoided – but it’s normal, and something the sheep out there understand. Also, I don’t think everyone can be the center of their universe; I mean, I can’t cook well, I can’t run a nuclear reactor, I don’t want to be the one to clean my septic tank, and I have to rely on doctors, lawyers, grocers, farmers, and many others to survive. A system of collectivism is supposed to provide a method to have those people help each other, while benefitting the most from it. I’m not saying our current system works, but only so many people can vanish from society and hide out in Idaho with their guns and dogs before things fall apart.

Do you believe in conspiracies?

Hell yeah. But I find the myth of conspiracies far more interesting than the conspiracies themselves. I’m writing about them a lot in Rumored, in a very playful and mocking sort of way. I don’t necessarily believe in aliens or whatever, but the Area 51 shit is great. Every society has its own myths and mytholgies, and centuries from now, people are going to be studying the X-Files like we now study Thor and Zeus.

I do seriously believe in a lot of government conspiracy. I seriously think the CIA has its hands in many evil plans, and I know billions of tax dollars go toward creating craft like Aurora, the next-generation hypersonic spy plane. I think a lot of the UFO sightings out there are probably Lockheed test craft operating at night. I know if I would’ve seen a stealth fighter in 1977, I would’ve thought the Martians were coming, too.

Jon Konrath on Death Metal

I know you’ve been a big metal and death metal listener for years. What are you hearing these days?

I actually listen to more stuff in the “prog-metal” genre these days, like Dream Theater, Fates Warning, Queensryche, Joe Satriani, etc. When I put on an “old” CD, it’s more likely going to be an old-old band like Saxon, Judas Priest, Mercyful Fate, SOD, or Anthrax. When I do have some 90s-era Death going, it’s usually Dismember, Macabre, Carcass, or Entombed.

Pick five of the most important metal bands in history and give a brief rundown on each one and why it necessarily fits into the history of metal music.

Metallica – Kill Em All: Although the band later became butt-pirates, this album was practically an anthem to millions of metalheads, and acted like a gateway drug for virtually everyone that went out and started a band or got involved with heavier metal.


Motorhead – No Remorse: With their wide appeal and universal mythology, Motorhead became almost a meta-band that everyone respected as the loudest, rawest, and coolest. It’s hard to pick just one of their albums, so I chose their ubiquitous double-album compilation, filled with a little bit of everything from their early career.

 

Queensryche – Operation : Mindcrime: This obscure group of Seattle prog-rockers put their mark on the world with what’s possibly the best concept album ever.

 

 

Entombed – Left Hand Path: This immaculate work filled with unprecedented heaviness but yet an incredible depth and complexity was the high water mark for the early 1990s Swedish Death Metal genre, and in my opinion, was never topped.

 

Slayer – Reign in Blood: Although their earlier work was just as impressive, this album defined how fast metal would be played for years, and also got Slayer kicked off of Sony.

 

Do you consume any mainstream media?

I meet a lot of people in New York who either think they are bohemian or think they are upper-class and say “Oh, I don’t have a TV” or “I don’t watch movies” or whatever. In general, I find that these people are more fake and uninteresting than the people I know who spend their Saturday on the couch with a beer watching NASCAR. I’ve found that a lot of people that purposely don’t watch TV are still living a fantasyland existance, even without the sitcoms and John Hughes films. They’re still told what to do, and they still obey. It’s not a coincidence they all go to the Hamptons or all pierce their eyebrow or all dye their hair the same way. It doesn’t make them any better than me.

I admit, I do watch TV and I do go to movies and I buy DVDs and play video games. I don’t have cable TV, and I have pretty much given up on newspapers and magazines, although I might flip through whatever’s in the doctor’s waiting room. I enjoy it, but I don’t let it run my life. I think there’s a difference between watching TV and believing in it. If you believe in TV, the ads will lower your self esteem, and make you think you’re a loser because you can’t own a new Oldsmobile or land a chick like one in a Revlon ad or beer commercial. And when your esteem is low, you’re hit with the food ads – 50 grams of cheese fat stuffed in a pizza crust, a bunch of sugar and desserts, and high-fat snack chips that will make everyone happy. It’s no wonder America is obese these days. But I don’t think you need to buy into this to enjoy TV, and I think there are movies that are good entertainment, and just that. It’s just important to remember not to compromise your own life because what you see on TV is neat.

How controlled do you believe the US media to be?

Everyone should read Ben Bagdikian or the Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting (FAIR) stuff, or at least listen to Jello Biafra rant about it. Pretty much everything we read or hear is controlled by a couple of huge corporations. And many smaller outlets for news and information become available, like the internet, but as the big companies get bigger, it seems like less and less people get involved with underground sources. And most people don’t believe stuff on the internet, because it’s diluted by so much shit. I mean, there are some great web sites out there with conspiracy theories, investigative reporting, and stuff like Slashdot, tech news, but there’s so much spam and make.money.fast and urban legends, that it’s hard to believe anything you read anymore. But to answer the question, yes the US media is controlled. And being controlled by big money is worse than being controlled by the government, like it was in old Communist countries. Because you can overthrow a government or vote out a leader, but you have no recourse against GE or Newscorp. You could stop buying their stuff or watching their shows, but that won’t hurt them much – many more sheep will continue to keep them in business.

But here steps in Satan, the eternal rebel, the first free-thinker and emancipator of worlds. He makes man ashamed of his bestial ignorance and obedience; he emancipates him, stamps upon his brow the seal of liberty and humanity, in urging him to disobey and eat of the fruit of knowledge.

– Mikhail A. Bakunin

It seems to me that evolution is a nihilistic thing, meaning it has no morals or concerns for outcomes. Thus when a society is built that values competitiveness at the expense of social logic, and you get the most fascist possible outcomes disguised as the most empowering, convenient, financially beneficial to the individual. Is this a virus humanity will shake? Is there any way out of the big money media control mess?

I think the real question to ask is, “will this virus kill itself?” Enron and WorldCom both died; this week I heard QWEST said they “accidentally” underreported a bajillion dollars of profits, and Ziff- Davis might file Chapter 11 this week. It’s not good news to our economy that these companies are falling, but it’s a demonstration that even the biggest corporations will eventually fail.

Do you think civilization often hides ugly truths behind social behavior?

I’m not sure what you’re getting at – does civilization hide truths with behavior? I think so, but it also has the ability to modify society so that the lies become the truth. That’s part of religion – a while ago, half of the kids born wouldn’t live to see their first birthday. So the churches told people to fuck like bunnies, so they’d have more customers. Now, almost all kids survive, so the world is overcrowded. And we certainly look away from problems and are drawn to others, but that’s more of a problem with capitalism. Everybody talks about school vouchers and keeping porn off the Internet this election, but nobody really gives a fuck about their kids. They never talk to them and treat them like animals. It’s all very silly.

My question might be phrased thus: does civilization have a public justification for a hidden agenda, although not necessarily an articulated and conspiratorial one, which disguises some “private” and/or unpleasant truths?

Just a stab in the dark on this: the human is the only animal that has an inherent double-standard to its nature. I mean, dogs shit on the ground, they fuck each other whenever the need arises, they dig through garbage, and they don’t think twice. But humans are more sophisticated, so there’s this whole obvious-but-secret life to everyone. Everyone has sex (well, I haven’t lately, but that’s another topic) but there is a strong taboo about sex. The same with bodily functions and death and sin and a bunch of other things. Now, I’m not saying we should all run around naked and shit in the streets. But what I am saying is maybe the human mind has this unconscious desire to have these double standards, these things that keep everything running that nobody talks about. Because if you live in an ultra-rich environment, you don’t clean your toilets. You don’t even talk about them; you pay someone else to do it. That sets up this strange double-standard, and that breeds similar things in business and politics, in the guise that it makes us “more sophisticated.”

What do you think makes us greedy, evolutionary mechanism out of control or social conditioning? Or is it possible that the former would naturally check itself eventually, but the later “justifies” it somehow to our symbolic and rational mind?

There’s a lot of social conditioning in our world that we don’t even see. There may be a primal base of darwinism, but the virus of advertizing and marketing tells us we are not complete unless we own a car with leather seats and 7-speaker CD sound system, and it puts off a huge spiral of related stuff. I also think when you don’t get the big things, you overindulge in the small. So when you see that TV commercial of a happy family and you are alone, and then the next commercial comes on and it’s for the new Pizza Hut Pizza with ten pounds of heart-clogging cheese per slice, you pick up the phone and order the pizza and eat the whole fucking thing. There’s this combination of greed and a desire for more mixed with a despiration to fill your life with something, and it’s injected into you pretty much from birth.

It is one of my theories that Christianity isolates the individual by forcing the individual into moral self-comparison with the holy deity, “God.” This causes people to think strictly in terms of their own prospects, and to lose sense of social hierarchy and collective goals. Where do you see this as converging with your own beliefs?

I would agree, although I don’t know if I would call it self- comparison as much as fear of failure. God is like a parent figure, more than a parent because he’s all-knowing, and people don’t want to disappoint their parent, especially if they will get an ass-beating over it. The strange thing is, in a theoretical sense, that would mean people would do unto others, create communities, and help the needy. But I think when you have the Christianity mixed with the unchecked greed, you get this horrible mutation of Christianity that most people in the USA preach, the kind where they think everyone is going to hell but them, but they are also really shitty to others.

Sometimes it seems as if humanity has justified this expansion using warmed-over Renaissance feeling coupled with a Christian ethos of dominating nature (which is “evil”). Do you think there’s any truth to this?

Oh, sure. Corporate branding is a billion-dollar industry, and they grab onto any emotion then can find. The Christian thing is a popular one, but throw in the “it’s for the children” and “it will make people like you”, and you’ve got a good start.

Most American kids feel neglected in the areas that are most intangible, such as time spent, value in the family unit, and that ephemeral “love,” for the third or fourth generation now. Is this a product of industrial society? Did people once treat their kids with more care, and have a collective interest in childrearing as near the top of their hierarchy of demands from a civilization?

It’s tough to say, especially now that single-parent families have been a regular way of life for over 30 years now. I think our industrial society makes it harder for parents to spend time with their children, but I also think people want immediate results, so they aren’t willing to invest time in childrearing. I mean, everyone *thinks* they do, but so many parents rush their kids into Ritalin or other drugs, and they also think they can buy parenting. I grew up in a somewhat affluent suburb where good parenting meant buying your kids the right clothes and buying them a car in high school. It’s much more than a material thing, and not many people realize that. But, I do know some people that are very good with their kids and they still work long hours at shitty jobs but are able to make it work, so not all hope is lost.

Do supermodels shit?

If they do eat at all, I’m certain they just puke it back up, but maybe some of them are addicted to laxatives. The whole thing scares me – I work in Manhattan and I’m amazed at the overabundance of phenomenally skinny women. I mean, everyone I see is six feet tall and 110 pounds, and I know that going to the gym for 5 hours a day doesn’t do that. Either they are coke fiends, or completely anorexic, or both. I’m not too into that, so it freaks me out more than anything else.

Why does death metal seem politically relevant to the end of the 20th century, to you?

Okay, so you’ve got mainstream music, however you define that. And if you’re not a sheep, and you feel a need to be different, you follow another path. In the past, that might have been punk rock, or hardcore rap, or metal, or electronic music. Well, in the interest of marketing, all of these things have been crossbred and watered down and turned into viable commercial product. So depending on what part of the country you live in, mainstream music is now either “alternative” punk music, or “R&B” rap music, or “Electronica” disco- type dance music.

So the true underground is Death Metal. And every effort to market this has failed, because if you remove the gore and the raw power and the Satanism, you’re left with something remarkably stupid that won’t market to the average record-buying sheep, and won’t have enough balls to interest metalheads. Because Sony and BMG can’t sell it or get MTV to play it, they ignore it, and the essential culture of Death Metal survives. It survives because of tape traders (and now MP3 traders) and small distros selling 20 copies of a CD and zines and fans. It means that only selling 1000 copies of an album is considered wildly successful, but it also means that album is going to be evil and aggressive and memorable and pure energy. It means that bands get to dictate what goes on an album, and gets to write songs that are sick or intelligent or protestful or Satanic or whatever. In a sense, it is a far more pure element of democracy, because it isn’t subverted by money. And it’s a form of socialism, at least in the sense that the community keeps itself afloat. You can’t just go to the average Musicland and buy good Death Metal; it’s your job to seek out this stuff by getting on the web or reading zines or talking to others.

But aside from my rambling, the importance of this politically is that the Death Metal community isn’t supported by a government, and it isn’t run by a corporation. And it doesn’t have a massively widespread impact on society, but it’s an interesting pocket of culture that sustains itself. And those things interest me, because if I could find them outside of music – if I could find a community similar to this that would feed me or clothe me or shelter me in exchange for the work I put in, it would be an interesting political experiment.

If you could say one thing to Jesus Christ, what would that be?

I’d probably tell him I was sorry for what his followers did with his message. I don’t believe in God – I’m an Atheist – but I do believe that a man named Jesus Christ walked the earth 2000 years ago, and I believe his followers wrote a book and started a church. I’m guessing the water-to-wine, rose-from-the-dead-on-the-third-day stuff is probably metaphorical, but I do think he was a charismatic man who had some ideas and told them to many people. And in the most basic of senses, Christianity has some good tenets – don’t fuck with people, don’t lie, be honest, do unto others, and so on. I’m probably far more Christian in that sense than most so-called religious people out there. But unfortunately, all of this was distorted over time, and turned into a profitable business, and a powerful tool of government. And I’m sure that if big J walked the Earth today, he’d be pretty pissed at how his vision was warped into what it is today. I’d also ask him his opinion of The Last Temptation of Christ, since I think it’s a pretty cool film.

When Christianity came into being, the craving for suicide was immense—and Christianity turned it into a lever of its power. It allowed only two kinds of suicide, dressed them up with the highest dignity and the highest hopes, and forbade all others in a terrifying manner. Only martyrdom and the ascetic’s slow destruction of his body were permitted.

What is now decisive against Christianity is our taste, no longer our reasons.

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Gay Science

I’m certain of the possibility of UFOs, and the probability of their existence, but I fear the “UFO community” because of its continual anonymity, broad claims and paucity of consistent evidence except for the generalized existence of flying metallic objects on planet earth. To me, it seems that any government is going to hide most of its budget to work on secret evil shit to do to other people, in case one’s role suddenly becomes being the recipient of the “unto you.” What sort of stuff do you think’s brewing now? Do you give any credence to conspiracy theories about AIDS or the West Nile virus, or do you think these are simply a consequence of commercial exploitation of deep forest areas (thus bringing previously undiscovered satanic microbes to the public eye)?

I predict that the threats will all be real things, but the reactions by the government is fucked up. Take the West Nile virus here in New York City. It’s a real virus, mosquitos are a real problem, but most of the people that would die from it are old and half-dead anyway. So the best reaction would have been a good public awareness campaign about mosquitos, along with patrols that cleaned out cesspools and whatnot.

Instead, Guiliani sprayed this incredibly evil chemical all over the place. They were not supposed to spray it on food, but videos came out later with them spraying it right on open fruit stands, and I’d bet anything that the food was sold later to unsuspecting people.

A lot of bad shit could happen in the near future, and it’s not a conspiracy theory. Think about Gulf War syndrome, smallpox, or e coli – that Fast Food Nation book told unspeakable horrors about how understaffed and inconsequential the USDA is about meat inspections, and now there’s a beef recall going on in Colorado as we speak. And remember last fall when everyone and their brother was finding Anthrax in the US mails? None of these are conspiracies like saying that the CIA invented AIDS. (Although I think the CIA made crack cocaine popular,) but the government’s piss-poor reaction to these problems are veiled in mystery.

If your options were an eternal existence for human populations or total destruction of earth, including all humans, which would you pick?

I’m going to read a bit too much into this to support an answer. I think, given the rate of human growth, that it would not be possible for an eternal existence on our one small planet, at least given our current technological infrastructure. Many people (Greenpeace et al) think that in order to sidestep this, we need to avoid using the Earth as a natural resource, or at least avoid destroying it. But a minority of people think that the solution is to create a larger infrastructure – hydrogen cars, solar power, fusion power, synthetic nutrients instead of laborious farming and inefficient slaughterhouses. And people themselves have problems that prevent an eternal lifespan – medicine can only do so much, and you’d need genetic engineering orders of magnitude better, to essentially slow or stop aging and repair genetic disorders. And eventually, you’d run out of room – you’d need to move to other planets, other moons, spacestations to support the population. And you’d need to slow down the growth of population, too.

This all sounds great to me, but I think population has lost faith in the idea of space exploration. Even with people living full-time in the ISS, there’s no public interest in taking the next step. A few people on the internet, like the Artemis project, and people who have been reading Kim Stanley Robinson for too long (like me) want to see someone win the X-Prize and put private space travel on the map, but too many people are more interested in the new Britney Spears video. There are also too many serious issues, mostly related to obsolete tenets of religion, that prevent any scientific progress on ideas like cloning, stem cell treatment, genetics, population control, longevity enhancement, or anything else. Of course, as Bill Hicks pointed out and as I found while reading a Gideon’s Bible in a Las Vegas hotel room a few weeks ago (I’m not a fan of the work, except as an interesting fictional treatise, and sometimes to throw back at people to prove a point) but in the bible, Adam and Eve were supposed to live forever. They were supposed to never produce. They were supposed to live a utopian paradise and they fucked it all up. Now, this is just a fairy tale, but I see nothing wrong with pursuing this in the future, in creating our own garden of eden.

Could one construe all of civilization except for its pure pragmatics as a death realization avoidance cult?

It’s more than a death realization avoidance cult; you need to add to that all of the building empire people do, like having kids and buying crap they don’t need in order to have the most, even after they die.

Jon Konrath
www.rumored.com

Interview: Vidar Vaaer (Ildjarn)

June 16, 2012 –

We caught up with Ildjarn via email to discuss the sudden release of earlier works, “Son of the Northstar” on Fullmoon Records, and the impetus behind his unusual art form. Taking black metal a step closer to the ambient, Ildjarn has with his self-titled unit and project Sort Vokter shaped metal into an atmospheric, spontaneous and subtly structured art form.

Do you see art as having a goal, or being pure aesthetics? Some would argue that art deliberately communicates an idea(s) or changes the listener through experience, where others claim that art is an experience unrelated to the thoughts and beliefs of the artists?

Well, I don’t know about art, and I don’t give a shit about art no matter what it is. I’m just doing what comes natural, and I’ve never thought about it as art. The things I do are for me, I’ve never done music for no one but me. Still, I think it’s satisfying to know that the truly dedicated out there find something in what I do.

What to you is most inspiring in nature?

To take a walk in the mountains, especially the highlands called Hardanger highlands, Norway (of course).

Do you see anything natural about human society, including its technology?

I try to mingle as little as possible with people and society in general. I find more pleasure in entering my own world.

Do you find it amazing that you seem to have discovered an infinite source of small patterns in your art form?

As I said, about art, others have to decide if what I do is art. About your question, I’m not sure what you mean…

When people say, “does art emulate life, or life emulate art,” do they mean life as human life, or natural life? If so, how could trees/birds/etc. emulate art unless there was a preexisting commonality between art and natural life?

I don’t have a fuckin’ idea.

On the Sort Vokter album Folkloric Necro Metal there is a statement about the drug THC. What does this drug mean to you, and how do you see drug use as fitting in with your beliefs?

I never use drugs, actually I never touch alcohol either. I want my senses to experience things in a natural way. I was the only one on the album not using drugs during the recording process.

You briefly played bass for Emperor; what do you see as the differences in approach between your art and that of Emperor?

Emperor have to make a lot of compromises, being a band, whereas I don’t have to. I’m my own master, I do what I feel like, and I never ask anyone if they like it. If I like it myself, that’s enough. Also, my music is more improvised at times, being the only one in the making of the music.

While many artists consider improvisation a key to perfection of idea, in your case it seems as if perfection is not the goal as much as setting a glimpse of man + nature into music. Do you think there is any truth to this statement?

If you had to name recent bands from the metal or ambient genres that had impressed you, could you list any? If so, what are they?

I really like Biosphere from Norway, it’s the ultimate ambient feeling. I think there’s a lot of crap bands these days, and I really wouldn’t know which ones to mention.

What seems amazing about Biosphere is the way that radically different, small parts are woven together to produce a feeling of immersion that to me most “sounds like” connections between ideas across time. Do any of these concepts influence your music?

I don’t know. It’s hard for me to tell, because I just do what comes natural. It may be that I’ve been influenced, but I wouldn’t know.

Some people view violence as inherently evil. as a naturalist, what do you feel is the role of violence?

It’s natural in nature. It’s not evil in my eyes. Evil is beyond all this, something only one can know oneself. If you stab someone for no reason and laughs about it afterwards, you’re not necessarily evil. You might have had a bad childhood or whatever. As for myself, I despise my own race. I don’tsee this as evil, I just don’t think humans are worthy of living. When I take a walk up in the mountains, I always hope I won’t meet someone. Animals, on the other hand, have my total respect and admiration.

There is a hypothesis that the earth is a living organism, called by some “Gaia.” In this hypothesis creatures are cells in a much larger interactive life form which regulates itself and develops for some reason known only to it. If you were/are a believer in this theory, what would be the role of humans in Gaia?

This is so far from my beliefs that I don’t know how to answer this one.

Let us admit to ourselves, without trying to be considerate, how every higher culture on earth so far has begun. Human beings whose nature was still natural, barbarians in every terrible sense of the word, men of prey who were still in possession of unbroken strength of will and lust for power, hurled themselves upon weaker, more civilized, more peaceful races, perhaps traders or cattle raisers, or upon mellow old cultures whose last vitality was even then flaring up in splendid fireworks of spirit and corruption. In the beginning, the noble caste was always the barbarian caste: their predominance did not lie mainly in physical strength but in strength of the soul–they were more whole human beings (which also means, at every level, “more whole beasts”).

– F.W. Nietzsche, Beyond Good and Evil

In death metal and black metal, there is a heritage of both fantasy (metal) and pragmatic, hard-hitting politics of an anarchistic nature (hardcore). Do you feel this is true? If so, where do your beliefs influence your music in terms of these two extremes?

I don’t think these combine. As for my own music, my intention is to capture the feelings I have, call it evil or whatever, and in order to do this the music has to be capable of doing this.

What was the impetus for you to switch to keyboards on Landscapes, and what prompted the unusual decision to forego harmonic depth for a trueness to the form you established with guitars?

I’ve had these overwhelming feelings towards Norwegian nature for many years, so I just had to record some stuff. The two discs are composed and recorded during two nights only, and it’s 90% improvised. The feelings expressed here are a bit different from that of my metal releases, but also some of my metal tunes, I think, capture some of the same feelings, even though they’re expressed differently.

In your process of creation, what is the seed of the songwriting process? In other words, what is the first piece of any song around which you build the rest?

I’ve usually had the song inside my head, and then I first record the drums.

It’s very difficult to record the guitars first, because then you don’t have the same feeling of rhythm. All my stuff is recorded on a 4-tracker, so it was tricky to get the mike in the right place, but I don’t think that my music could have been made in a studio. I have to be alone when I make my music. I’ve also done all engineering and production myself. The 4-tracker is now destroyed, so I can never make any more Ildjarn music. The sound would not be the one I’m after.

Ancient Hindu mythos used the Age of Kali (a goddess of death, destruction, absorption) to characterize an age of great instability and apocalyptic outcome. How far away do you think the Age of Kali is?

It’s coming very soon, and I’ll welcome it with all my heart.

Are you familiar with Godflesh – Streetcleaner? It seems to have some similar aspirations in songwriting, and some stuff that is vestigial from the former generation of metal.

I can’t really compare my stuff with other bands. I don’t care about other bands, so I’m not capable of doing a comparison.

Nidhogg listened a lot to Industrial many years ago, and he had all Godflesh recordings. I discovered some elements of aggression in them, but I don’t think I’ve been influenced by them. I was at a concert in Kristiansand, Norway, many years ago, Godflesh being the headliner. Nidhogg, of course, had to drag me along. Actually I was bored the whole time. I’ve never liked gigs, they just don’t give me that feeling I get when listening to music all by myself.

In the newspapers today, in America, the following snippet of text appeared in an article entitled “survey finds few in U.S. understand science.” What do you think is the intent of this article?

The scientific validity of astrology — the belief that an alignment of the planets can affect events on Earth — is rejected by 60 percent of Americans, as is the idea that some numbers are lucky while others are not. But 43 percent say they still read the astrology charts at least occasionally in the newspaper.

Seventy-seven percent of those surveyed believe in the theory of global warming, that the planet is being heated by an excess of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. Of those surveyed, 86 percent said global warming is a serious or “somewhat serious” problem. (Source)

I think people are too stupid and ignorant to really understand this topic.

Who is your favorite world leader from all of history? Would you ever aspire to a leadership role?

Leaders appear just because people are so weak, stupid and follow in each other’s footsteps. I’m my own leader, in my own world. I don’t have any interest in leading anyone.

Your misanthropy is legendary. What is it about humans that makes them detestable in contrast to ideologically silent plants and animals?

Humans are weak, always have to act contrary to what they really want, and they have also destroyed an entire planet. In short, they don’t live in allegiance with themselves and I will always hate my own race.

What do you think of vegetarians and recycling? Some say they are sell-outs for picking intermediate steps when much more radical action is required.

I’m a vegan myself. I became vegan when I was 17, I’m now 30. I never touch anything with milk in it, meat, fish, whatever. I respect animals, and consider them worthy of life. Humans, on the other hand… I think my misanthropy is to a large extent a result of the disrespect towards animals seen among filth of the human race. Still, of course I hate them for other reasons as well. I’m not one of those who hate just because of a bad childhood. I had the perfect childhood, being very often on my own, exploring. I also had many friends being a child, but at some time I realized that friendship actually doesn’t exist. Sure, you can respect someone, but friendship? I don’t think so. About recycling, I’m careful about littering, but it’s just because of the animals. I actually don’t care about the planet, animals are in hell, anyway. I confess that I’m a bit confused as to how I should explain this. Anyway, I follow my conscience, which is my guiding star through life and, eventually, death.

If you could change one aspect of your artistic career, what would it be?

I never regret anything. What’s done is done, it’s a part of the process. I’ve also never progressed in any way with my music, I think, and that’s important in it. The feelings have always been the same.

Do you think there is a “purpose,” or ongoing overall goal, to the process of life?

We’ll have to wait and see. Hopefully I’ll be dead in a few years time (5 years, tops), and I really look forward to it. Although I find great pleasure in observing nature, I welcome death even more.

Are there any theories or mythos of the creation of the universe to which you subscribe?

No, I have my own thoughts. Too fuckin’ weird to mention, too extensive. (I’m afraid I’ll get “mouse disease” from this interview.)

I have seen statements attributed to you which say, in effect, that you record on a whim with a portable recorder. Is this still true? Do you have any plans for further musical releases?

This is described above. I used the same 4-tracker that was used for the Emperor demo, but I arranged the sound differently. I will make no new music, but I feel that some of my songs are redundant, so I’ll maybe release an album with what I regard as my best songs.

What is the history behind the Son of the Northstar CD that full moon productions is selling as a full-length?

It was intended to be released 6-7 years ago. I actually sent the guys a DAT with a couple of songs to be released as a 7″ EP. I didn’t know anything about this until a week ago. In the writing moment I actually don’t have any copy myself. It’s a possibility that Fullmoon will release the CD I mentioned above.

What aspects of the metal underground would you change, if possible, and how would you change them?

I know only of a very few people dedicated to the underground, so I don’t know.

Scientists believe they have identified an “expansive force” which separates galaxies from one another with ever-increasing speed, as a counterpart to the gravity which is drawing the universe toward compaction. Does it seem natural that such a dualistic force would exist?

NASA’s Hubble Space Telescope has spotted a burst of light from an exploding star located much farther from Earth than any previously seen – a supernova blast in the early Universe that is casting light on a mystery of truly cosmic scale. This stellar explosion is extraordinary not only because of its tremendous distance — 10 billion light-years from our planet — but also because it greatly bolsters the case for the existence of a mysterious form of “dark energy” pervading the cosmos. (Source)

We would never know. It’s only after death that we’ll know the true meaning, if any.

Which thinkers, writers, artists and musicians have most influenced your learning?

Musicwise, I’ve listened to black metal since 1983, but I don’t know how much it has influenced me. I don’t care about thinkers, writers etc. I don’t need them.

If you could become a state of mind for eternity, which state of mind would it be?

My biggest fear is to live for eternity, either in mind or as something else.

Who was “Nidhogg” of the Ildjarn-Nidhogg split? By reputation, it is someone from the industrial/ambient band Dagda Mor (apologies for incorrect spelling); how did you meet this person and using what principles did you achieve collaboration?

We’ve known each other for 13 years, through music and ideas. It’s not the same Nidhogg as the one you mentioned, that’s just a bad copy.

Will those who appreciate your music be hearing more from Ildjarn, Sort Vokter or your other side projects? If so, please let us know by names which ones are to be ongoing.

The only thing would be the “Hardanger highlands” CD; it’s already recorded, but we haven’t thought of releasing it yet. It was finished in 1997, and it actually took us 3 years to do it. It’s kind of like “Landscapes”, only at least 10 times better.

This sounds amazing. I liked Landscapes and found its moments of intensity to be revealing of something spirited in existence itself. Can I ask who “we” are? Is this less improvised? Does improvisation bring out ideas hidden within the subconscious, or does it force them to be created through lack of time? It seems like a natural method to use stress to induce variation.

“We” are me and Nidhogg. The recording is one hour, and it took a lot of mental energy to do it. It’s not improvised at all. The compositions are exactly that; compositions, whereas “Landscapes” was more or less improvised during two nights. As I’ve said, being two in the process of making music, there have to be some compromises, and we’ve done all of them. The result, however, we both find pleasing, although some people may believe Ildjarn has become a fuckin pussy, after hearing it. What’s important in this respect is to understand that it’s all about nature. And I admit, I’m totally engulfed in Norwegian nature. It’s a hymn to this grand nature, and the music has nothing to do with love in the ordinary sense. We plan to release it before I enter the kingdom of death, but we don’t know exactly when.

For reviews of Ildjarn’s music, please check here.

But it is the will of the individual that sets in motion the whole mechanism, in that it urges the intellect, in accordance with the interest, i.e., the man’s individual aims, to produce for its present representations those closely related thereto logically, analogically or by proximity in space and time. But here the will’s activity is so direct that we often are not clearly conscious thereof. It is so rapid that at times we are not even conscious of the occasions for a representation that is thus brought about. Here it seems as though something quite unconnected with anything else has entered our consciousness. That this, however, cannot occur, is, as I have said, precisely the root of the principle of sufficient reason, and has been discussed more fully in the above-quoted chapted of my chief work. Every picture or image that is suddenly presented to our imagination, also every judgement that does not follow its previously existing ground or reason, must be produced by an act of will which has a motive, although such motive is often not perceived because it is insignificant, and the act of will is frequently not noticed because its fulfilment is so easy that this and the wish are simultaneous.

– Arthur Schopenhauer, The Fourfold Root

Interview: Thorous (Deteriorate)

June 10, 2012 –
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Deteriorate (Pennsylvania, USA) got their start as a band solidly and unmistakenly death metal of the violent American variety. Their debut Rotting in Hell, one of the premier domestic outputs of the infamous JL America label, broke little ground, but nonetheless manages to get spins from old-timers who have long appreciated its compact composition and caustic delivery. Not long after this sleeper semi-classic the band abandoned their death metal pursuits in favor of a faster, more melodic and hybridized style in line with the rising popularity of the European black metal of the day.

Interview from Heidenlarm e-zine #1.

Deteriorate Rotting in Hell came out near the end of the death metal boom, right before black metal became predominant in the eyes of many listeners. What was it like at that time to contemplate the styles in which you could compose?

Personally I was seriously into black metal since the begining…in fact if you noticed the change in styles between “Rotting in Hell” and “Gather the nebbish/The Senectuous Entrance” you can see my influences shining through out the whole cd; I wrote nearly half of the music on “Gather/Senectuous” around 1994…I was so saturated with old black/death metal like Venom, Bathory, Eestruction, Voivod, Slayer, Sodom, Kreator that it just flowed naturally in any riffs I would be writing…I mean I saw Kreator’s first US tour[I believe] at City Gardens in Trenton NJ with Voivod I think it was “Pleasure to Kill/Killing Technology” tour – this fucking show was so fucking brutal, I was blown the fuck away, it still to this day had to have been the most influential moment in my life, as I watched them play flawlessly I said to myself that’s what I want to do and I’m going to do whatever it takes to get there…so I played everyday for years until I was 17 formed my first band it was called “randomdraw” a hardcore/metal band we sounded like cromags vs rage against the machine…anyway after a few years of other bands and stuff I joined Deteriorate which is a long story in itself!…so my goal with them was to take it to the next level get so into the music and just fucking go apeshit and I think it all worked out perfectly…..

It seems to me that death metal has always had two opposing sides, one of which emphasizes fast tremolo picking and relatively few emphatic pauses, while the other side uses muffled strumming and a morse code of pausing and pounding to spell out its riffs. What made you gravitate toward the faster metal side?

When I started playing guitar in ’82 I thought that metal had a missing element that hardcore bands seemed to emphasize on “speed”. So I started playing as fast as I could thinking that it would make me more talented as a player…so I would write these riffs and put them together with my younger brother Justin and we would play these blazing fast songs full of ‘squeals’ and violent solos like Slayer or Cryptic Slaughter…but after some time speed wasn’t good enough so I added into my style harmony&melody…I wanted something different say warmer tones, so I got into Malmsteen alot and Voivod, Black Sabbath, Ozzy, Motley Crue, Iron Maiden, Celtic Frost ‘morbid tales'[my favorite guitar sound ever], Exodus, Violence, Metallica, Megadeth, Bathory, Anvil Bitch, Dominance, Faith or Fear, Flotsam and Jetsam, Death & tons more…I started going to 2 to 3 shows a week it was so intense there were lines down the street; as I saw these bands perform in the early mid 80’s I was blown away it was so intense my world had become near perfect! At the same time I was extremely jealous, I thought to myself why can’t I do that? There was one reason why —drummers—there is such a shortage of quality drummers that could do blaast beats or grind or doublebass let alone afford a decent kit…I was so into technical metal that it made it even harder to find someone.

There were fewer people involved with death and black metal in that time, unlike the current scenario. What do you think are the differences in a musician’s experience between the two?

Nowadays its more open to all; the styles combined, there are a thousand times more muscicians that are dying to play…equipment is far more affordable and more directed towards metal hard rock players…the nu-metal styles are bringing more people to wards heavier music especially women! I always thought that if you could get women into your band then men would follow hence bringing your numbers at the door up at the club you’re playing…

What to you makes a series of chords and rhythms a “riff”?

I’m always looking for something different or catchy or “hook” riffs…riffs that make you say “hell yeah that rips” and your hair stands up on your whole body…or like in the 80s the introduction of the word “mosh”or “not” where anthrax introduced to me the true pit styles I actually went nuts at every show we all our own style of moshing or dancing,or the dive kings, we tried every kind of dive you could think of it was a contest to us to see how long you could stay on stage or how long you could wave ride…it was the best years of my life it was so fresh new different and the normal people didn’t even notice any of these bands we were such a minority back then, I was always saying in school that Metallica will be the biggest band ever and 10 years later I was damn near right…I was the only kid in my juniore high with an earring and a denim jacket with death metal patches all over it…

Fo you compose by riff assembly, or is there a pattern into which riffs fit first?

Actually I have an odd style of writing I usually number the riffs along with names for each part and write it all down,so if I forget I have notes…in Deteriorate I played bass but I wrote the riffs on my 7string and brought my guitar to practice where I showed them the riffs…my newer bands I play guitar and sing on almost everything…I write all the music and vocals and let my drummer mike trush write the drum parts…I usually write all the music in my head at work and then go home and play my ass off…

Many of your songs on Rotting in Hell preserved a casual but intense atmosphere of using little introduction and tearing into the material on hand immediately. Was this a reaction to the riff-salad-heavy metal songs of the time, which often took half of the song just to get cooking?

Actually I didn’t play anything on “Rotting,” although I was in the band months before the recording sessions, I was asked to play on “Rotting” but it didn’t feel right playing songs on a disc that I had no part in writing so I declined…if you asked me about “Gather/Senectuous” I would have to say they were flowing and melodic…
lyrically, the band also played at least two sides, having some “gore” topics and a fair number that could have been interpreted as more gothic, romantic or moribund.

What inspired the lyric writing on this album?

As far as “Gather the Nebbish,” I sang 3 songs and wrote a major part of the music, my lyrics were directed towards my hatred towards a society that hates people like me…I would first get into a raging pissed off mood then write the music then the lyrics would just kind of “bleed” to me,you know what I mean?..I went in the studio and basically freaked out in the vocal booth screaming my heart out jumping around like a fucking lunatic,..in fact 2 of the songs I sang on “Gather” came about on the spot, I did the vocals on one take not even rehearsing them once: Evaporated Battleground/Ode to a Mortal” my good friend Trevor Schaible donated those 2 sets of lyrics and I took them in the studio and ad libbed the songs it just so happened they came out pretty good in my opinion total chaos!!

After Rotting in Hell, Deteriorate took a break. What happened during this time?

We went through some member changes and more of my writing came into effect, we really spent a lot of time rehearsing doing shows and getting more professional about ourselves and we said to ourselves what can we do to make this band better and more brutal and so we did just that…

After this break you released, The Senectuous Entrance, which in my view is two albums put together — one that could be described as Emperor-style gothic black metal, and another that was more heavy metal/punkish. What brought about this dichotomy?

I basically came into the band with alot of the ideas already to go, I brought to the band my musical background and it took over I guess…I never really heard any of the newer black/death metal bands, which bothered me when people said we are a rip of of Norweigan bands, its totally not the truth, I was doing this type of music inthe early 80s I was playing the 3rds minor this dissonant that you name it ..if you notice “Rotting” has none of the harmonies and minor chords, I brought that to the band and we took off with it, I was in bands prior to that which had similiar traits…

Your songs convey as much energy as any other band out there. How do you do it?

I tend to think to myself if I was in the crowd or a listener what would I want to hear and I do it…energy is the first priority nowadays in my band “Treading on Divine” I do simpler arrangements but it works for me, there is more flowing riffs and catchy hooks…

The band has been around since 1991. How do you think metal, or death metal, has changed over the course of that time?

All the genres have improved with the times…certain bands keep their styles others evolve into something different I think both scenarios work,it gives fans an oppurtunity to hear something new therefore creating another rip in the timeline for a new genre..

How has Deteriorate as a band integrated those changes into its music?

Currently Deteriorate is rehearsing for a new release in the future but Mike Trush and myself are quite busy so it takes some time to get it together…other members are in Krypton or not doing music at all…

Your songs are convoluted in the logic that produces continuity between their riffs, enough that they must be heard through once fully before being interpreted. How do you think the awareness of this process in the listener affects how you compose?

It gives me a flowing feel to it, I can sit and bob my head continuosly from start to finish, I can only assume that our fans or listeners do the same thing…it has that warm feeling about it…the 5 unreleased songs have a brutal chaotic war type sound to it, but we still incorporated the Deteriorate flow and sound to it…

When you are composing a song and have two directions in which it can go, how do you select which one should prevail?

It was always a band vote or else we would just open jam and if it went in some new direction that sounded cool we would work with it…it’s truly important to find muscicians that you can openly do unplanned jams ,its usually where you find a truly nwew and original riff,where as when you are at home there is no drums or band influence there to strengthen the song or give you a nod or an added riff between another riff….

You seem to be a non-political band, as far as lyrics are concerned. Do you have any political or social change views that you keep to yourself, or are you detached from the entire process of politics and ideology?

Personally I try to incorporate politics or truth in my lyrics, these topics enrage me making my songs come out even more chaotic, I try to let the lyrics influence my choice of riffs after the song is written of course, the lyrics might change a part into something different or brutal…

The USA may be about to wage holy war on Iraq and the Middle East. Is this a metal topic to discuss?

Yes and no…I feel it’s all a front to keep americans intrested in the politics of this country…the president has to do something to keep his people supporting him…with all the things like snipers, Iraq, WTC and racism, he can shift the peoples attention away from starting a war with Iraq, he made everybody shift their attention from Iraq to the snyper atacks, getting everyone pissed off, so now the people are hungry for some desruction somewhere other than here, and to make it work even better the one snipers last name was Muhammad…it worked, he’s got the ok to wage a war on Iraq, I’m not surprised and I do support this war…these people need a leader that has enough brains not fuck with the most powerful country in the world, us!!!

Do you think that music conveys values based upon what positive beliefs are affirmed in the music, even in simply its sound which resembles facets of the outside world?

It does…music has been the center of attention since the beginning of its creation…it can take you out of reality or define reality and it seems that both work very well…I mean people take a cd put it in then something happens, almost chemically in their brain and it feels good,others feel bad or angry or something, its amazing how this works…I always thought that you could totally control or program people of all ages through certain notes played in precise actions in the brain, when I hear certain notes a feel it all over my body its really quite remarkable [I hope this made some sense to you, I think I understand what I just said hahaha]

Is it possible to be a musician without sharing some of your views through music?

Definitely… I’m really into Burzum, Varg does an excellent job at creating a soundscape, it’s total headphone music, which is one of my favorite ways of listening, Varg uses his feelings and beliefs through beautiful music, but yet you can still understand his anger and pains…Mortiis does similar work but his feelings tend to be fantasy like or dungeons and dragons theme music, both are excellent…

You’re now working on new material with a band called Treading on Divine. This title seems to have more metaphysical implications than the gore-metal-ish idea of Deteriorate. What is different about the music and outlook of Treading on Divine as compared to Deterioriate?

“Treading on Divine” is a project that I started around 98 right around the breakup of Deteriorate myself and joe gorski were fed up with the scene in Philly so we moved to south florida and started playing…he was on drums and I played and sang..eventually we grabbed my brother [who is the best guitarist I’ve ever seen] and Conrad Eddings on bass…we had 3 songs and so it was born…down the road we fell into the party scene down there 3 of us worked in nightclubs so if we weren’t working we were partying thus the band suffered…I had also another band with the samme members except Chris Dino plyed drums that was called ‘twitch’ it was really good stuff….so eventually we after 2 years parted ways I moved back north and started the band with other people, Thorous-lead guitar, Mike Trush-drums, Chris Berwind-bass and Alex Davis-guitar….we rehearsed about a year and 2 of the members didn’t progress so I let them go, now it’s myself, Trush and filling in on bass Jason Hildebrandt from Funeral Mask, Cemetary Earth, Hazarax…we’re ready to record a EP..full length soon the title is “thy only god”..the difference between Deteriorate and treading is I write all the music and arrangements, they’re more flowing and basic riffs…it has black, grind,melody,harmonies,thrash,death styles…in Deteriorate the riffs were all voted on whether I liked it or not so alot of good riffs got trashed, since I saved these riffs and used them now,so some of these songs are quite old…we do one song called “Viral Gore” which is from 1988; some are from 89, these are more thrashy,…the “Treading” songs have “hooks” that make you say hell yeah! As far as the lyrics “Treading on Divine” is based upon my hatred towards authority, I don’t like being told what to do, ever! Not by anyone including my girlfriends….this is the topic I have been griping about forever…i get political on some sogs others are about my nonreligon attitude…being my own god and all that…

What bands are you listening to now?

Voivod-Deathrow-DBC-Burzum-Devil Doll-Elend-Marilyn Manson-Ozzy/Sabbath-Golden Dawn-Entombed-Dismember-Fantomas-Mr. Bungle-Thorns-Abruptum-Mayhem-Behemoth-Venom-Destruction-Kreator-Sodom -Vond-Ulver-old W.A.S.P.-Metallica-Megadeth-Slayer-Darkthrone-Mercyful Fate-Celtic Frost-Belphegor-Tartaros-Tomahawk-Jimmy Rodgers-Sabbat-Immolation-Exodus-Emperor-Autopsy-Laibach-Bloodstorm-Se rvants of Hate-Funeral Mask-LiveSufferDie-Ministry-Christian Death-Violence-Anthrax-Forbidden-Abigor… I could go on forever!

It appears the downturn in the US and world economies has affected metal. Are you able to find a label at this point in time? Are you going to self-release this upcoming album?

Actually Philadelphia has so many labels here…I am talking with a few labels none that I want to name just yet but I have made mistakes with labels in the past and I don’t want to lose money and touring again. When I first joined Deteriorate we had tons of touring offers, some with morbidangel for 40 dates but our drummer had a custody battle going on so he couldn’t do the tours, eventually that was why we replaced him with Darkwoods, Rich was a great drummer though…

How do you think the internet has changed music, from your first album in 1993 to your second in 1996, and now to the current time?

The internet is excellent for underground bands like us to get exposure…it’s amazing how much stuff is out there…I can always find something interesting on the web….

Do you think most metallers have a common general direction of their ideology, or is there no unity in thought in the scene?

I honestly think everybody is different anymore, I always hear different opinions about every topic…,sure theres unity but not really where i’m at…i live in a city that has everybody thinking differently I don’t know why…theres always bands that are jealous of others or pissed offf that they’re opening for a band that they think sucks,i’ve been dealing with this shit since 89…we used to get every tour package that came through philly no matter who was headlining the tour we always got the top slot on the bill…this made all the local bands hate us instead of supporting us which would come back to them in the end…i think nowadays its different theres more unity in the scene…back in the 90s we could’ve all stuck together and the philly scene would’ve been the next tampa bay thing,instead when the cell block closed the bands dissapated,noone astuck to gether and bands broke up, its a shame because we really had some good bands in our scene,to tell you the truth most of those bands are like invisible because I haven’t seen many of those muscians again….

After the rise of nu-metal and bands like Slipknot, does metal any longer have the “coming in from the outfield” strangeness and dramatic impact that it once had?

I feel that this is the metal years all over again, history is repeating itself but in a grander way…a majority of people today appreciate metal and hard rock, its not that uncommon anymore,you hear metal on the radio everyday…we have such a wide variety of bands to chose from along with a generation of people that grew up om metal ranging from 10 to 40 years old….most like something heavy if not ozzy/sabath then metallica or godsmack or something…to me this is positive for the scene…
why metal? it’s not an easy artform, there’s no money and most people seem to hate it or disparage it. why do you keep going? (this is not a criticism, hopefully obviously, since i’m still in this after as many years too!)

I can’t stop! I love it the heavier it is the better….then again everybody will probably hate me for this but I like Marilyn Manson alot…his music is super creative, its full of hate, evil, and other postive shit that just makes him an icon for heavy mainstream music he’s actually helping the world get into heavy music which opens the doors for bands like mine,he has the flow we were talking about earlier, I am open minded to some degree….I like stuff from almost every genre doesn’t mean its good for everybody else, but it’s good to me and I don’t care what anybody thinks….who cares what I listen to anyway you know? To each his own….theres a litttle bit of everyting in bands today it means that awider range of audiences will buy into heavier music…[i hope]…

If you could tour with two or three bands from anywhere and anytime in metal, who would it be?

Voivod!!!!!!!Slayer!!!Morbid Angel!!!

Where do you think metal will go next?

Its going to get even bigger, I know I want more of it and I’m not going anywhere but more angrier then before…I have more anger in me than ever before and I need bands to fuel my fire!!!

Jazz, ambient, industrial, and punk: all of them exist as separate genres, niches if you will, from the mainstream as does metal. But somehow jazz and ambient get more respect and never quite fully are able to integrate with the mainstream of radio music. Do you think this is due to increased technicality, radically unpopular song structures, ability of audience to appreciate complexity, or other factors? Do you think this same distancing from mainstream radio music could help metal?

Maybe the jazz thing is of the other half of society that doesn’t listen to rock or metal or mainstream music…it could be an older generation or possibly the trained muscicians of the world are more appreciated…I know I’ve never had a lesson in my life but it still kept me busy and somewhat talented…

It used to be there were tons of zines, and people mailing stickers and dubbed cassettes all over the world. Metalheads today trade web links and mp3s, and there are now thousands of websites each offering small fragments of information. Where is this weak(er), and what’s next after this? Do you think metal will consolidate its information?

it can only get better,the more publicity for my style of music the better…

Do you believe humanity is about to blow itself into vapor?

Not really its pretty much the way its always been to me, bullshit, politicians, religon it’s all always there its just a matter of what you buy into…

What has changed about the songwriting process for Treading on Divine that is separate from how Deteriorate worked in both incarnations?

Actually not much maybe different tempos or not so much blast and grind beats…I have been working on more catchier riffs that have a more grooving sound to them its still in the black/death metal vein…

Who’s in the band now?

Thorous[guitar/vox] Mike Trush[drums/vox/bass]

Are you going to repress Rotting in Hell and The Senectuous Entrance?

Actually we have the original recording of “Rotting in Hell” which was recorded at an entirely different rcording studio…the vox are even more brutal..we are going to release it soon with the original cover that was deemed to satanic for our onr guitar player….

Where do you hope to be in ten years?

hopefully touring the world and playing brutal music forever!!!!!!!

What do you do outside of metal, as individuals, and who is in the band?

I have my historic renovations business…I do old world/european style stonework and replications. I’m planning to do a house in Spain this spring, its my other passion in life!!

Any final additions?

Its cool to know that there’s people out there still into Deteriorate and the old school metal bands…I appreciate any people who would like a copy of unreleased material and videos…send me tapes and postage to: thorous—-170 smithtown rd. pipersville,PA 18947 Keep the metal world alive! Don’t give up playing your instruments,follow your dreams, I had dreams when I started playingt and so many came true, if I can do it anyone can do it! Keep trying your best,sing your heart out! Play all day and night! Make a difference, speak your mind! Don’t take any shit from anyone! Don’t let anyone push you around, you’re only as powerful as you believe you are! Keep metal alive! Kick some ass! – And support the local bands in your area, without people like you local bands will fade away, go to as many shows as you can, and buy as much merchandise as you can, it will come back to you in some way! Thanks for giving me the chance to vent SRP! – thorous…treading on divine….

The natural inequality of the two powers of population and of production in the earth and that great law of our nature which must constantly keep their effects equal form the great difficulty that to me appears insurmountable in the way to the perfectibility of society. All other arguments are of slight and subordinate consideration in comparison to this. No fancied equality, no agrarian regulations in their utmost extent, could remove the pressure of it even for a single century. And it appears, therefore, to be decisive against the possible existence of a society, all the members of which should live in ease, happiness, and comparative leisure; and feel no anxiety about providing the means of subsistence for themselves and families.

Consequently, if the premises are just, the argument is conclusive against the perfectibility of the mass of mankind.

– Thomas Malthus, Population: The First Essay (1798)

Interview: King Fowley (Deceased)

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Deceased are an incredibly longstanding band from Virginia, US. They’ve run full-circle in their career, from over-the-top metal and hardcore of the mid 1980s (Discharge, Voivod, Slayer, Sodom) later merged with the energy of emerging death metal in the late eighties/early nineties and back again to rediscover themselves in the context of their heavy metal forebears. King Fowley, whose enthusiasm for the music he plays and what it represents seethes through everything he does, has lead the band’s charge since their inception.

Originally for Heidenlarm e-zine #5.

Cursed productions recently issued The Radiation Years, a collection of early demos. Is this the complete deceased pre-label discography?

Actually it’s not! ‘The evil side of religion’ our first demo still needs to surface complete. And will very soon! Probably on Cursed Productions as well. Actually in all honesty there was a home studio demo before ‘luck of the corpse’ l.p was recorded. With ‘Fading Survival’, ‘Terrifying Spectres’, ‘Industrial Tumor’, and ‘Psychedelic Warriors’ that is ‘lost’ to me and the band. The master was lost in my pile of cassette tape hell, that is my collection. I only know one guy who may have it and it’s a guy named Yoshio Cain who plays for the Japanese band Shadow now! He was a die-hard Deceased freak and i sent it only out to him back in 1989! I hope it is ‘found’ one day! It’s got some wild stuff on it :)

Other then that, only rehearsals and stuff like that is floating in ‘the vaults’ :)

When you started out as a band, it seemed you were one of the first to bring technical and speed metal elements, like Voivod and Razor (?) influences, to the music. was this a planned decision, or a natural culmination in the ways metal was being made at the time?

We were so fucking high on any drug we could get our hands on we were off in ‘freakout’ zone. We were honestly just trying to be the most ‘over the top’ band ever. We were taking speed from Sodom, Slayer, DRI, punk, thrash, etc. And mixing it with distorted styled lyrics of dread and death ala ‘War and Pain’ era Voivod, and Venom, Blessed Death, etc. Then ‘attempting’ to put in some Voivod weirdness guitar chords, and some Mercyful Fate ‘evil’, just all of it on hand! We had no idea where it would take us! It was very straight forward and insane! It was basically just a bunch of long- haired teenagers in Slayer and Venom shirts going nuts for metal and aggresson in 1985!

The first Deceased I ever heard, Luck of the Corpse, had tight and fast rhythmic arrangements and workout drumming; what atmosphere were you intending on that album? How did it turn out relative to your expectations?

Well ‘Luck..’ was an experience! I got good and bad memories of that ‘era’ of Deceased. Original guitarist Doug Souther and me were completely on different levels as to where the band needed to go both musically and personality wise at that junction in the bands life. So it ‘clashed’! Neither of us was right or wrong. Just ‘different’ in our beliefs! I think the other guys (Mark and Les) wanted to go with my ‘angle’ more so, and Doug took offense. He was really ready to move on and away from the band. So recording that record had it’s ‘negativity’ to it. Musically it’s just too fast for it’s own good! Trying to still live up to our ‘faster then you’ attitdues and trying to release something ‘good’ for death metal fanatics the world over to bite into. Everythnig was ‘rushed’ and in the end it sits a bit ‘dissapointing’. I loved the songs and I loved the chance to release a record with Relapse and be thought of as ‘competent’ enough to record and be on a record label. That was great! It was ‘neat’ to see your face and music on a cd and vinyl, cassette. It felt ‘good’! We were ‘growing up’ a bit and we had to start somewhere ‘fresh’ as a band.

When you think of the people who enjoy your music, is there anything they have in common (besides enjoying Deceased)?

I’m sure there is! I personally like to call Deceased music supporters, ‘friends’! I don’t like the word ‘fans’. Makes you think you are ‘better’ then them! We are all ‘even steven’ in my eyes. We all get up out of bed, eat, drink, sleep, love music, got our hobbies, families, etc. That’s all it is to me. ‘Seperation’ between bands and their music supporters is pretty ‘high ego’ to me. No need! Let’s all just have fun and keep on laughing through as many good times as we can!!! Look out for each other and keep on keeping on!

People sometimes ask me if I feel I’m being disrespectful to the dead by celebrating morbidity through music. What do you think about this question?

Hmmm — good question! Morbidity through music. I don’t personally see any disresect in it. Death is imminent to all and we all have to challenge it daily, every day on earth. No one knows the exact moment they will leave this place and move on to life beyond. Is there life beyond? Is it peace? Is it despair that awaits? No one truly knows. It’s life’s biggest mystery!

As soon as you’re born you’re dying. I talk about it and ‘subject’ it cuz it too intrigues me as a human being. That’s why ‘deceased’ was such th eperfect name for our band. Being the lyricist of the band i know in my heart how i feel and what my words are being meant when i write them. I am a very ‘up’ guy in my living personality. But death is always looming in the back of my brain for sure. It’s just something that truly intrigues me! Death to some is sadness. To others it’s joy, a time of celebration. To me it’s just ‘death’ and it’s unknown what will be ‘next’!

Metal has gone through huge changes since the middle 1990s. With the internet and the personal computer, it now seems everyone has a label or a zine or a band, and there’s tons and tons of metal “information” with perhaps very little data. What do you think the next stage will be?

Well it is always ‘evolving’ with the times and technology. Some for the better some for worse. But that’s ‘life’! I appreciate anyone who sincerely sits down to write an article or passes on msic to a friend to possibly enjoy. It’s ‘word of mouth’ to me that still runs the metal ‘underground’. I dont like label created ‘hype’ and ‘buzz’, never did! Let the music do the talking is my motto. Too many people sadly fall into the ‘live for the press’ mentality. Bad reviews send off interest to some people. While a ‘shining’ review makes them instantly ‘love’ it. Too weird to me!

I got my own mind, and I think and choose for myself what works for me musically as a music supporter! Sure, take all ‘aspects’ into consideration. Cuz a review can ‘help’ in your selection, but in the end let it be no one but you who decides what ‘you’ like! As for ‘next stages’, hmmm?! It’s hard to say! The internet/computer is definitely running the show now. It’s quick, updated at any given time, right there for anyone to take in! I say that will run the gament for some time still!

I was talking with Ray Miller of Adversary, a band from Indiana, and I said that in many ways I respect most the styles from when the styles we have today were newly forming. He suggested I listen to early Deceased, and I did and heard many influences in the music. What do you think each style of metal (heavy metal, melodic heavy metal, speed metal, death metal, and crossovers like hardcore, etc) represented to the generation that produced it, in terms of both music and attitude? When you brought together these styles, could you recognize each distinct impulse in your work, or did they gel into a new language?

Well i’ve always loved music. I mean anything and everythnig that got me ‘going’ i loved! It is my life’s greatest ecstasy. Early on I fell in love with the Beatles,. I was literaly 3-4 year sold. The choruses… the ‘greatness’ was quite easy to understand to me. Then I got into the ‘hoopla’ of Kiss. The blood of Simmons on the covers, the ‘image’ and visuals. It’s perfect for an 8 year old to sink his/her teeth into! It got me into wanting and craving more outlandish and more ‘over the top’ music. Trying to conquer the ‘extreme’! What is now tediously ‘mellow’ in music standards of today (Van Halen, Ted Nugent, Heart, Benatar, etc.) was once ‘over the top’ and pretty darn ‘heavy’ stuff! I just kept poking my head around in mags, record stores, all of it to ‘find’ something to fix my craving. This got me to the ‘gory’ Eddie and Maiden, razor blade through fingers artwork of Priest, the ‘devils and witches’ of Sabbath! All of it! Which in turn got me to Motorhead, Ramones, Plasmatics, Venom, etc.
It’s all a big ‘turn of the screw’! It just continues to move on and no one can slow it down. So when i got into deceased and we formed the band we knew deep down all of us had a common bond for ‘muis’c first and formost. Sure, we were ‘caught up’ in th eheavy metal mania of the times. We died for sodom, exciter, venom, fate, manaowar, all of it! But we still had our ‘elders’ of musical uprise (The Cars, Kiss, Journey, Blondie, Foreigner, etc) in our hearts as well.

We were living the life style of ‘full blown heavy metal’ but we had our hearts set in music!

So when we started writing we just blew it out as fast and furious as we could. Beyond “caught up” in the times of aggression and drug- fed energy. The ‘attitude’ you speak of was just 100% ‘us’! It was ‘Deceased’! We just got in and ‘did it’! We took all of the aspects of music we loved, speed of hardcore and thrash, melody of traditional heavy metal, choruses and ‘structures’ of traditional kiss styled rock n roll, and the ‘zaniness’ and off kilter of punk and the ilk.

It ‘worked’ for us! Sure some ‘genres’ worked better for us. But it was still all just a big band blender and we kept feeding it with more musical vegetables :)

It seems to me much of the metal from 1978 onward would have lost impetus and extremity if it weren’t for the influence of hardcore music. How do you think on this issue?

Yeah, I can see that indeed! ‘Extreme’ standards have gone ‘haywire’ n the last 20 odd years. It is the ‘way of the world’ on all accounts. Everything is faster paced in the world. More ‘raw’ and much less ‘polished’. No one has time to ‘stop’ anymore. Alot less ‘love’ in the world, sadly so much hate and destruction. A total ‘kill or be killed’ mentality!

No one has time to ‘relax’. It’s just ‘go go go’! So obviously the people creating the music are gonna ‘release’ it in the same way. It’s all humans jsut ‘being human’! That’s just how it is!

Do you read any zines or websites today?

All the time! I’m always taking in the words and wisdom of others. Knowledge is man’s greatest gift, and at times our worse enemy.
But it to me is food for thought and impossible to not ingest.

As I said anyone who sincerely takes time to put up a musical related site or a fanzine, magazine and you read it and instantly fall in love with their ‘personality’ or the ‘charm’ of the crafted entity, that’s just a great feeling! More power to ya’! I know i’ll be reading and searching it all out.

Do you think the political climate in the USA will be more or less tolerant of death metal in five years?

I say it’ll be the same as of today. It seems to ‘stay’ under the radar al lthe time. It seems no one’s minding the ‘smaller’ people of the earth and globe right now, music or non music related. But i see a slow but steady ‘rising’ of this around the world and in time it will outnumber or truly challenge the ‘theories’ and practices and beliefs of alot of the world. Geesh remember when Dee Snider was ‘sooooooooooooo bad’ in the governments eyes?! Wow! How far we’ve come in 20 years!

Around Fearless Undead Machines, it seemed to me that your style as a band shifted from aspiring to a death metallish sound to more of what you were doing with Doomstone’s first album, namely making heavy metal using some of the techniques from death metal. Rhis to me was a brilliant move, as it put you closer in touch with your roots, aspirations and musical loves. How is it that you as a band can pull something like that off, and Immortal could, but virtually every other musician appears mediocre when they attempt something like that?

Well, that’s some nice words coming from you, and we truly appreciate it! All I can say about that ‘time’ is that we as a band had decided we needed to complelty build on our ‘musical strengths’! To sincerely cut the ‘fat’ and ‘extras’ of our sound up to then (‘Blueprints..’ l.p was very bizzare and ‘all over the place’ musically) and do what 100% worked for us! We were still ‘searching’ for our ‘perfect identity’ in music and we at that time, I beleive, found it! Guitarist Mike Smith came forth and said ‘i write guitar riffs this way and this is what i want to write in this band’. I took it into consideration as the band’s ‘arranger’ of songs. Mark and Les (guitar and bass) also put their ideas and words into persepctive and it really felt ‘right’. It was a sincere ‘bonding’ of the band both musically and spiritualy! We ‘got on wth it’ and delivered our finest record up to that point in our eyes. It was very well recieved by the industry and that felt good to us. Doing it completely ‘our way’ and being accepted for it! From there it’s all just ‘fell into place’ since.

I’m told that King Fowley is still a very active tape trader. How do you find the time? And what do you trade?

Well tapes are now cd’rs in our ‘technologically advanced’ world! Haha

I love to ‘pass on’ the music to others who care to listen!. I trade with anyone that wants to spend the time to burn and learn as much as I do. I got so much music I can not afford to buy at this time sadly. And I got tons of music I have collected through my many, many years in the music field in return.

There’s no greater feeling then passing over a Demon Flight cd burn to a friend and watching them get the same smile I got when i first heard it! Or the ‘cheer’ from the guy who says ‘man that fucking Griffin you sent me is bad ass’! It just feels ‘right’ and makes me smile every damn time. I find the time cuz there’ s always time for things you love to do. That’s one of my personal ‘life’ ways of the world!

Were there any other Deceased side-projects besides Doomstone?

Well, Deceased-related, no not really! Unless you count a few ‘one off’ sessions with silly named ‘projects’ me and Mark have done like ‘Masbah’, our tribute to Japan’s Casbah and early Master from Chicago. It was a jam session and we just went ‘silly’ haha. I got that on tape somewhere, and i believe that was 1991. Also there’s ‘talk ‘of me and Mark doing ‘rock brigade’ an all 80’s rock thing where we cover Aldo Nova, Gary Moore, Fist, and Triumph songs, etc.! Les Snyder was/is in Doomstone along with me and that was fun. Doomstone has gone all over the place using ‘session ‘guys and just ‘mixing it up’ to confuse us as well as others. Now I do have a side band called October 31. It’s not Deceased-related outside of me being part of it, but i really enjoy the times and music that band has created! ‘Traditional’ heavy metal is what we file that under!

Does metal exist in the mainstream any longer?

It doesn’t matter to me. The music is the same to my ears! The identity of the ‘captivating’ audience has long gone back to the ‘die hards’. And that’s how I personally see it fit. It’s not for everyone and it’s really by it’s own ‘musical law’ not to be concieved as very ‘commercially viable’. It has it’s ‘surges’ and it’s a rollercoaster love affair to some. But to me it’s just music and it’s always gonna be there for those who want it! I know i always will!!!!!!

What do you make of this hip-hop influence in nu-metal – artistic advancement, or tool of the labels to make music more like that which they have trained the sheep to buy?

Wow man! I really am the wrong guy to ‘invite’ this into metal music. That ‘style’ of art never did a damn thing for me. Outside or inside the genre of metal music. Just does’t ‘click’ for me in the least! Some took to it instantly, others it ‘grew on’. To me it just does not work!!! It tries to break down the ‘barriers’ that as I mentioned metal music kinda set its self in firmly many, many years ago! The ‘funkiness’ of it isn’t needed for metal. The ‘ghetto’ vibe is just so ‘out of place’ in the metal genre. Let it be its own ‘entity’ and stop trying to ‘heap’ it in with the trappings and undying spirit of heavy metal music and it wont be a problem with me!

Old metal records seemed to me to be a brilliant project, because each generation of metalheads ages and then the music they found meaningful, especially the rarities, is forgotten and all we know of that time are the bands with excellent advertising budgets. Is there a way to combat this generational loss in metal?

Well, I tried! Sadly human nature came into play again. And what was once a great dream and ambition of mine became tarnished with false promises and greedy people pretty quick. I tried in vain to keep the label going forward from day one. But too many ‘ex band members’ forgot what it was to play and record music and let it be heard by any and all they could. They wanted all of ‘this’ and all of ‘that’. Like I was to reimburse them for being shit on by their record labels of years ago. I’m just a dude into heavy metal music and I was doing all I could to ‘better’ the cult past by re-reelasing and upgrading formats of their music from a time ago. I’d get old band members of bands I loved names out of phone books and call them up and talk about putting their stuff out again. Some instantly ‘clicked’ with me and my ideas and some past and we went our own ways without a problem. But it was the empty promises and sudden changes of thought half wa through projects that got me ‘down’ on it all. I’d press a bands c.d and then they’d ‘change’ their mind. Or something or someone would surface with a not as enthusiastic feeling for the event!

You know if I was to please every person in every band I was in touch with I’d never have released jack shit! Every band has ‘differences’ and years later some could ‘give a shit’ and some don’t wanna know at all. It got old and I just tried to put it to rest. The label’s still around in small spurts but it’s never to be the same. Some bands appreciated my sincerity, and we still remain great friends, while others now knock me in their ‘revival’ interviews from nostalgic metal, retro- mags etc.

It hurts to see that sometimes, but I know what I did and how I approached it. And i can 100% always live with myself for that!

Is it true that most metalheads quit at 30?

Probably! Some call it ‘the music of youngsters’! And 30 seems to stop the youngster ball rolling for some. Not me! Gonna be 35 in a few months. And I find it healthy, life giving, and still 100% a part of every day I exist on! To me, it’s all in the way you look at things.

Do you think paranoia in this time of history is warranted on the part of the citizen?

Yes! Too many croonies and back stabbers, fakes, cheats, liars, out there. Who sleeps with their windows open anymore at night!? Sad isn’t it! Laziness, greed, the need to ‘stay up’ with another persons fortunes plays evil tricks on the mind of many. The ‘whoever dies with th emost toys wins’ mentality is fucking pathetic! I say take what you got and build on it. Some obviously have it easier in their means/ways to ‘survive’. Some deserve it, some don’t!

But the cards are drawn, make your own dreams! Paranoia is indeed ‘needed’ at this point in life. From this horribly, crummy war, to the indecencies and anger that most of the free world puts on each other daily. It’s fucking sad! Human beings, a dying breed! One day…extinction!

While your early material was urgent, it seems your newer work is more medium paced. What caused this change, in your view?

Urgent was the drugs and the ‘need’ to stay up with the speed factor. Our mentality was speed is ‘extreme’ and we were wanting to be part of the ‘extreme’! We don’t feel that ‘urgency’ in that way anymore! We love fast! Trust me im’ a hyper spazz ‘fast’ guy! Haha

But it’s now ‘called for’ when needed! I do say ‘its alive’ off our lastest e.p is still pretty frantic and indeed ‘fast’!

It’s all in the song and emotion of the day!

How did creating the Doomstone album For Those Whom Satan Hath Joined influence your outlook on songwriting in deceased?

In no real way really! It was just a project that took off in a real bigggg way for awhile. People really liked the ‘Sabbath edge’! The darker substance. The slower ‘brooding’ of the pace of the songs for the most part!

It’s got a great place in metal music. Cuz so many who listen to this genre have that ‘twisted’ underframe.

But as far as Deceased goes, it didn’t really influence me or the band in the least!

Do you listen to any black metal besides Venom?

Well what’s ‘black metal’ anymore? The gurggling, non heavy, non catchy crud of something like Darkthrone? I despise that horrible shit! To me it has to ‘brood’ it has to ‘lurk’ it has to create the ‘dark’ side of things in both atmosphere and personality. That fast insane blast, garage punk/electric shaver styled guitar, and unimpressive or convincing vocals stuff don’t so it for me! I just prefer the ‘trappings’ of a Venom ‘Sacrifice’ or a Mercyful Fate’s ‘Into the Coven’ anyday! I listen to tons of the newer stuff out there and often ‘hyped’ up. And I hope to hear something i can grab onto. But sadly it get sput to the side and discarded over time. Cuz it don’t have depth or stayin gpower for my tastes in music. I think the last great ‘black metal’ record I heard and sincerely appreciated was ‘Ritual’ by Master’s Hammer! And that’s at least 10 years old now! I’m still waiting and hoping for more ‘darkness’ to surface.

What were the handful of most influential bands during the 1980s? 1990s?

Do you mean for me??? Voivod, Venom, Fate, Slayer, Maiden, Queensryche, Motorhead, were big ones for my Deceased musical ‘ideas’ in the 80’s!

The 90’s brought me fewer bands cuz my seeds were set!

I wasn’t as ‘keen’ on ‘influential’ bands like Fear Factory or Deicide or that type!

I am set in the 80s for sure! Though I love tons of music made in the 90’s as well! Just not as ‘influenced’ by it as a player! One band I truly admire from the “90’s” is The Gathering. Beautiful people and gifted as hell musicians and song-writers!

Did these bands differ markedly from the bands of the 1970s?

For me it sure did! Cuz the 70s belonged to the radio for me as a kid! By the time I was into less known ‘album tracks’ by radio artists of my ‘childhood’ it was almost 1980! I was the ‘hit song’ guy! But I quickly learned there’s tons of songs the radio doesn’t play that really got my goose :)

What do you think bands in the 2010 decade will be like? Will there be a resolution to mainstream versus underground, black versus death, funk beats versus metal beats, etc?

Who really knows? I just keep watching this ‘segregation’ unfold from the sidelines and some of it is justified while some is just plain silliness. I really don’t care where it goes really. As i said earlier music is… Music!!! You like something, like it to death! Who’s up who’s down, who’s got the upper hand!

My advice is to just play from the heart with all that you’ve got inside cuz that’s all you have at the end of the day!

Referencing the previous question, it seems to me that metal uses percussion differently than most mainstream music: where mainstream music creates a bounce and an expectation of its fulfillment, metal creates a driving structure which encloses change in harmonic/melodic patterns (by other instruments). What ideas differ between these two groups?

Metal music is known as a driving force so you will find it staying on tap and ‘in the pocket’ most of the time! Metal has a great love for dynamics in the traditional sense ala Maiden or say early Queensryche! But i’d like to see more ‘emotion’ in metal music myself! I love to feel and live the song. The ups and downs of the music. Th topics and choice of ideas could be so widely expanded on in music and tempos and all! Mercyful Fate in the early days were masters of this. The percussion of metal also leaves alot ot be desired at times for me as a listener. That’s why me as a drummer go to a Phil Erhart of kansas or a Carl Palmer of elp for my ‘identity’. Cuz that’s more ‘me’ as a player and where I ‘inspire’ from. Sure you got the influences of dave lombardo or a kim ruzz as well. But it’s sadly less common to see really ‘brilliant’ creators in percussion in more ‘extreme’ metal music!

Hope to see that change in the future!

What non-metal makes your playlists these days?

Well 10 things ‘non metal’ I’ve played alot lately include the new Guano Apes record, any and all No Doubt, Benatar, Berlin’s latest record, early The Fixx, Oingo Boingo, Planet P, Laibach, Einsturzende Nuebauten, and some Switchblade Symphony!

Tons of bands I been cranking lately! I’m all over the place for ‘listening’ pleasures! Haha just me being zany I guess!

If you could wish positive things for metal in these areas, what would they be:

A. Bands: to drop the egos alot of them have and be musicians first and formost! Erase the egos pleaseeeeee! To really cherish and hold in heart the honor of playing music!
B. Labels: to be more respectful to your artists. Treat them as hmans and not business cattle. We are all in this together so even up the angle already!
C. Journalism: to write from the heart and always call it the way you see it!
D. Philosophy: to learn by your mistakes, grow everyday, and challenge ‘challenge’ on every occasion!

It seems to me there are now several live Deceased releases, including a few that didn’t make massive distribution. which is your favorite?

There are? I only know of one! ‘Up the tombstones’ live from Thrash Corner! Unless you count the old cassettes we made in the later 80’s! :) I’m confused here. Or drawing a blank! You decide! Haha We are gonna have some live tracks surfacing soon though! As bonus songs for cd releases! :) As for ‘up the tombstones’, I love the live c.d! It’s ‘us’! It’s the energy, live attitude, and songs we played of that time! Thanks to ray at thrash corner for releasing it and ‘phantasmagoria’ club for having us!

Will Deceased ever do a massive tour?

It’s unknown to me truly! Jobs and home security come first with us. Family, rent, etc.

Yeah all bands on some level deal with it. But we are us and we gotta look out for us first off! If we can ‘arrange’ it then ‘yes’ we will indeed be there! Time off from work aint easy to some of the guys. And I sincerely respect that and understand tenfold. I know if we can we willlllllllllllll!

Mr Fowley, I have heard you are recovering from lung troubles that mean you cannot assume your customary position behind the kit. Will this ever change?

It’s doubtful! We have a new drummer in Dave ‘Scarface’ Castillo and to tell you the truth, he’s just perfect for the band and we will carry on with him as brother, family, and friend! It’s the ‘end of an era’ and the beginning of another! Chapter 1 complete! Now onto chapter 2! Wish us luck! We rise from the grave come midnight!
since you gentlemen have survived this long, where most metalheads are in their teens, do you have any advice about “growing up” and “life and how to live it”?
Do your best to keep your head about you! Have your spirit in hand at all time, wear your heart on your sleeve, and keep your elders’ good ways within you. Never look back and never give in! I wish everyone well in their journey!

How would you have me killed for asking so many questions? Or, more apropos to the interview: is there anything else I forgot that should be answered?

Great interview! It came from the heart and so did my answers! Thnaks for caring long enough to type this and i wish you only the best! Check out the website…

(official) Up the Tombstones

And email me at kingsley22@starpower.net for any info, etc. you may need!

Long live the loud!

Thanks a million and one
King Fowley 3/20/03

The normal question, the first question is, are these cannibals? No, they are not. Cannibalism in the true sense of the word implies an interspecies activity. These creatures cannot be considered human. They prey on humans. They do not prey on each other, that’s the difference. They attack and they feed only on warm flesh. Intelligence? Seemingly no reasoning ability, but basic skills remain from a remembered everyday life. There have been reports of these creatures using tools. But even these are the most basic, the use of tools as bludgeons and so forth. I might point out that even animals have been known to adopt the use of tools in this manner. These creatures are nothing but pure, motorized instinct. We must not be lulled by the concept that they are our family members or our friends. They are not. They will not respond to such emotions. They must be destroyed on sight!

– Dr. Millard, Dawn of the Dead (1978)

Interview: D.L. (Cruciamentum)

June 3, 2012 –
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Old-school authenticity is typically a contradiction in terms in the realm of modern death metal. Cruciamentum, hailing from the UK, seeks to strike back at this notion with their own stated purpose of delivering a “spiked fist in the face of trendy ‘death metal'” with a encapsulating, occult delivery and conviction in its creation.

You’ve gone for an old-school approach, updated with elements from the “mature” and final albums of the old school. What did you pick from each, and why did you take this approach?

There was no conscious decision to adopt the sound we have, it just came naturally. I prefer to just call our music “death metal” rather than applying any other tags to it. To me the phrase “old school” tends to imply just another Nihilist clone rather than a band with any character of their own. However, a lot of the old bands are personal favourites amongst the band’s members, so doubtlessly they are an influence on our writing.

What appeals to you about the old school sound?

Darkness, evil, power and song writing. All the things that modern death metal lacks!

If you could identify your primary influences, what would those be?

Incantation, Absu (Barathrum, and Temples of Offal era), Demigod, Shub Niggurath, Morbid Angel, and Immolation, though a lot of the time it depends on my mood.

Then suddenly the clouds thinned and the stars shone spectrally above. All below was still black, but those pallid beacons in the sky seemed alive with a meaning and directiveness they had never possessed elsewhere. It was not that the figures of the constellations were different, but that the same familiar shapes now revealed a significance they had formerly failed to make plain. Everything focussed toward the north; every curve and asterism of the glittering sky became part of a vast design whose function was to hurry first the eye and then the whole observer onward to some secret and terrible goal of convergence beyond the frozen waste that stretched endlessly ahead.

– H.P. Lovecraft, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath (1927)

When you write songs, do you start with a visual concept, or a riff, or something else?

A mixture of things; I’m a slow writer and different things inspire different parts. Usually it starts with a riff and then progresses naturally from there. Sometimes it can be just a mental image and I try to write riffs to convey that feeling. The riffs are always composed before we practice and then we structure the song in the rehearsal room together as a band.

It seems obvious to me, when all factors are added up, that our society is in decline. However, this opinion is not widely shared. Why do you think this is?

This is an interesting subject, but I don’t think that it is something that can be easily summed up in a couple of paragraphs. I do agree with you that there has been a strong moral decline in the last decade; people have become lazier, apathetic and more selfish. Many I have heard attribute this to the economic decline of the last few years, and although I don’t doubt that the inevitable depression caused in worse affected areas by poverty and unemployment is to blame, but I think that these problems are older than the economic problems. Bear in mind I am only 26, but I have noticed since my childhood a huge rise of an entitlement attitude in people in England. People seem to believe now that they are entitled to more, and many will grab at whatever they can lay their hands on, people have started to have children younger so that they can receive benefits and lead a more comfortable and lazy life. No doubt the obvious neglect on these “unwanted” children is having a serious effect on the younger generation’s behaviour as well. Perhaps with people’s needs being catered to more easily we have just simply eradicated the need for friendlier, close-knit communities? To be honest, I have no answers to these questions, just speculation of my own. I’d be more than happy to discuss this at further length in person with anyone interested though.

What would define “success” for you with your music?

In terms of Cruciamentum, I think that we have already reached it by writing and recording music that we are immensely proud of. We have no interest in making money, extensive touring, furthering our social lives, or anything else. As long as we have made something that we ourselves are happy with, that is all that matters.

Do you believe underground metal is still a viable form of music?

Of course, the current underground has produced some of my favourite bands! Bands like Necros Christos, Dead Congregation, Ignivomous, etc., I believe can stand by the classic bands such as Morbid Angel, Incantation, Deicide etc. The musical climate is just different these days, if the bands I mentioned previous came out in the early 90s they would have been much bigger, these days mainstream metal is more about image than musical content which is why the “true” bands of today remain in virtual obscurity.

What distinguishes great music from bad? Can it be distilled into technique, or is it something less easily defined?

Great music is music that connects with its listener. I don’t think technique has anything to do it, just the ability to do your own thing and do it with enough conviction that it can be conveyed in the music.

What releases have you produced so far, and where are you taking the band at this time? What’s next for Cruciamentum?

So far we released a one-track demo in 2008, and the 2009 demo Convocation of Crawling Chaos. We’re currently writing material for a MLP which we hope to start recording in a few months time, which will be released through Nuclear Winter Records. Expect around 25 minutes of new music. We also have started playing our first foreign gigs in Italy, Belgium, Germany, and Finland.

Did you ever study music theory or take lessons? Did this help you or slow you down in achieving your musical goals?

I’m not sure about the other members, but I took a few lessons when I started playing guitar and then gave up and taught myself. I’ve also studied Music and Music Production. The theory helps in understanding each other when writing new material, but we’re not a complex band, and we don’t compose based on music theory.

Some have said that rock music is about individualism, or escaping the rules of society and nature to do whatever the individual wants to do. However, some have also said that heavy metal breaks with that tradition with its “epic” and impersonal view of life. Where do you fit on the scale?

I believe that to be a dated concept now. I’m sure that was very much true in the early days of rock-n-roll while our parents and grandparents were young, but since then I believe rock music and metal has become just another genre that has found its niche in popular culture where it can be watered down and devalued for popular consumption. I genuinely couldn’t say for sure where we fit into this, I think that is partly to be decided by how the listeners interpret us.

One of the most striking signs of the decay of art is the intermixing of different genres.

– Johann Wolfgang van Goethe, Propylaea (1798)

When Hellhammer said, “Only Death is Real,” it launched legions of death metal and grindcore bands who showed us through sickness, misery and sudden doom (in their lyrics) that life is short, manipulations are false, and we need to get back to reality. Where should the genre go from there?

I think that that phrase sums it all up perfectly! Death is a key element to life, and that is something that everyone should pay some thought to. I wouldn’t say that metal is there specifically to remind people of this fact though; there are plenty of different directions to take the lyrical and philosophical approach of the music in.

Is there a relationship between how an artist sees the world, and the type of music he or she will then make? Do people who see the world in similar ways make similar music?

Yes, I think there is some truth in that. Although the personalities in Cruciamentum are different, all members have a similar attitude. Personally speaking, I have quite a negative outlook on life, I don’t think someone who is part of a popular social group would feel the same emotions that I do that are required to channel into making the music we do.

Do you think your music will have a “real world” effect, other than people buying and listening to CDs? Will they take your ideas and do something of them?

I doubt it. Due to the nature of the music, we will already be preaching to the converted, to reach a wider audience we would have to severely compromise our style, or even play a different style of music, and Cruciamentum exists to create dark music, not to preach.

When did Cruciamentum form, and what was the goal? How long did it take to produce your first recordings, and how have you changed since then?

The band dates back to 2005, though it took me until late 2008 to finally find all the right musicians for the band. Before the Convocation… demo, there was probably around an hour of music written, but the demo was such a huge leap forwards from that material that it has all been abandoned. The Convocation… demo took roughly around a year, as I fired the entire line-up at one point, and re-wrote the songs with the current line-up. Then there were numerous set backs in the recording process, and further set backs in having the demos printed. Hopefully that is the end of the troubles now though!

As for changes, since our inception we have improved more than I could have imagined back in 2005. The band finally has all the right people, the attitude is right, and we’re moving forwards.

Do you think the “underground” still exists?

Yes, it has simply changed from what it used to. With the internet making it easier to access some music, it has obviously become more widespread, and to a degree perhaps watered down, but there are plenty of die-hards with the right spirit.

Can you tell us what equipment you use, and what production techniques you use for recordings?

There’s nothing special equipment wise. We use BC Rich and Jackson guitars, various FX pedals, Warwick basses, Pearl drums and whatever amplifiers we can get our hands on. For the demo we recorded the drums at The Priory Studios with Greg from Esoteric, and I recorded, mixed and mastered the rest. I think we will do the same for the next recording; I’ve bought a lot of new equipment since the demo, so we should get a better sound this time round.

Yet I am not more sure that my soul lives, than I am that perverseness is one of the primitive impulses of the human heart as one of the indivisible primary faculties, or sentiments, which give direction to the character of man. Who has not, a hundred times, found himself committing a vile or a stupid action, for no other reason than because he knows he should not? Have we not a perpetual inclination, in the teeth of our best judgement, to violate that which is Law, merely because we understand it to be such?

– Edgar Allan Poe, The Black Cat (1843)

Interview: Mike Perun (Cianide)

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Cianide are massive stalwarts of American death metal for whom little has changed in twenty years. Their impact is a bludgeoning and brute force one derived almost wholly from the genre’s progenitors; Slaughter (Canada), Hellhammer/Celtic Frost, Slayer are touched with the plodding heavy metal of the previous generation to shore up their unwavering sound.

Interview originally from Heidenlarm e-zine #5.

When you formed Cianide, how did you describe the music you wanted to create?

Always was, is and will be: DEATH METAL. Granted we’re probably not the exact textbook definition of the genre, but that is what we’ve always set out to be. Could explain why we’ve managed to outlast a lot of more “popular” or “successful” of the bands that started around the same time we did. Our vision has always stayed the course and to play any other kind of music would just be stupid.

Of the artists who influenced you, which most directly affected your conception of the style of music you create with Cianide?

Of all of our influences the bands that immediately come to mind are FROST/HELLHAMMER (of course!), SLAUGHTER and MASTER/DEATHSTRIKE. Bands that incorporated various speeds/tempos as opposed to just speed for speed’s sake 100% of the time. Another band is POST MORTEM. “Coroner’s Office” is a fuckin’ classic!

The first Cianide album seemed to me to be more grinding than death metal, straying into the ambiguous and underexplored territory where Bolt Thrower, Blood and later Napalm Death wander. a) Do you think this perception is (semi-)accurate and b) what do you see as the differences emerging on later albums?

a. I guess you could say it’s accurate, though at the time we were just doing what we were able to do and not giving a fuck. Looking at the big picture, not a lot of bands call themselves Death Metal and play the sick, slow, dirgy stuff. I guess they call it gay “stoner” now. Remember when it used to be called DOOM METAL??

b. Well obviously we’ve picked up the pace a bit!! Theres only so many times you can hit an open E chord over a slow drum beat. Now were doing open E over faster beats!! Har Har! Seriously, slow heavy shit was just the order for that time for us. Mainly we got Andy on drums and he was more capable to handle faster stuff after Jeff left, so things just got faster from there. We haven’t completely abandoned our death-dirge roots though.

Over the course of development, Cianide has landed – for lack of a better phrase – into the category of “old school death metal,” joining luminaries such as Asphyx and Morpheus Descends. How do you think this music is different in its aim from other forms of death metal?

For us, we’re just playing the music that WE want to hear. If people call it “old school” well fuck, we are old school! I can’t speak for any other bands, but for us, this is the only way we know how to do it. It’s hard to pin down because nowadays bands like Cannibal and Morbid Angel are labeled “old school” but I think you must be referring to an actual “old school” sound. If that’s what you mean, you could say a band like CIANIDE is sort of a preservation of very early death metal. We’re not looking to break any new ground with this, nor do we have any aspirations for commercial success (though that would be nice if it came along!!), just trying to emulate the sound and style of the ancient GODS OF DEATH.

Someone once drew the distinction between hum-along metal like Motörhead or Venom, and “subversive metal,” meaning stuff that tries to be avantgarde, progressive or regressive. It seems to me that no band since Venom has captured the sense of popular and hum-along (really, is there a better term for this? songs that stay in your head and are relevant to aspects of everyday normal life) metal in the same way Cianide has, with bouncy, heavy, catchy songs hammering home simple ideas in smoothly integrated structures. How did you achieve this, and what are your thoughts on the accuracy of these statements? (I am no big fan of the hacked together terms like hum-along and subversive, but for now am not sure what I’d use in their place except extensive tedious descriptions)

I agree with the statement and take it as a compliment! Again we just write what we like and want to hear. Every riff we write has to fucking kill, no filler songs or parts with CIANIDE as far as I’m concerned. Bands with catchy choruses is the style of metal that we grew up with so it only makes sense that we would emulate that. Even stuff like early Death, Terrorizer, Repulsion, Massacre and even Morbid Angel had choruses that you could consider “catchy”. I can appreciate bands that play overly technical, but most of the time I prefer something that sticks in my head and kicks my ass.

Cianide seems to have stayed with no single label for more than an album. Is this true? Are there reasons the band had for doing this, or was this a product of what I call the “usual label chaos,” e.g. labels falling apart, dropping bands at random and going bankrupt?

Our first label, Grindcore merely changed their name to Red Light so our first two releases were basically on the same label. They went chapter 13, so we did DDD with Lost Horizon. That label was basically two friends of ours wanting to do a label. They were flipping the bill and nobody was asking us to dance at the time so we said, “what the fuck”. They went belly up also. Merciless re- released DDD on vinyl and did our latest, Divide and Conquer and are all set to our our forthcoming “The Age of Hell’s Rebirth”. So far so good.

Someone once told me I was not “open-minded” for automatically hating some band that attempted to merge alternative rock and metal; what do you think?

Liking different styles of music is actually just a matter of taste and really has nothing to do with having a so-called “open mind”, which has been such an over-used term ever since the 80’s that it is now pointless and irrelevant to label anybody as such (closed minded). What this egotistical person actually means is, ‘my opinion in music is much better than yours because I have no real convictions and simply like what is deemed “cool” by the mainstream, even though I think I’m hip and into new and crazy things just to impress ditzy college girls’.

Tell that person to stick his alternative/metal/rock/bastard hybrid up his open-minded ass.

Metal has changed in demographic since the so-called “glory (hole) days” of 1988-1994, with a broader and bigger audience now tuning in to even the most antisocial black metal. What changes do you think this demographic has caused to occur in the music itself?

From what I can see, when a band achieves some sort of success be it either underground or commercial, the band will try to write what it thinks is popular in an attempt to “keep up with the times” (ie. Entombed, Morgoth, Mayhem). On the other side of the coin, if a band is successful and stays true to their original ideals, they still will get dismissed by all the death-metal weenies and black metal trendies who are only into listening to shitty bands that YOU never heard of. So in essence, nothing has really changed.

Will you ever work to re-release the old Cianide albums?

There has been talk about re-releasing the first two on vinyl but nothing serious as of yet. We are planning on putting all our demos out on a double cd, with all kinds of extras and shit. Should rule.

A Descent Into Hell seems to me, sonically, to be one of the “heaviest” albums ever created, and not just through production – how did you achieve this, and what was your aim in creating that album? (see disclaimer above about hacked together terms again)

Again, we just do what we do. I think at that time we were tuned to like Z or something. We did all of those songs live, most only in one or two takes. The kicks and snare were sampled though. I remember after we got done doing the first song, the engineers came in and they were like, “everything sounds good guys but we do need more bass” we thought they were serious. Then they started laughing at us and they were like, “jeezzzzus, you guys are FUCKING HEAVY!!” “Decent…” is also a personal favorite of mine. I think it’s impossible to get that sound back again but who knows…………..

Has Cianide toured, or is it more of a band that you do when not leading a normal life?

Tour?? Shit, we’re lucky we play out once a year!! The time for touring is past. We’re smart enough to realize early on that playing underground metal, be it Black, Death or otherwise, wasn’t going to be a very lucrative career choice. Insecure “we’re truer than thou” hard-on’s would probably classify us as hobbyists, and they may be right. A hobby is defined as any activity that one enjoys in their spare time. Though I guarantee you this, we’ll still be doing what we do long after today’s hip-name-to-drops have changed their style/names/haircuts and end up in the washed up file cut-out bins.

To put it bluntly, what are you guys like in real life? Are you closer to maniacs who live out the lyrics to cianide songs, or artists who metaphorically describe what they perceive?

We’re just your above average beer swilling metalheads. What you see is what you get. No tattoos, no gay piercings. Dirty, Ugly, loud and proud!

One other thing about Cianide that is gratifying: a sense of humor. What do you see as the role of humor in “serious” metal? Do you consider Cianide a serious band? If not, what motivates you to have the standards you do in the creation of the music?

I’m not really into “joke” or “message” bands. Injecting humor into Metal can be tricky. It’s hard to do it correct without sounding lame. Obviously we’re not a joke band, but we like to inject some humor, like our thank you lists are always filled with jags. POST MORTEM were the originators of that. At least that’s who we stole it from!! I love who I am and love being a Metalhead. But there are some people out there who take this music and themselves way too seriously who are just rubbers. It’s just music after all. Who know’s though, I’m sure to some people it looks like I take it too seriously. The grass is always greener……………

If you could tour with any two death metal bands in history, which would they be?

Slaughter – original line-up
Master – original line-up

What do you think of the following:

1. Asphyx – I have “The Rack” on cassette…..good heavy death metal
2. Master – The early stuff is immortal…the new stuff ain’t so bad
either
3. Suffer (SWE) – never heard them
4. Kittie – never heard them
5. Carnage (SWE) – Entombed clones

Do you have any views on religion? How religion effects politics? How this affects us now?

Religion and politics are needed to keep the general population in line. I think they’re both brilliant. You can’t have people just running wild, doing what they want. It sounds good on paper and makes for a lot of cool lyrical ideas, be it Metal, Punk or otherwise, but when you return back to the real world the majority of people out there simply cannot handle the responsibility of being an individual, and I don’t want to deal with them. It’s not my job.

Religion, of course, does make some men better, and perhaps even many men. There can be no doubt of it. But making them better by filling their poor heads with grotesque nonsense is an irrational and wasteful process, and the harm it does greatly outweighs the good. If men could be made better — or even only happier — by teaching them that two and two make five there would be plenty of fools to advocate that method, but it would remain anti-social none the less. If the theologians could only agree on their doctrines their unanimity might have some evidential value, just as the agreement of all politicians that the first duty of the citizen is to obey them and admire them has some evidential value. It may not be true, but it is at least undisputed by all save a small fraction of heretics, which is certainly something. Fortunately for common sense, the theologians are never able to agree. Even within the sects, and under the more rigid discipline, there is constant wrangling, as, for example, between the Jesuits and the Dominicans. Thus the cocksureness of one outfit is cancelled out by the ribald denial of all the rest, and rational men are able to consign the whole gang to statistics and the Devil.

– Henry Louis Mencken

What are your views on wealth, and its ideal relationship to individual humans?

People who go around saying, “money isn’t everything” are usually already rich and never had to work hard to achieve their wealth/success. Give me enough money so I don’t ever have to work again in my life and I’ll show you one happy, fat little man!!!

Do you support or reject anti-bestiality laws?

Hey, whatever blows yer skirt up!

What in your view are the a) strengths and b) weaknesses that metal took on by going “underground” instead of attempting to be a mainstream genre?

For one thing, since all true metal is underground it is not scrutinized and kept in check by the politically correct mainstream. Bands can say and write whatever they feel without any pressure of pissing this one off or offending others. Imagine how lame your favorite metal bands would become if they had to kow-tow to the whole music industry just to create music. I have one word for people who may disagree with this: METALLICA!! I love the fact that metal is underground. The people who want it know where to get it. It sucks for the bands who I’m sure need to play to eat, but that’s not my problem.

What do you think of nu-metal? Can metal ever be in the mainstream, like it was with Black Sabbath?

Any band can get big if marketed properly and shoved down the masses throats. For instance, if MTV tells their audience that Christraping Black Metal is “cool” and says that the bandmembers are “cute”, all Black Metal bands would get huge and you would not like them anymore. Sabbath were/are huge, but in their day, they never got any radio airplay (except for “Paranoid” late at night), let alone videos. They just did it through word of mouth and constant touring. As for nu-metal, it’s just like the 80’s. Instead of big- hair you have buzz-cuts. Instead of eyeliner you have piercings. Instead of glamed out clothes you have tribal tattoos. The music is just a watered down, bastardized, marketed and hyped version of the real deal.

Does metal keep evolving, or is it cyclic?

Everything is the same, just different haircuts!!

What’s the next Cianide album going to be like?

Just like the last one, except HEAVIER!!

Will you ever do a live album?

Hopefully someday. Guess you need to play live to do that!!!

What is your stance on mp3 trading of rare materials?

It doesn’t affect me either way, if I hear something I’ll just go out and buy it.

I’m the same way, if I like something, I’ll go and buy it. I have other things to do on my computer than sitting there waiting for a song to download, like looking for porn!! I do think it’s good for people to hear what a band sounds like from their website etc before they go out and buy it. It’s just another medium.

Did Cianide have any demos? If so, what were they?

We did three official demo’s: “Funeral” in 1990, “Second Life” in 91′ and “Cianide Kills” in I think 1993. We also had 2 different three-song promos for DDD and Divide……, but those weren’t really for sale. Everything will probably be on a single release for CURSED PRODUCTIONS if we can get off our lazy asses and get started on it.

Are reactions to Cianide different in Europe and Asia versus the USA?

Reactions seem to be pretty much the same everywhere. We’re regarded as throwbacks from all over!!

Are there any metal zines or websites you read, and, if so, what makes them useful to you?

The only zines I’ll plug that come to mind are Metal Curse and Midwest Metal cuz they are cool!

Will metal survive the wave of hip-hop music in America?

It already is as far as I can tell. Rap is already regarded as a joke whose core audience is rich, white, suburban kids. Hip-hop and rap do provide a very important service to us Metal fans however for which I’m truly thankful: BY KEEPING A GREAT MAJORITY OF ALL MORONS, MEATHEADS AND FUCKUP’S OUT OF OUR SCENE!!!! Every time I happen to turn on some MTV special or video, I get a big smile and feel great inside. That’s right dummies, keep being spoon-fed your entertainment you mindless fools! Yo Dawg!!! Bling Bling!! Comedy!!

Does metal’s being different from jazz, blues, hip-hop make it a cultural or political statement?

The fact that underground metal is the only form of rock and roll that has yet to be turned into a marketable mainstream commodity surely says something. It almost happened to death metal in the early 90’s. Then Nirvana killed that, thankfully!! STAY UNDERGROUND!!!

Anything I forgot you’d care to add?

I think you covered it all my man!!

Thanks for the interview. Visit the official CIANIDE WEBSITE at www.cianide-metal.com

Interview: Anders Odden (Cadaver)

May 30, 2012 –

Anders Odden is here with us from the band Cadaver, inc. He was an original member of Cadaver by its release schedule, and was with them on their two most popularly-known works on Earache records. He has now launched with others Cadaver, inc., which is an entirely different type of music within the same genre.

When did Cadaver form and what bands inspired the members at the time?

The first Cadaver was formed when a Black metal band called Baphomet split in 1988. We then got the bassplayer from Decay Lust and recorded the first album in 1989/90. The bands who inspired us at the time were Voivod, Slayer, Carcass, Celtic Frost and Morbid Angel.

Do any of you have strong political, religious, or philosophical beliefs, and what are they?

I’m a public enemy. I doubt that anything created by man ever will bring us to a higher level. I deny the church and all its powersymbols. Why is it that all the main religions come out of the middle east?! Religon and politics are there to oppress people. I feel the life we have today is basically without any goals and I’d like to own a little stuff as possible. I tend to get lots of shit piled up anyway, but I’m a fan of throwing stuff away. I dont know, maybe I’m full of BS…

If a drunken man falls down the stairs, he does not feel what would be painful for me. Some say the same applies to youthful indifference to death. How do you feel this influenced, if at all, your music?

I don’t think it had anything to do with what our music was. We just wanted to be able to play as good as our favorite bands, nothing more.

Did you have any favorites in the Swedish death metal genre? What did you think of God Macabre, Demigod, Dismember and Therion?

Not really. Of the bands you mention I’ve only heard Dismember and Therion. I like Black metal more than death metal.

Now that you’ve come back with Cadaver, inc., are people responding to the older material as well as the newer? Are you going to repress the first two albums?

We have played Innominate and Corrosive Delirium from Hallucinating and Mr. Tumour’s Misery from In pains… live. Those songs go down really well, but Earache has no plans for reissuing yet. It will be done some day with lots of extrastuff on it I guess. I have tons of live, demos and unreleased shit around my house, so it will be done.

It seems to me that …In Pains is from the same era as the first Darkthrone album, where metal experimented with mood and mellower textures in the death metal style. What inspired this album’s genesis?

This is easy to say now looking back. It’s never in your thought when you make stuff what the historic aspect of things will be. In Pains was released around the same time as Blaze in the Northern sky, so I felt we were very different band then. In 1992 I turned into industrial music for some time and didn’t follow black metal until 95 again. I saw the death metal era end in 92/93 when black metal revitalized everything, but felt it was my past and didnt care that much. You got to remember that the difference between death/black wasnt that obvious before 91/92. Mobid Angel is the best example of a band in between the genres. I always wanted to gain that sort of independent ground for my stuff and this is where I feel Cadaver Inc. belong. Along towards the genres and trends.

The first album had a tuba player as a member of the band. While some called this a gimmick, it seemed a natural experiment at thetime, since the tuba provides a gnarly low-end sound that could complement higher guitars.

What do you think of this when looking back upon it, and for what reason was this choice made?

It was trombone. You have to remember that Celtic Frost inspired us very much in the experimenting with things such as this. Into the Pandemonium and To Megatherion have lots of “brass” sections and weird things in it. It is still our intro when we play live, so it’s a trademark I guess.

Who are your personal musical idols?

In metal it’s forever Slayer, Celtic Frost, Voivod and Morbid Angel. These bands offer their own personal twist that you can hear on all their records. Apart from this I’m a big fan of classical composers such as Grieg and Mozart. They are true genius.

If you recorded another album in the worldview of the original Cadaver, what do you think it would be?

It will never happen.

What’s next for Cadaver, inc? Are you planning to evolve further in the direction that seems to be current, or taking a different step?

We have started working on the next album and I can reveal that it’s going to be much darker than this one. If Discipline is a agressive record the next will be more insane. I have left some of the writing to our drummer Czral this time, and his ideas are very sick. It’s very inspiring to have a band with such a high level of musicalityflowing. We are sure the next record will bring us a long step forward and that’s our focus all the time.

You mention that you like throwing things away. This touches a part of all of us I think that wishes to be unencumbered by material things. I’ve noticed many of the more intelligent people I know choose to live light given the unstable nature of the times and the tedious requirements of having stuff. It also resembles the destruction of memories and irrelevant or enslaving alliances, metaphorically and in dreams (from the relation of others). Do you think that removal or consolidation of stuffs, let’s call it garbage removal, is philosophically significant at this time in history?

You are probably right that this is something lots of people now are turning to. I think it’s a reaction towards the main-religion now, which is consumerism. Some people feel very attached to their stuff, and I think it’s a disturbing thing to be this way. We think what we have is important to us, but it’s all tools or necessities for living. The last time I moved me and my wife gave away 5 (!) big plastic bags of clothing. It’s ridiculous to have so much to wear, and we said farewell to a time in our life by throwing it away. It made me think, how the hell did I get so much stuff. I could not remember buying it all or anything. It’s more important to gain selfrespect by doing something rather than buying yourself status. Money alone makes no-one happy, and that’s the bottom line in anyones life. Happiness.

What do you think are the similarities between black metal and industrial music?

I don’t know how anyone see the similarities. It all depends on your perspective about what you think is black metal or industrial. Industrial to me is Skinny Puppy and Front 242. They are not very close to BM.

It seems to me that both have a similar approach to rhythm, relative to death or heavy or speed metal, and that both also focus on atmosphere and originate in a classically-influenced genre. Do you like the music of Kraftwerk, Tangerine Dream and Einsturzende Neubauten?

I enjoy Kraftwerk yes. I just have one Einstrutzene album which is great, but I’ve never sat down to listen to Tangerine Dream.

I’m going to rip off a line from Wrath of Averse Sefira (who could name songs from Hallucinating Anxiety in detail when queried at random, not having heard the album in seven years) who said that Celtic Crost in many ways were the first to unify visual aspect, and presentation, of their band with the content of their music and its raw, gnarly aesthetic. in many ways, they birthed grandeur in metal also. Is this something you feel?

Well, they had it all for themself for a long time and came up with very original concepts for album covers, lyrix and musical experimentation. They took metal places it had not been before with their avant garde style of composing. I admire their original style very much and they are the only band I really want to see on a reunion tour.

I agree that Grieg and Mozart are genius. How much of the effect of classical music do you feel is a result of its form, or the abstraction of artistic form in general (in view of jazz, Hendrix and progressive derivations of classical in modern popular music), where form is defined as the method of artistic presentation itself relative to the content, or unique expression within, each work?

Classical music from the 18th century (Grieg, Wagner etc. ) was a result of anti-darwinism and used to show that humans were special and not animals. I think the extreme metal has many of the same thoughts behind it as it’s normally very strict and concrete when it’s performed. The kind of metal we play has no room for improvisation in the way of music with blues/jazz roots. Form and content belong together to produce the music we make. I dont know what you are compearing jazz and hendrix to this for, but maybe I didnt understand your question..(?)

Do you compose with emphasis on rhythmic expectancy, or write riffs for conclusive melodic phrasing?

It’s too abstract to say it this way. I just play what sounds good and experiment alot with strange chords and melodic lines. I’m a riffmaker who needs a great drummer to complete my ideas. I view the overall sound first and foremost.

I asked earlier: if you recorded another album in the worldview of the original Cadaver, what do you think it would be? and you said: “It will never happen.” If we created a temporary reality somewhere where someone like you and the original members of the band somehow came together now, independent of this reality entirely, what would the next Cadaver album sound like? Imagine outside influences of tedium like job, mortality, items, etc.

What was will never be again. I have so different views on music to the rest of the original members that it’s nothing I would even like to do for fun. We have no plans for this and I’m pretty sure it’s never gonna happen…

You mentioned that Czral was writing more of the material on this round. Are you still influenced by black metal and industrial, or reaching toward a different sound?

We have written 3 new songs now. Czral has one song which is entirely with his riffs, and the other 2 have 1 riff from him and 1 riff from LJ in it. It sounds very exiting to us right now, but we dont know where it’s taking us yet. It’s more midpaced tempos now, but the blastbeats are still there too. I dont know what kind of industrial you’re taking about, but it’s got some more black metal to it than “discipline” so far.

How do you write songs as a band? Have you taken advantage of virtual songwriting (sending MP3s, tapes, WAVs, CDRs, to each other)?

We have 1 rehearsal a week were we try to complete 1 song each time. It’s a very ambitious project, but it’s forcing us to work on ideas all the rest of the week. We just meet now and then to check out riff and ideas with each other at home. We all live pretty close so that’s why it works.

I saw a little of your Milwaukee Metalfest performance last year (I think – I was wasted, and never visited the bar – it may have been a couple years ago) and it seemed like the music acquired a very linear quality with the tunneling dynamics of the hall. What would it be like to write music if you practiced in a huge thunderous concert hall?

That would have been useless. We play with volume down to hear all details and work towards recording in a studio, so the less noisy the better. I’m not 15 years old anymore…

I like the idea of practicing softly for better discernment. Do you play any acoustic instruments? By the same principle, they must also strengthen musicianship.

I play the piano and acoustic guitar too yes.

Do any of the members of Cadaver, inc endorse any lifestyles including drugs, cannibalism, sodomy, genocide, war, polygamy, polyamory or Judeo-Christian homegrown goodness?

We are so different people privately that I really don’t know that much about the rest of the guys in those terms. I don’t like bands that assure people they are normal all of the time. What is normal? I’m a creative person that seeks oppertunities for myself, and I work in the music-business fulltime. It’s lifestyle bound together by the music, all of the above is for people that needs a hobby. . .
very interesting. as a professional musician, you are here for musical reasons only. this explains the musical contributions of your works. what do you think are your largest contributions, as a musician, to the musical lexicon of death and black metal?

I dont know really. I find that the people who really remember what Cadaver did are mostly musicians themselves. It’s not easy for me to see what my contribution might be. Maybe it’s almost nothing so far, and that my real contribution will be in the future.

Anything else you’d like to talk about?

Another thing, I feel very much more in relation to the Black metal scene than the death metal scene of today. If you file Cadaver Inc. under anything, it should be black metal.

Thank you. Keep on buying CD’s so we can release as many as we can write!

This eternal accusation against Christianity I shall write upon all walls, wherever walls are to be found—I have letters that even the blind will be able to see. . . . I call Christianity the one great curse, the one great intrinsic depravity, the one great instinct of revenge, for which no means are venomous enough, or secret, subterranean and small enough,—I call it the one immortal blemish upon the human race. . . . And mankind reckons time from the dies nefastus when this fatality befell—from the first day of Christianity!—Why not rather from its last?—From today?—The transvaluation of all values! . . .

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Antichrist

Monotheistic religions alone furnish the spectacle of religious wars, religious persecutions, heretical tribunals, that breaking of idols and destruction of images of the gods, that razing of Indian temples and Egyptian colossi, which had looked on the sun 3,000 years: just because a jealous god had said, “Thou shalt make no graven image.”

– Arthur Schopenhauer, Religion: a Dialogue (1851)

Interview: Lori Bravo (Nuclear Death, Raped)

the anus.com metal development team was lucky to catch lori bravo during a break from work with her new band, Raped. she was kind enough to consent to an off-the-cuff interview which had some remarkable results.

as those who are fans of early death metal know, lori and her band nuclear death were instrumental in developing the genre in its early days. still carrying touches of thrash from the previous generation, she and her bandmates forged forward with a unique and devastating style of music. read on to learn what inflames her passion and willpower toward the making of metal.

Nuclear Death sounded to me like it descended halfway from the progressive extremist speed metal (“thrash”) of the previous decade, mixing that with its fundamentally deathy influence. If you could name something that you’d heard in the time leading up to the creation of the nuclear death works, what influenced you the most?

I would say…Discharge,Venom,Mercyful Fate,Black Flag and Russian Classical.

What art do you enjoy outside of metal?

Actually…I do not listen to alot of ‘metal’…..I am into punk and hardcore, jazz and fusion, classical, indie-rock…..and of course the works of Goya, Picasso, Bosch, Giger, Mapelthorpe, Giger, Rimbaud, Smith, Morrison, Plath, Baudelaire, Whitman, Kerouac, Manson, Wilde, Cobain, Saffo……..etc.

Do you consider art to have relative grades of complexity?

Of course…but I also….believe the most simplest of lines can be most complex in nature.

Is your current band metal, or a metal fusion? i ask because many metal artists choose after an underground success to turn to the mainstream somewhat, mostly looking for new worlds to conquer.

I do not believe that I have even achieved what you dubbed as ‘successful’…..My new band is called RAPED…and it is a fusion of my anger,jealousy,hatred,hopefulness and liberation from boyfriends,bullshit and sexism!!!I call it arte-sexed-dark-edged-fuckyourface-off music….or GRRRLCORE!!

What do you think about drugs, group sex and fascism?

Drugs are how we as a society seem to cope…I mean EVERYBODY’S on SOMETHING!!!Group sex is great…do it SAFELY….I am in the sex business..I strip….SAFTEY..PEOPLE….I CAN’T STRESS THAT POINT ENOUGH!!!Fascism in shit…but it is a big part of life…..I don’t think it is going to go away…so we,as artists,need to address the issue and alert the public on how much it ruins us internally and externally as many times as we can write a song ,paint a canvas, make a film or make a statement!

If you saw a black spot on a purely white wall, would you consider the wall to have an entrance, or the spot to have a boundary?

Entrance…I don’t beleive in boundaries…that is limited to me…I don’t like limits!!!!

What in your mind are the usefulness of these states: caprice and serendipity?

I Love impulsiveness in all things!!!! Spur of the moment……A whim of change….some of the best things are built from this lovely little spurt!Beautiful ‘accidents’…..serendipity is how I have managed to write every fucking thing that is good and paint a canvas that is worth viewing!!!!! I am a creative FUCKUP!!!

If you were suspended in a reality where another Nuclear Death album might be made, what in your mind might it sound like?

If Steve and I did another…I think it would be an in your face muse….RAPED is the result of what ND spawned.

If you had four minutes to give advice to a young metal band, it might be…?

Don’t sign anything without a lawyer, never compromise your principles, be yourselves, listen to your inner voices and take NO shit!!!!

What do you think about commerce, morality and the holiday of Easter?

Trade and buy/sell rules the world…enjoy it…Sexually-speaking…let’s fuck!Even I have morals…..Have CLASS people! You can be Hardcore without losing your integrity….Easter…..I like the iconography aspects and rituals…..rising from death…aint it sweet…..Bunnies for everyone!!!!!

I like the shorter song format with some bands, offhandedly naming Carcass and DRI, as it allows a fragment of a consciousness to momentarily express itself and vanish, where a full song might have to artificially include other subject matter to flesh out the shit. Then again, if you write your lyrics when wasted or careless, what flows might be pure subconscious dialogue and therefore might be effective. It seemed to me some study went into the Nuclear Death lyrics, no matter how hasty their creation. What sorts of ideas and systems of thought were influencing you at the time?

Alcohol,drugs,reading,sex,fear and dreams.

What do you think of capitalism, Christianity and Zionism?

Good and bad….I hate corporate-owned anything…but what are you going to do….do it yourself and put it on the net……christianity has been so fucking twisted and raped of its origins and beliefs,honestly,I think Christ would want to kill those fuckers,I believe every people should be able to ‘go home’…we all deserve our place.

Are you a large fan of any mainstream media?

I am pop cultured,you know? I like anything that I find interesting!

Often relationships in bands are as stressed as two cops dating. Do you have any advice in the most general sense in this area?

Fuck….it’s a marriage,respect eachother.

Do you own guns or dogs, and what kind of vehicle do you drive? Do you see these questions as destructive to the persona of a metal artist and therefore not worth answering? I hope so, but if not let me know. I want one of the new glock .357s to take out that pesky streetlight.

I own a 45 and a single-shot….I am slave to 5 cats…I cycle..I never have driven.

The aura combined of artistic form and content that is metaphorically relevant in a wrenching evocation of the sickness and desires of the current time, if present intelligently, can form the basis for powerful metal. Do these ideas “strike a chord” with any of your own?

I think we are a highly intelligent form of music…..we present to the listener what one may or may not want to face.Look…if you have shit lyrics…I don’t care how great the music is…..I won’t give you a second thought.

Do you have plans to write a book?

Yes……I have poetry,as well as a tell-all in the worx

If i were a gangbanger, anytime I shot someone, I’d say “you’d better hope for reincarnation!” Do you think reincarnation is likely, or is it another for the “wishful thinking” file?

I think it is bullshit…..This is MY fucking unique soul..when I die that is it!

Have you heard Burzum, Dead Brain Cells or Absurd?

No….turn me on……

What do you think are the faults of www.anus.com/metal, and why do you think many people hate us?

Because you are too intelligent for most dumbfuck metal-heads…..fuck ‘em…you RULE!!!!

Do you visit any bulletin boards, chat rooms or use an instant messenger?

Oh yes….My s/n is insectbride…..I am a member of Hole’s message board,Distillers,TSOL’s…oh yessssssssss!!!!

Is Saddam Hussein a CIA plant?

Could be…..dunno….I think he is an android.

If you had no limitations and could make any music you would choose, how would your music differ?

Listen to RAPED….I have no limitations!!!!I know what I like.

What makes Arizona for you an attractive place of residence? After I drove through I considered moving, as it had a laid backness to the city.

I hate it…..That is why I am moving to LA,permanently in May!!!!I love the filth,corruption,trashedout ways of big cities…I am from Chicago…for fuxsake!!!!

Many thanks for any answers you can do. Some of these questions will be unanswerable, but I have designed them based on your other interview so that you will have fun with them, I hope. I will send you finished copy and we’ll cut any that don’t succeed. Hails and vomits…

..Thanx…I had a great time with your interview…….one of the best I have gotten in a while…..actually, I found ALL answerable!!!! I can rap for hours,Love…….New Nuclear Death/RAPED contact is my Email!!!!

IN DEATH AND CRUELTY….VO/Lori

The Christian concept of a god—the god as the patron of the sick, the god as a spinner of cobwebs, the god as a spirit—is one of the most corrupt concepts that has ever been set up in the world: it probably touches low-water mark in the ebbing evolution of the god-type. God degenerated into the contradiction of life. Instead of being its transfiguration and eternal Yea! In him war is declared on life, on nature, on the will to live! God becomes the formula for every slander upon the “here and now,” and for every lie about the “beyond”! In him nothingness is deified, and the will to nothingness is made holy! . . .

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Antichrist

Interview: David Renteria, Reggio Galang and Necrolover (Bane)

May 23, 2012 –
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We’re all used to “black metal bands from North America” meaning something more hilarious than any hollywood sitcom, but a few bands have stood out over the years in their ability to keep with a task and develop their music according to a personal musical vision. From the sprawling concrete hell of the inland empire, bane shared a few moments with us to talk about their philosophy, music and methods of postmodern survival.

Bane founded right after the first rush of black metal, and you’ve waited out the last five years of stupid shit going on in the genre. What have you learned and how are you approaching your task differently?

Well we never really planned on waiting any time. We released the album when we were ready. I’m not really aware of many stupid things or many things having to do with the genre right now, other than the fact that during the last few years very few of the new or follow up releases from bands that I knew nothing of or admired greatly, have paled in comparison to work prior. It always seems that when we have moot that thought, about what’s going on, we always come to the conclusion that we all are very different people with different taste, for music, philosophy, ideology and instinct, and we are so out of the musical genre, subgenre, sub-subgenre loop. We all seem to live mentally recluse only to come together in a very interestingly creative symposium. DR

I personally didn’t care for the whole blackmetal/deathmetal battles we make brutal music for brutal people with hope to enlighten a few the whole pissing contest is stupid just fucking play brutal music. We didn’t wait on our release really it was all circumstantial, we released it when we were done and happy with the outcome of our album hell we would of released it in the middle of the whole black metal rush we didn’t care.-Necro

What inspires you when looking at a conceptual place to a start the formation of a song, during the songwriting process?

We all seem to draw inspiration through different means. Lyrically we have drawn inspiration through a lot of reading, philosophy, true crime, news, retrospective thought about experiences, social and mental anxiety and relief. Musically we have had moments of pure creative flow as a symposium, and at other times we have gathered the spark of creativity through deep introspection. It’s a really wide variable we all seem to have our own unique way of bringing ideas to the table. Reggie and I at times have shared ideas digitally only to realize that organically the ideas do not work and vice versa. DR

When it comes to creating music we don’t really have a set formula. Everytime we start its from a different angle. On the upside it makes the creating each song exceptional from the rest of the songs. Because we don’t dwell on making status queue music and repeat other formulas it leaves us with more room to play with different ideas. It’s not even a process its more of an explosion [that] we try to piece back together and we find that there is a different solution to the puzzle. As far as writing lyrics, it consumes every topic we can conjure. As far as music goes, that is even more complicated. BANE keeps changing and metamorphosing the ideas all the time. Shit, just when I think its set here comes another change but it always sounds better and keeps me on my toes. I feel that because everyone in BANE is a powerful contributor of ideas from different sides of the spectrum that it leads our music to be more different everytime and it is a growth not a decline. Necro-

Friedrich Nietzsche may/may not have been a racist. How do you feel about this? (I ask as you cited him in an earlier interview, and I always find this question intriguing)

I am of the explorer type, I don’t tend to lend my values to other peoples words, I search for interesting points of views, inspiring points of views I tend not to judge people by their color of creed so much as by their actions and thoughts. I’m not a racist nor do I really care whether Nietzche or Gobineau were. Racism is such a petty thing for people to base hatred upon. Leave the hate for religion…lol… DR

I think when it came to Nietzche’s writings people took the interpretation with what they already had in mind. You get a skinhead to read Nietzche he’ll tell you the superman was the Arian race, you take a dreamer to read the same thing he’ll tell you the superman was comic book hero. People are gonna take what’s already contaminating their heads and interpret Disney flicks metaphorical speaking of the SS Reich 2003. I agree with David that racism is a petty thing to base hate on [as] there are way more justifiable reasons to hate for instance stupidity. Necro-

Friedrich Nietzsche stated that liberalism, Christianity and Judaism were the greatest enemies of humankind. Do you agree?

I think that ignoramus thought(that’s one hell of an oxymoron), is our greatest social enemy, whether it stem from liberalism, christianity or judaism. DR
Ignorance is definitely a killer, but far worse when the truth is in front of you and you fail to see it or you see it, acknowledge it and then deny it. The one thing that’s more threatening to humanity than stupidity is stupidity with out the desire to learn. I don’t know I think bell bottoms are pretty threatening too, along with Mc Donalds food, it’s threatening, and lets not forget the evil and vile vegans; they threaten humanity don’t you think David? Necro-

What angers you the most about the church?

To be completely honest, religion really doesn’t really bother me so much anymore, it’s one of those things that we are just to small to do anything about. Religion to me has become that pesky little mold that clings to your shower tile crevices that you become accustomed to ignore. And when you do decide to muster up some will to scrub your little fanny off in attempt to wipe it all out one square at a time, you realize that it’s just going to come back it better to worry about the mold in your cheese, the little we consume. DR

I can make a list and I don’t want to bother doing it right now cause I may run out of material for lyrics lol. Buy the CD and read it, my answer will be there. I think those of us who seek a higher purpose and make our own paths rather than to serve a master and have the path chosen for you, already know what is disgusting about it and even the servants of the fictional icon know that it’s disgusting they are just afraid. Hell we all know. Necro-

When all emotional responses are done with, what is your logical response to Christianity/Judaism/liberalism/et al?

Like I said……..whatever…… DR

These topics are always gonna be never ending battles with everyone. With BANE, we all seek a higher purpose than the labels you have mentioned which comes to my answer to that which is fuck it those who seek to be awakened will realize that the -ism is just another idea and must seek your own. Necro-

What do you think are the primary differences between Nietzsche and Schopenhauer, and how do you see this affecting the use of these philosophies in the modern time?

Simple…Will to live, vs. will to power, will to create. I definitely take Nietzsche’s point of view in what his perception society should be. Nietzsche’s is more the artists’ philosophy here. In a sense there would be no art if people would not empower themselves to achieve(in full disregard that their achievement will have no real affect on the outcome of what is to become of the universe and/or modern time) rather than survive. I would rather write songs than sit around and make fire or hunt all day. Schopenhauer and Spinoza=platitude. DR

I would definitely be an artist rather than just a regular John Doe. Creators are gods in their own rite. BANE is a gathering of destroyers for a better creation. To always seek for a stronger evolution. Necro-

What kind of person, intellectually or in any other vector, do you see as being drawn to Bane’s music?

Hopefully other explorer types, someone who is looking deeper, or looking to look deeper other musical artists…..but probably just a bunch of aggressive types. DR

I’ve noticed that those who see BANE for the first time or just at face value will be the aggressive type. In our hopes it would be that they seek for more than just face value. The people who are more consistent with BANE are always looking for more depth; these people are few and far between we truly hope to see more of these people. But BANE is a brutal/deathmetal band so its expected to see those engulfed with chaos but it doesn’t mean they can’t be intellectuals. In the end it doesn’t matter we all attend shows, buy CD’s, buy shirts to support the scene, we take everything with it like I’ve said before may we hail a great victory. Necro-

It has been a long road for you guys to get to the first CD release party. What were some of the obstacles, and what are you going to do once the CD is cut, to celebrate?

We haven’t had a release party for our CD’s yet, but we are in the process of arranging one pretty soon. The obstacles we had to encounter were mainly how to finance and mass produce our CD’s for the first pressing. Other personal obstacles within the band(line up changes) we’re dealt with before we began pressing the CD’s. We celebrated as a band the same weekend we’ve received our CD’s. It wasn’t anything big, mainly with acquaintances and close friends. The CD release party show is in the works and we’re contacting bands to play for this occasion. Otherwise, we’ll let ya know how the celebration went afterwards! RG
It has been a long hard road we’ve encountered more bullshit than we expected. The obstacles were many, but I think we learned a lot from it (in a very brutal fashion) but were very happy with the outcome of the CD, the direction of the band, the growth and creativity we have with each other. As far as celebrating I think we’re not done yet lol we still go nuts over it, but think as major celebration we’ll work on the next album.-Necro

Do you think that black metal bands should sing in their native language and have ethnic/cultural associations? e.g. Norwegians singing in Norwegians, Chinese in Chinese, and bands like Melechesh attacking the roots of their own culture?

They can sing whatever they want. It’s none of our business to tell what they can and can’t sing. If they’re more comfortable singing in their own language, so be it. If they’re more comfortable singing certain topics/issue in their own language, then let them do it. Let them express themselves. On the other hand, it’s rather stupid, inexpressive and even hypocritical to label one’s music like “Swedish black metal from Oregon” or “Melodic Norwegian death from Orange County.” It doesn’t work that way but, whatever tickles their pickle…RG

This topic doesn’t interest me what-so-ever. I’m bored. I’ll go to the next question.-Necro

Do you think Zionism and liberalism are inseparable, as Nietzsche does?

I don’t know that’s a tough one, I guess they both involve a lot of expectations from the ruling powers involved. Who knows. DR

Ultimately, there is an order of rank among states of the soul, and the order of rank of problems accords with this. The highest problems repulse everyone mercilessly who dares approach them without being predestined for their solution by the heigh and power of his spirituality. What does it avail when nimble smarties or clumsy solid mechanics and empiricsts push near them, as is common today, trying with their plebeian ambition to enter the “court of courts.” Upon such carpets coarse feet may never step: the primeval law of things takes care of that; the doors remain closed to such obtrusiveness, even if they crash and crush their heads against them.

For every high world one must be born; or to speak more clearly, one must be cultivated for it: a right to philosophy – taking that word in its great sense – one has only by virtue of one’s origins; one’s ancestors, one’s “blood” (Geblüt) decide here, too. Many generations must have labored to prepare the origin of the philosopher; every one of his virtues must have been acquired, nurtured, inherited, and digested singly, and not only the bold, light, delicate gift and course of his thoughts but above all the readiness for great responsibilities, the loftiness of glances that dominate and look down, feeling separated from the crowd and its duties and virtues, the affable protection and defense of whatever is misunderstood, whether it be god or devil, the pleasure and exercise of the great justice, the art of command, the width of the will, the slow eye that rarely admires, rarely looks up, rarely loves

– F.W. Nietzsche, Beyond Good and Evil

Pornography was also something you mentioned in another interview. Do you feel that iconography is dangerous, as Nietzsche did? If so, how do you feel about pornography — which pulls the sex process outside of the lives which normally would generate it — is affecting your own processing of events?

I see nothing wrong with pornography. I think in a sense pornography can be helpful. Pornography gives the facility of a third person perspective, one that may help you realize a spectrum of lovemaking that you had failed to see while in the act, just like how a sports team studies its opponent before a confrontation…well maybe not exactly like that but you know what I mean …right? right? DR

LOL! I think that pornography is great. I would not put anyone down for watching it or being open about it. I believe that people feel threatened by it because they are trained to believe that sex is dirty (if it’s not dirty it’s not done right), but even in a marital point of view why do you think people cheat on each other. Maybe if people were more open about there desires there would be less infidelity, and maybe that’s what’s affecting people’s processing of events. Take it for what its worth.-Necro

Please give brief commentary on the following: Buddhism, fuzzy logic and sine curves; for extra points, unite all three concepts in the analytical method of your choice.

Well…Buddhism a very interesting philosophy, in which aspirations are to be at one with nature, with the universe, based upon “virtuous”(that’s a whole other topic) living, fuzzy logic expresses the need for a sense of between when speaking of the binary world, when speaking of strict two sidedness, and well sine curves are a way of graphing the relativity of the size of an angle to its sine…And with all that said, in a sort of grope like way, I think they all lead access to a more holistic perception of what is truth, a wider spectrum, a wider scope of what reality is or can be, that is, for someone that chooses to or realizes that a wider spectrum of perception is what they want. DR

If you had absolute knowledge, how do you think you would view sex? Pornography? Christianity? The right wing in America?

From a high place. DR

Number one how would I view sex? I’d be having more sex than viewing!

Number two how would I view pornography? Go back to answer number one.

Number three how would I view Christianity? In a fucked up way!

And number four how would I view the right wing in America? Go back to number three.lol!

I know these answers were not what you wanted but I was amused for 2 seconds.-Necro

Do you believe in reincarnation? If you are a materialist like Nietzsche, do you see there being any possible connection between nothingness or infinity, or is the only transcendence possible purely in the ideal, and of a non-“real” nature?

My Idea of what is real and achievable is and infinite goal, a long reach towards potentiality, ascension through what may be nothing really but a quest toward self realization. A goal unattainable maybe but a goal worth aspiring towards. Musically as ideally. DR

Reincarnation is funny to me like recycling souls! What does a person whom believes in reincarnation hope for? A better life the next time around? What counts is what you do here without any speculations of what might be “the after life” I would rather keep my goals in the mind and body for it’s when you can indulge in them. I agree with David that is to aspire constantly and when the goal is met set another one. To always hunger never be satisfied. Nothing wrong with enjoying vanity and the material, I wouldn’t want to be consumed by it but rather keep looking further and deeper even if its antiquated and ugly. To put my ism in a stupid fashion I want to bliss without being ignorant.-Necro

When you hear that a lot of people think something is a good idea, you
a) suspect their motives
b) trust the something
c) scream “FUCKING SHEEP!” and leave the room
d) become wary of larger forces than the individual?

E. Violently moot everything that comes out of their mouths. DR

F. First off trust nothing. Inspect and dissect the something. Watch these sheep revel in this something, as I revel in that sheep aren’t individuals and come back and realize once again that the larger forces are only the status queue mutating with the new generation of the heard and walk against the heard in hopes of figuring out how to kill the something! Necro-

Do you like any of these bands? The Crystal Method, Orbital, Biosphere, Autechre, Kraftwerk, Das Ich?

I apologize for being ignorant and out of sync with the music world outside but who, who and who?!? RG

I know of das ich im ok with this band. Necro-

What black metal bands most influenced your music?

I don’t really see our music being heavily influenced by much black metal, subconsciously, all of our strong racist hate towards the Spanish races stem from the love of Graveland though, j/k I think. Heeheehee DR

I like some black metal but I really cant define them as being any of our influences and lately I feel more influenced by my chaotic life than any other music. Necro-

It seems to me that most of metal is philosophically ignorant, excepting a few leaders. Any comment?

Music seems to be a reflection of what is going on in our environment as well as what’s going on within the ego of the being at bay. Looking to add a few notches to the philosophical spectrum of metal. DR

I hope to influence more people into philosophy, just as I hope to see more metal bands do the same for me. I always keep my search for new wisdom and knowledge hopefully people will see the same in BANE someday. All in all I thank your for challenging us with this interview. May we hail a great victory!

Thank you S R P (the GOAT!)

BANE is:

David Renteria (DR): Guitar
Reggie Galang (RG): Guita
Arturo Cotero: Drums
Necrolover (Necro): Vocals

Bane Homepage

From the start, Christianity was, essentially and fundamentally, the embodiment of disgust and antipathy for life, merely disguised, concealed, got up as the belief in an ‘other’ or a ‘better’ life. Hatred of the ‘world’, the condemnation of the emotions, the fear of beauty and sensuality, a transcendental world invented the better to slander this one, basically a yearning for non-existence, for repose until the ‘sabbath of sabbaths’ – all of this, along with Christianity’s unconditional resolve to acknowledge only moral values, struck me as the most dangerous and sinister of all possible manifestations of a ‘will to decline,’ at the very least a sign of the most profound affliction, fatigue, sullennes, exhaustion, impoverishment of life. For in the face of morality (particularly Christian, unconditional morality), life must constantly and inevitably be in the wrong, because life is something essentially amoral – in the end, crushed beneath the weight of contempt and eternal denial, life must be felt to be undesirable, valueless in itself. Morality itself – might morality not be a ‘will to the denial of life’, a secret instinct of annihilation, a principle of decay, trivialization, slander, the beginning of the end? And hence, the danger to end all dangers?…So then, with this questionable book, my instinct, an affirmation instinct for life, turned against morality and invented a fundamentally opposite doctrine and valuation of life, purely artistic and anti-Christian. What should I call it? As a philologist and man of letters, I baptized it, not without a degree of license – for who konws the true name of the Antichrist?- with the name of a Greek god: I called it the Dionysiac

– F.W. Nietzsche, The Birth of Tragedy